Why Trump’s bid to amplify Muslim reformers will keep Americans safer

a-vendor-in-cairo-sells-newspapers-with-the-arabic-headline-donald-trump-era-on-november-10

by Cynthia Farahat
The Hill

The recent terror attacks in Berlin and Zurich highlight once again the danger that radical Islamism poses to the West. While many are searching for ways to improve security and defeat the threat on the ground, few appear to appreciate that the decisive blow against Islamism can only be administered by leaders in the Middle East.

President-elect Donald Trump pledged during his last major foreign policy speech before the election to “be a friend to all moderate Muslim reformers in the Middle East” and “amplify their voices.”

sisi_egypt_presidentPresident Abdel Fattah el-Sisi and most of the political and media establishment in Egypt warmly embraced this policy. After meeting with the Republican nominee in New YorkCity in September, Sisi told CNN he had “no doubt” Trump would make a strong leader. Sisi was also the first Arab leader to telephone Trump after his election win.

Egyptian affections for Trump are partly fueled by distaste for former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, who many Egyptians believe conspired with the Muslim Brotherhood to help elect Islamist Muhammad Morsi as president in 2012 (after which she was greeted in Egypt with protestors hurling tomatoes).

However, the main attraction of Trump in the eyes of many Egyptians is his staunch anti-Islamism.

Egyptian President Abdel Fattah el-Sisi has called for an Islamic reformation.

Since coming to power in 2013, Sisi has spoken passionately about the need for an Islamic reformation. For Sisi, Islamism isn’t merely a ruinously bad blueprint for modern governance and a chronic source of security threats, it is also a wedge fueling outside hostility to Muslims, both Islamists and non-Islamists alike. In a 2015 New Year’s Day speech at al-Azhar University, the world’s most prestigious seat of Sunni Islamic learning, Sisi warned that the “corpus of [Islamic] texts and ideas that we have sacralized over the years” are “antagonizing the entire world” and “caus[ing] the entire umma [Muslim world] to be a source of anxiety, danger, killing and destruction.”

Not surprisingly, Sisi has faced opposition in the region, especially from Turkey, Qatar, and powerful figures in the Saudi royal family, who have opened their media to Brotherhood operatives to attack Sisi and even call for his assassination. One of the only Arab governments openly backing Sisi’s uncompromising stance on Islamists is the United Arab Emirates (UAE), which in 2014 designated the Muslim Brotherhood as a terrorist organization (along with two of its U.S.-based affiliates, the Council on American-Islamic Relations and the Muslim American Society).

Trump’s campaign expressed “strong support for Egypt’s war on terrorism.”

Within Egypt, Sisi’s calls for a religious revolution have made him extremely popular, but he has faced fierce resistance from Islamists, who still dominate many sectors of Egyptian civil society and exert influence in government, particularly the judiciary.

Sisi’s supporters say the Obama administration’s tolerance of Islamism and harsh criticism of Egypt’s counter-terrorism efforts have been an enormous obstacle. In contrast, Trump’s campaign expressed “strong support for Egypt’s war on terrorism” and pledged that “under a Trump Administration, the United States of America will be a loyal friend, not simply an ally, that Egypt can count on in the days and years ahead.” Walid Phares, a foreign policy advisor for the president-elect, stated in an interview that Trump will work to pass legislation designating the Muslim Brotherhood as a terrorist organization.

Trump’s election appears to have emboldened Sisi to step up his Islamic reformation campaign.

Trump’s election appears to have emboldened Sisi to step up his Islamic reformation campaign. Just days later, Sisi pardoned 82 prisoners, among them Islam Behery, a former TV host and prominent leader of a growing neo-Mu’tazilah-style movement that claims Islamic scriptures are man-made and should not overrule reason and critical thinking.

Behery’s movement has gained sweeping popularity as horrors committed by Al-Qaeda, Islamic State, and other Sunni jihadist groups have mounted in recent years.

Many across the Arab world, and Egyptians in particular, are hopeful that the election of Donald Trump will open a new page of cooperation between the United States and those who are seeking to challenge Islamic extremism in the war of ideas. Only together can we defeat the Islamists wreaking carnage on the streets in the West.

Cynthia Farahat is a fellow at the Middle East Forum and a columnist for the Egyptian daily Al-Maqal.

109 Responses

  1. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ================================
    Jesus in the Vedas
    Sanskrit verses from the Hindu Vedas and their meanings
    ================================

    Not one so called Sanskrit Vedic verses you quoted exist in reality….The Sanskrit verses are completely made up or some are NOT even in Sanskrit.

  2. Ron says:

    Jesus in the Vedas
    Sanskrit verses from the Hindu Vedas and their meanings

    Om Shri brahmaputhraye namaha– what does this mean?
    The only begotten son I worship thee. Who is the only begotten Son? It is the Lord Jesus Christ.

    Om shri Martha Namaha– the Holy Spirit of God I worship thee. (Who is the Holy Spirit of God? Again it is the Lord Jesus Christ.)

    Om shri Kannisuthayeha namaha-which means the Lord who is born to a virgin.

    Om vidyshtayaha Namaha– the Lord who had the circumcision I worship thee.

    Om shri Panchkayika namaha- the Lord who had the five injuries for the sake of mankind.

    Om shri vriksh shula arudayaka nama vrisha pondha marthil shulathil siluthayil baliyanavare, umbaye nan namaskarikunen. Who is the Lord who died on the cross of Calvary? ( All this is our Lord Jesus Christ. Our God is not a dead God. It is true that he came as a messiah to this world. He preached the gospel. He cancelled the devils and the demons. He healed the sick people ad brought salvation to so many people and finally he died on the cross of Calvary, he was buried but he did not become sand.)

    Om Shri mrithyu nayaya namaha meaning the Lord who resurrected from the depths of the Earth on the third day I worship thee”.

  3. Ron says:

    To all who don’t know Christ.

    Wars were always there in every part of the world and will always be there.

    Wars will be there even if UN is there or not there.

    Wars will be there even if all your enemies (Muslims and Christians of the whole world) are somehow taken away. In India, it will be open season Brahmins and the upper castes vs the Dalits and the other local castes.

    Wars may end only when there is a one world government which can happen at the severe loss of personal liberties and loss of freedom of religion.

    Many people have prophesised that it can happen in the future but we never know when.

    The rise of dystopian fictions/books all point in the same direction.

    India was never a utopia before the British and the Muslims conquered it. In fact, it was a land of divided Hindu kingdoms warring against each other. Traveling every 250 kms in India you needed a scroll with seals /permit.
    The feudal and caste system existed and was perpetuated by the upper castes since thousands of years.

    Some of you have been indoctrinated by hate and only love of Jesus can save you.

    Anyways try saying this prayer (you don’t have to admit you said the prayer)

    Oh, God who created me, show me the right path to love,
    Show me the way to worship you,
    Reveal yourself to me so that I can sincerely follow you.
    I believe in the religion of my parents and I am continuing to follow it.
    Oh, my true Creator and My true God come to me in dreams and visions and confirm that I am following your ways and confirm if I am not following your ways.
    Reconfirm that you are my God through third persons and I will then follow your path even if it is the path I least expected.

    Many people have challenged the one true living God and have surprisingly come to the saving grace of Jesus.

  4. Face_The_Truth says:

    http://www.kyroot.com/

    THE LAST SUPPER WAS COPIED FROM MITHRAISM

    Christianity’s principal ritual is the symbolic or literal (Catholicism) eating of Jesus’s body and drinking of Jesus’s blood.

    It mimics a story told in the Gospels of Mark, Matthew, and Luke where Jesus allegedly shared his final meal with his disciples, and during which he commanded them to practice the serving of bread and wine as a remembrance of him.

    Curiously, this story does NOT appear in the Gospel of John.

    The problem for Christianity is that the exact same ritual was already being practiced by the followers of the God, Mithras.

    The following is taken from:

    http://infidels.org/library/modern/paul_carlson/nt_contradictions.html

    The Lord’s supper was not invented by Paul, but was borrowed by him from Mithraism, the mystery religion that existed long before Christianity and was Christianity’s chief competitor up until the time of Constantine.

    In Mithraism, the central figure is the mythical Mithras, who died for the sins of mankind and was resurrected.

    Believers in Mithras were rewarded with eternal life!

    Part of the Mithraic communion liturgy included the words:

    “He who will not eat of my body and drink of my blood, so that he will be made one with me and I with him, the same shall not know salvation.”

    The early Church Fathers Justin Martyr and Tertullian tried to say that Mithraism copied the Lord’s Supper from Christianity, but early Church Fathers were forced to say that demons had copied it since only demons could copy an event in advance of its happening!

    They could not say that the followers of Mithras had copied it — it was a known fact that Mithraism had included the ritual a long time before Jesus was born.

    What probably happened is that in the early days of Christianity, recruitment of new Christians among the followers of Mithras and other pagan gods was difficult, so elements of these pagan faiths were incorporated to make Christianity more marketable.

    But, in so doing, it contaminated the religion with a cloak of forgery that greatly diminished Christianity’s authenticity.

    It is highly likely that the Jesus’s Last Supper never happened — unless Jesus copied it himself as a means of embellishing his credentials.

    Either way, it undermines the credibility of the Christian faith.

    http://www.kyroot.com/

  5. Ron says:

    Over the years there has been several attempts to marginalize the divinity and teachings and salvation message of Jesus Christ.

    Lenin and his Bolsheviks (later continued by Stalin and the Communists) tried to teach that Jesus Christ was the first Communist who wanted to redistribute wealth, free the masses and was non-violent. They never challenged that Jesus existed. Yet they banned the Bible and the church.

    Its almost 100 years since the October revolution and the Communists are out and the largest selling book in Russia is still the Bible. The words of Gospel have now even reached the Russian Arctic for the first time in their own Eskimo language.

    Voltaire said Christ is of no significance and in the 1700’s declared that the Bible will disappear within 20 years. Surprisingly Bible sold more, and infact his own house was bought over by the French Bible society and they started printing Bibles from Voltaire’s house.

    The Mithra story is no where accepted by any historian of repute. It is concocted and its main buyers were anti-Christians, atheists, satanists and Christ and Christian-haters. Ali-Sina’s late friend in Atheism tried the same as you but it did not draw much traction.

    This is what Brittanica Encyclopedia says about Mithra,

    Mithra, also spelled Mithras, Sanskrit Mitra, in ancient Indo-Iranian mythology, the god of light, whose cult spread from India in the east to as far west as Spain, Great Britain, and Germany. (See Mithraism.) The first written mention of the Vedic Mitra dates to 1400 BC. His worship spread to Persia and, after the defeat of the Persians by Alexander the Great, throughout the Hellenic world. In the 3rd and 4th centuries AD, the cult of Mithra, carried and supported by the soldiers of the Roman Empire, was the chief rival to the newly developing religion of Christianity. The Roman emperors Commodus and Julian were initiates of Mithraism, and in 307 Diocletian consecrated a temple on the Danube River to Mithra, “Protector of the Empire.”
    According to myth, Mithra was born, bearing a torch and armed with a knife, beside a sacred stream and under a sacred tree, a child of the earth itself. He soon rode, and later killed, the life-giving cosmic bull, whose blood fertilizes all vegetation. Mithra’s slaying of the bull was a popular subject of Hellenic art and became the prototype for a bull-slaying ritual of fertility in the Mithraic cult.
    As god of light, Mithra was associated with the Greek sun god, Helios, and the Roman Sol Invictus. He is often paired with Anahita, goddess of the fertilizing waters.

    Jesus is the way, the truth and life.

  6. madfijian says:

    Ron i like the way that you end your arguments because in the very statement that you make “Jesus is the way truth and life” you disprove your God. Do you know that that those were the words used top describe Mithra the mythical Roman God. Mithra was also born on the 25th of Dec. Go look at the similarities if you have an open mind. Knowing how Christians think you will find things that will obviously be dissimilar as an exact copy would be too obvious. The similarities though are startling in particular on key area:

    Mithra was born of a virgin on December 25th in a cave, and his birth was attended by shepherds.
    He was considered a great traveling teacher and master.
    He had 12 companions or disciples.
    Mithra’s followers were promised immortality.
    He performed miracles.
    As the “great bull of the Sun,” Mithra sacrificed himself for world peace.
    He was buried in a tomb and after three days rose again.
    His resurrection was celebrated every year.
    He was called “the Good Shepherd” and identified with both the Lamb and the Lion.
    He was considered the “Way, the Truth and the Light,” and the “Logos,” “Redeemer,” “Savior” and “Messiah.”
    His sacred day was Sunday, the “Lord’s Day,” hundreds of years before the appearance of Christ.
    Mithra had his principal festival of what was later to become Easter.
    His religion had a Eucharist or “Lord’s Supper,” at which Mithra said, “He who shall not eat of my body nor drink of my blood so that he may be one with me and I with him, shall not be saved.”
    “His annual sacrifice is the pass over of the Magi, a symbolical atonement or pledge of moral and physical regeneration.”

    No doubt Christian apologists have tried to to dissuade people about the similarities by nitpicking here and their. The fact though is simple Mithra was a pagan Roman God. Christianity started from Rome and the key areas of similarities are too many to be be discounted. If it swims like a duck, quacks like a duck it usually is a duck no matter what one says.

  7. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ===============================
    When gods(Hindu) rape…what happens to society?
    This is a beautiful article written by a Hindu who attributes the rape culture of India to what the Hindu gods do?

    i.e. Hindu gods, deceive, rape, gang-rape, serial rape etc.
    http://www.jaisiyaram.com/blog/religion/18145-when-gods-rape-effect-of-hindu-mythology-on-today-s-society-3-nov-14.html
    =================================

    First of all, this idiot is NO Hindu at all, but a confused atheist cum perhaps a christian in disguise. This fellow is married to a christian European..

    “Today, Balendu is married to Ramona, who became a part of his life in 2007 and has a daughter, Apra, born in 2012.”

    It is clear where his loyalty lies, in his wife’s religion.

    Ron Says:
    ===============================
    The husbands turned to Vishnu, the highest of gods, and asked him for help. Vishnu decided to use Jalandhar’s own methods to defeat him: he assumed Jalandhar’s shape and seduced the demon’s wife. Her loyalty was thus broken and her husband lost all power connected to it. Vishnu could finally kill him.
    ================================

    First, the idiot fellow Balendu moron, does NOT even know the story correctly. It is the Vedic god Indra who killed the demon Jalandhar.

    Second, where does it say Lord Vishnu violated Vrinda? Nowhere it says this. A chaste wife is chastity is gone even if she thinks by thought somebody else as husband or by speech addresses somebody else has husband, much less about physical action. This is what has happened here. The moment she mistook Lord Vishnu in shape of Jalandhar as her husband and greeted other than husband as her husband, she lost her chastity. This is the story in Padma Purana.

    There is no sexual contact of any kind here. This so called Hindu is a christian bastard in disguise. This is why he married a christian woman.

  8. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ================================
    this hindu god is a mermaid.
    If mermaids are myth then by extension this hindu god Vishnu aka Krishna are myths.(i.e false gods)

    https://www.britannica.com/topic/Matsya-Hinduism
    =============================================

    Sorry…..mermaids are creatures that have a body, just as your adultery born jeebus has a body made of matter.

    Vedic God does NOT possess a body made of matter, rather He takes infinite Forms that are all spiritual.

    http://mahabharata-resources.org/harivamsa/hv_1_41.html

    sahasra akShaM sahsra asyaM sahasra bhujam avyayam |
    sahsra shirasaM devaM sahsra karam avyayam ||1-41-3
    sahsra jihvaM bhAsvantaM sahsra mukuTaM prabhum |
    sahsra daM sahsra AdiM sahsra bhujam avyayam ||1-41-4

    The scholars in the Vedic lore describe him as having umpteen numbers of eyes, faces, feet, heads, mouths, tongues, arms and crowns; as eternal, self-effulgent, a giver of umpteen presents… and as an imperishable – avyayam; as well as an immutable – avyayam – entity…

    Ron Says:
    ================================
    Jesus is the way the truth and life
    ===============================

    Bastard jeebus born through adultery is the way to hell, the lies, and death…

  9. Ron says:

    When gods(Hindu) rape…what happens to society?
    This is a beautiful article written by a Hindu who attributes the rape culture of India to what the Hindu gods do?

    i.e. Hindu gods, deceive, rape, gang-rape, serial rape etc.
    http://www.jaisiyaram.com/blog/religion/18145-when-gods-rape-effect-of-hindu-mythology-on-today-s-society-3-nov-14.html

    There once was an evil demon called Jalandhar. He had the power to change his shape and thus could incorporate anybody he wanted. He used this power to meet women, disguised as their husband and thus cheating them into having sex with him! When the men found out and came to fight with him, nobody could ever kill him – he had such big power due to the fact that his wife Vrinda was very loyal. Yes, the loyalty of his wife saved him from the revenge of his rape victims’ husbands.

    The husbands turned to Vishnu, the highest of gods, and asked him for help. Vishnu decided to use Jalandhar’s own methods to defeat him: he assumed Jalandhar’s shape and seduced the demon’s wife. Her loyalty was thus broken and her husband lost all power connected to it. Vishnu could finally kill him.

    Vrinda, angry at Vishnu for cheating her this way, cursed Vishnu and turned him into a stone before jumping into the burning cremation fire of her husband, killing herself.

    She was reborn as Tulsi, a holy plant, and finally the bush Tulsi and the stone Vishnu, which is called Shaligram, married.

    This is the mythological story everybody knows. Let me just point out the four consequences that this fiction had on today’s culture in India which is very obviously shaped with the big influence of religion:
    1) If someone rapes a woman, you can rape his wife. Your god did the same.
    2)Women should be loyal and pure in order to prolong the life of their disloyal, rapist husband.
    3)After the death of her husband, a woman should commit suicide. Sati
    worshipped.
    4)A Rape Victim should marry her Rapist.

    Jesus is the way, the truth and life (Jesus has a clean and sinless life, healed people, gave life and not death, blessed and not cursed enemies, forgave his enemies and loved his enemies)

  10. Ron says:

    this hindu god is a mermaid.
    If mermaids are myth then by extension this hindu god Vishnu aka Krishna are myths.(i.e false gods)

    Jesus is the way the truth and life

    https://www.britannica.com/topic/Matsya-Hinduism

  11. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    =====================================================
    hindu god adovocates prostitution to widows and specially keep the Brahmins (upper caste Hindus) happy with sex. (This is why many in the forum who are upper caste Hindus defend Hinduism) Matsya Purana 71.44-45
    ===============================================

    Ron,

    Here is more clarification. Look at the following verses. Clearly, brAhmins are NOT allowed to even eat food from prostitutes, much less have intercourse with them.

    http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m12/m12a036.htm (Mahabhratha)

    The food provided by a usurer is equivalent to dirt, **while that provided by a woman living by prostitution is equivalent to semen.** The food also provided by persons that tolerate the unchastity of their wives, and by persons that are ruled by their spouses, is forbidden.

    When even food is forbidden, intercourse with a prostitute is considered as complete loss of caste. No sane brAhmin will risk this. Evidence from Manu smriti.

    Manu Smriti: IV

    207. Let him never eat (food given) by intoxicated, angry, or sick (men), nor that in which hair or insects are found, nor what has been touched intentionally with the foot,

    209. Nor food at which a cow has smelt, nor particularly that which has been offered by an invitation to all comers, nor that (given) **by a multitude or by harlots,** nor that which is declared to be had by a learned (man),

    Again, even food is avoided from prostitutes in general, much less sexual intercourse.

    Manu Smriti: XI

    176. A Brahmana who **unintentionally approaches a woman of the Kandala or of (any other) very low caste, who eats (the food of such persons) and accepts (presents from them) becomes an outcast; but (if he does it) intentionally, he becomes their equal.**

    179. **The sin which a twice-born man commits by dallying one night with a Vrishali, he removes in three years, by subsisting on alms and daily muttering (sacred texts).**

    Again notice, that sexual congress with even low-caste women is forbidden for brahmins.

    So why did Indra allow sexual congress for brAhmins here. THIS IS BECAUSE THE WOMEN WERE KSHATRIYA WOMEN, BELONGING TO HIIGH CASTE, who were by circumstances violated and reduced to prostitutes already. Since these were violated Kshatriya women, they were told to accept a brAhmin of their liking as though he was their husband, instead of leading a life of a prostitute. This way they will get out of their sins. FOr absolving their sins, this was allowed, where the Kshatriya woman reduced to prostitute becomes lke a wife for brahmin and the brahmin becomes like a husband for the Kshatriya woman. THIS WAS A PARTICULAR CASE ONLY FOR THESE KSHATRIYA WOMEN. This is not allowed with other low-caste women for brAhmins.

  12. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    =====================================================
    hindu god adovocates prostitution to widows and specially keep the Brahmins (upper caste Hindus) happy with sex. (This is why many in the forum who are upper caste Hindus defend Hinduism)

    Matsya Purana 71.44-45 ”That Brahmana should be well fed and be devoutly looked upon as cupid, for the sake of sexual enjoyment. Each and every desire of that Brahmana should be satisfied by the woman devote. She should, with all heart and soul and with a smile on her face, yield herself up to him.” Tr. Taluqdar of Oudh, Edited by B.D. Basu
    ===============================================

    Ron,

    Here is more clarification. Look at the following verses. Clearly, brAhmins are NOT allowed to even eat food from prostitutes, much less have intercourse with them.

    http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m12/m12a036.htm (Mahabhratha)

    The food provided by a usurer is equivalent to dirt, **while that provided by a woman living by prostitution is equivalent to semen.** The food also provided by persons that tolerate the unchastity of their wives, and by persons that are ruled by their spouses, is forbidden.

    When even food is forbidden, intercourse with a prostitute is considered as complete loss of caste. No sane brAhmin will risk this. Evidence from Manu smriti.

    Manu Smriti: IV

    207. Let him never eat (food given) by intoxicated, angry, or sick (men), nor that in which hair or insects are found, nor what has been touched intentionally with the foot,

    209. Nor food at which a cow has smelt, nor particularly that which has been offered by an invitation to all comers, nor that (given) **by a multitude or by harlots,** nor that which is declared to be had by a learned (man),

    Again, even food is avoided from prostitutes in general, much less sexual intercourse.

    Manu Smriti: XI

    176. A Brahmana who **unintentionally approaches a woman of the Kandala or of (any other) very low caste, who eats (the food of such persons) and accepts (presents from them) becomes an outcast; but (if he does it) intentionally, he becomes their equal.**

    179. **The sin which a twice-born man commits by dallying one night with a Vrishali, he removes in three years, by subsisting on alms and daily muttering (sacred texts).**

    Again notice, that sexual congress with even low-caste women is forbidden for brahmins.

    So why did Indra allow sexual congress for brAhmins here. THIS IS BECAUSE THE WOMEN WERE KSHATRIYA WOMEN, BELONGING TO HIIGH CASTE, who were by circumstances violated and reduced to prostitutes already. Since these were violated Kshatriya women, they were told to accept a brAhmin of their liking as though he was their husband, instead of leading a life of a prostitute. This way they will get out of their sins. FOr absolving their sins, this was allowed, where the Kshatriya woman reduced to prostitute becomes lke a wife for brahmin and the brahmin becomes like a husband for the Kshatriya woman…

  13. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ======================================
    hindus will cherry pick the various ramayanas and mahabaratas and hindu scriptures when confronted with ugly verses.
    But all the versions have many forms of bestiality, immoral sex, murder, homosexuality, incest etc by gods
    =======================================

    Unlike you zombie bastard jeebus worshiping cherry picking scoundrel christians, we do not need to do that.

    We understand the verses and provide evidence for our answers with logic and internal evidence from our own scriptures. For example, we reject certain verses from Tamas (dark hell giving) Puranas which oppose Vedic statements. The classification of Tamas Purana is internal to our own scriptures, ie our own scriptures classify certain Puranas or scriptures as evil or that giving hell. They exist to mislead undeserving souls. So they are not cherry picking like yours Ron, it is driven by guidance from our own scriptures.

    Second, your quote from Matsya Purana is NOT completely rejected by me. I just rejected your wrong, silly and stupid interpretation. Under my interpretation, it is clear. The Brahmin whom the prostitute selects, becomes to her like a husband and to the Brahmin like a wife. For the sake of absolving one of sins, this is permitted.

  14. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    =====================================================
    hindu god adovocates prostitution to widows and specially keep the Brahmins (upper caste Hindus) happy with sex. (This is why many in the forum who are upper caste Hindus defend Hinduism)

    Matsya Purana 71.44-45 ”That Brahmana should be well fed and be devoutly looked upon as cupid, for the sake of sexual enjoyment. Each and every desire of that Brahmana should be satisfied by the woman devote. She should, with all heart and soul and with a smile on her face, yield herself up to him.” Tr. Taluqdar of Oudh, Edited by B.D. Basu
    ===============================================

    I have done some reading and I think I understand the verses here….Now Indra is giving a way out their sinful life for these women who were turned into prostitutes by the events beyond their control by the demons. These are Kshatriya women belonging to the class of Danavas, Rakshasas, Daityas etc. ie demons, not human beings…Even among demons, there are classes as Kshatriyas, Brahamanas etc.

    Instead of leading a life of prostitution entertaining many, they are told to have only ONE person as their customer, namely a person belonging to a Brahmin class, some one like a husband. This one person (a brahmin), as a Brahmin should be worshiped and served as though he is their husband (husband is served as though he is God by worshipping the God within him), and the immanent God within that Brahmin. This way, the will get out of their sinful life. This is the teaching that Indra has given here to get out of their sinful life instead of sleeping with thousands of people.

  15. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    =====================================================
    hindu god adovocates prostitution to widows and specially keep the Brahmins (upper caste Hindus) happy with sex. (This is why many in the forum who are upper caste Hindus defend Hinduism)

    There is a story mentioned in Matsya Purana which tells us how the Devas used to capture women and forced them into prostitution. Can the Hindu digest these verses and show it to others so that everyone may know what Hinduism is really about. The verses are pretty clear and speaks for itself so I won’t be explaining it,

    Matsya Purana 71.26-30 ”Once upon a time thousands and thousands of the demons (Danavas, Asuras, Daityas and Raksasas) were killed in the war between the Devas and the demons. Indra told their numberless widows and those women who were forcibly seized and enjoyed, to lead the life of prostitutes and remain devoted to the kings and the Devas. Indra continued, ‘You should look upon, with equal eye, the kings your masters and on Sudra. All of you will attain prosperity, according to your fate. You should satisfy those who would come to you with adequate sum of money to enjoy your company, even if they be poor. ” Tr. Taluqdar of Oudh, Edited by B.D. Basu

    Indra told the widows of Demons (Non Hindus) how they should lead their prostitution life,
    ===============================================

    Joker Ron,

    Absolutely NOT….

    First of all. let me recall for you, that Matsya Purana is a Tamasa Purana, that which leads to darkness or hell as per Hindu scriptures.

    Second, demons (Danavas, Asuras, Daityas and Raksasas) are NOT even human being, but enemies of Vedic gods, the devatas.

    Third, note that that Indra is talking about the status of “their (belonging to demons) numberless widows and those women who were forcibly seized and enjoyed”…That is these women are already reduced to being prostitutes and raped by Danavas, Asuras, Daityas and Raksasas. There are many prostitutes in western countries who due to circumstances are unable to come out of their prostitution. To such women who cannot change their status of being prostitutes due to various circumstances, Indra said, even if they do prostitution, they can come out of their bad fate even when they are doing prostitution by selflessly giving up their bodies for happiness of others…By changing their mindset, even the prostitutes will attain good end. This is the meaning of Indra’s advice and it is showing mercy to them.

    This does NOT mean the customers of prostitutes are doing right act. Their end is not good as per dharma shastras.

  16. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    =============================
    Mermaids in hindu holy scriptures. (Stop believing in the Hindu gods who married mermaids, multiple wives, bestiality with fish etc
    This mermaid lived in Ganga river.

    Krisna is Arjun’s contemporary driver.
    This Arjuna is going to the underwater kingdom of Ulupi one of his wives and described in Mahabharat. It was during this exile period that Arjuna met Uloopi, the Naga Princess.
    =============================

    STUPID fellow, NAGA princess does NOT mean a mermaid….There is NOT a single scripture in Hinduism which mentions any mermaids. THIS IS ALL WESTERN MYTHOLOGY AND HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HINDUISM.

  17. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    =====================================
    This video shows parallel between Hindu gods and Greek gods (except that the Hindu gods have a longer rapsheet of criminal behaviour and have committed bestiality, necromancy, incest, murder, adultery, fornication, homosexuality, pedophilia, robbery, gangrape, serial rape etc).
    =====================================

    Any idiot can make any video and talk any rubbish. You need to prove from Hindu scriptures.

    Ron Says:
    =====================================
    these hindus worship a penis
    (should be above age 18 please)
    ======================================

    CLEARLY SOME IDIOT MOOSLIME HAS POSTED SOME VIDEO TO DEFAME HINDUS…There is no such thing anywhere in India….Notice in the video the streets are completely empty…where are the Hindus? If its a festival the streets should be full of people….but it is empty…clearly the mooslimes have made a video by making some statue….

  18. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ==============================================
    this rapist hindu god Vishnu is a mermaid (It is time you stop believing in gods with animal heads and fish body)

    The Matsyāṅganā are mermaids found in Asian folklore, specifically in India, Cambodia, Indonesia, Laos, Burma, Singapore, Thailand and Vietnam.
    ==============================================

    Every avatar of Lord Vishnu is spiritual. Every Form Lord Vishnu is absolutely spiritual in nature.

    Harivamsha is an addition to Mahabharatha. Read what is says..

    http://mahabharata-resources.org/harivamsa/hv_1_41.html

    sahasra akShaM sahsra asyaM sahasra bhujam avyayam |
    sahsra shirasaM devaM sahsra karam avyayam ||1-41-3
    sahsra jihvaM bhAsvantaM sahsra mukuTaM prabhum |
    sahsra daM sahsra AdiM sahsra bhujam avyayam ||1-41-4

    The scholars in the Vedic lore describe him as having umpteen numbers of eyes, faces, feet, heads, mouths, tongues, arms and crowns; as eternal, self-effulgent, a giver of umpteen presents… and as an imperishable – avyayam; as well as an immutable – avyayam – entity…

    The words sahasra = 1000 literally = umpteen = infinite…The verse says he is infinite in many aspects or attributes….sahasraksha means 1000 eyed, which means omniscient as eyes.sahasra .similarly every aspect of Lord Vishnu is infinite in nature…This is the teaching of Hindu scriptures…He is called as Eternal and imperishable (avyayam)…This is another evidence from Hindu scriptures that all His Forms are absolutely spiritual in nature…

    tasya viShNoH sura-Ishasya shrIvatsA~Nkasya dhimataH ||1-41-10
    prAdurbhAva sahasrANi atItAni na saMshayaH |
    bhUyaH chaiva bhaviShyanti iti evam Aha prajApatiH ||1-41-11

    That intelligent Lord of gods, Vishnu, having the emblem of shrIvatsa-jewel on his breast, **incarnated** himself in thousands of forms, and thousands of his **incarnations** shall take place in future, so said brahma.

    The word prAdurbhAva is wrongly translated as **incarnated**, while actual meaning is manifested..

    http://spokensanskrit.de/index.php?beginning=0+&tinput=pradurbhava&trans=Translate

    प्रादुर्भाव prAdurbhAva m. manifestation
    प्रादुर्भाव prAdurbhAva m. appearance
    प्रादुर्भाव prAdurbhAva m. becoming visible or audible

    भूय bhUya n. becoming
    भूय bhUya n. being

    This is enough proof that unlike mamzer jeebus born through adultery, Lord Vishnu appears as He Is, in absolutely spiritual Forms. Every Form, attribute of Lord Vishnu is identical to Himself and infinite in nature. So your idiotic strawman accusation are rejected as that of a mental retard who fworships another suicidal mental retard born through adultery, namely mamzer jeebus.

  19. Ron says:

    hindus will cherry pick the various ramayanas and mahabaratas and hindu scriptures when confronted with ugly verses.
    But all the versions have many forms of bestiality, immoral sex, murder, homosexuality, incest etc by gods

  20. Ron says:

    hindu god adovocates prostitution to widows and specially keep the Brahmins (upper caste Hindus) happy with sex. (This is why many in the forum who are upper caste Hindus defend Hinduism)

    There is a story mentioned in Matsya Purana which tells us how the Devas used to capture women and forced them into prostitution. Can the Hindu digest these verses and show it to others so that everyone may know what Hinduism is really about. The verses are pretty clear and speaks for itself so I won’t be explaining it,

    Matsya Purana 71.26-30 ”Once upon a time thousands and thousands of the demons (Danavas, Asuras, Daityas and Raksasas) were killed in the war between the Devas and the demons. Indra told their numberless widows and those women who were forcibly seized and enjoyed, to lead the life of prostitutes and remain devoted to the kings and the Devas. Indra continued, ‘You should look upon, with equal eye, the kings your masters and on Sudra. All of you will attain prosperity, according to your fate. You should satisfy those who would come to you with adequate sum of money to enjoy your company, even if they be poor. ” Tr. Taluqdar of Oudh, Edited by B.D. Basu

    Indra told the widows of Demons (Non Hindus) how they should lead their prostitution life,

    Matsya Purana 71.44-45 ”That Brahmana should be well fed and be devoutly looked upon as cupid, for the sake of sexual enjoyment. Each and every desire of that Brahmana should be satisfied by the woman devote. She should, with all heart and soul and with a smile on her face, yield herself up to him.” Tr. Taluqdar of Oudh, Edited by B.D. Basu

  21. Ron says:

    Mermaids in hindu holy scriptures. (Stop believing in the Hindu gods who married mermaids, multiple wives, bestiality with fish etc
    This mermaid lived in Ganga river.

    Krisna is Arjun’s contemporary driver.
    This Arjuna is going to the underwater kingdom of Ulupi one of his wives and described in Mahabharat. It was during this exile period that Arjuna met Uloopi, the Naga Princess. Ulupi was impressed by Arjuna and took him to under water world. Here she convinced Arjuna to marry her. A son named Iravan was born to them. Ulupi also gave the boon to Arjuna that all animals live in the water will obey him and he will be invincible under the water. This kingdom was situated in Ganga. Years after when Pandavas performed the Ashvamedha sacrifice, the sacrificial horse was stopped by Babruvahan when it entered his territory. Babruvahan was taught the art of warfare of Ulupi. Babruvahan was not aware that Arjuna was his father ( Babhruvahana He is one of the sons of Arjuna, begotten through Chitrangada, the princess of Manipura, during the period of his exile at Manipura. ) and he fought the army led by Arjuna which was following the sacrificial horse. During the course of the battle, Babruvahan’s arrow hit Arjun and he fell unconscious. Uloopi who came to know about the incident rushed to the spot and saved the life of Arjuna using the knowledge only available to the Nagas. Later Uloopi united the father and son – Babruvahan and Arjuna. The above incident is connected to yet another legend – it is said that Ganga Devi cursed Arjuna that he will be killed by his son as he had treacherously killed Bhishma in the battle of Kurukshetra by placing Shikandi (Eunuch) as a shield. Ulupi who came to know about this curse prayed to Goddess Ganga for forgiveness. Ganga Devi told Ulupi that Babruvahan will kill Arjuna but she will be able to bring him back to life with the help of Mritasanjivani. When the Pandavas started their final journey, Uloopi is said to have to returned to the under water kingdom in the Ganga River.

  22. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    =================================
    This Hindu god Hanuman married a mermaid. (It is time you stop believing in gods with animal heads and criminal records)

    Story of Lord Hanuman and Suvannamaccha, the golden mermaid or golden fish. Suvarnamatsya is the equivalent word in Sanskrit. **The story of Suvarnamatsya is not found in Valmiki Ramayana.** It appears in the Cambodian and Thai versions of Ramayana. Suvarnamatsya was a daughter of Ravana. She was half fish and half human in her body.
    ================================

    Now Ron HAS BECOME REAL DESPERATE, ANGRY AND CONFUSED……Your post is strawman…

    Ron, your own quote says **The story of Suvarnamatsya is not found in Valmiki Ramayana.**….It is Valmiki Ramayana which is the sacred scripture of Hindus. No other Ramayana is accepted as a Hindu scripture by any Vedantic school in India. The cambodian and Thai versions of Ramayana are written by Cambodian and Thai people. These are fake apocryphals..

  23. Ron says:

    these hindus worship a penis
    (should be above age 18 please)

  24. Ron says:

    We all know that Greek gods/goddesses mythology is false and we know that they are not real gods.
    Same is with Hindu gods. (It is false so it is called mythology by everyone) but due to indoctrination from birth they have lost the sense to discern the truth or reason the facts

    This video shows parallel between Hindu gods and Greek gods (except that the Hindu gods have a longer rapsheet of criminal behaviour and have committed bestiality, necromancy, incest, murder, adultery, fornication, homosexuality, pedophilia, robbery, gangrape, serial rape etc).

    Jesus is the way, the truth and life (He never sinned. He just gave love, peace, salvation and forgave and blessed those who hurt him also)

  25. Ron says:

    this rapist hindu god Vishnu is a mermaid (It is time you stop believing in gods with animal heads and fish body)

    The Matsyāṅganā are mermaids found in Asian folklore, specifically in India, Cambodia, Indonesia, Laos, Burma, Singapore, Thailand and Vietnam. They are also considered by many to be the first mermaids in ancient folklore. In the context of Hinduism, the mermaid Matsya, meaning “fish” in Sanskrit, is one of the first avatars of the Hindu god, Vishnu.

    Read more: http://ppcorn.com/us/2016/01/05/top-6-things-you-didnt-know-about-mermaids/#ixzz4VDss11tB

  26. Ron says:

    This Hindu god Hanuman married a mermaid. (It is time you stop believing in gods with animal heads and criminal records)

    Story of Lord Hanuman and Suvannamaccha, the golden mermaid or golden fish. Suvarnamatsya is the equivalent word in Sanskrit. The story of Suvarnamatsya is not found in Valmiki Ramayana. It appears in the Cambodian and Thai versions of Ramayana. Suvarnamatsya was a daughter of Ravana. She was half fish and half human in her body.

    In the Yuddhakanda of Ramayana, the episode of building a bridge (Setu Bandhan) is available. Sita was kidnapped and was held captive by Ravana. Preparations started for the battle Ravana and Srirama. Hanuman advised Lord Rama to build a bridge to Lanka from India. Sree Ram gave orders for the construction of the bridge. All the monkeys under the leadership of Hanuman earnestly began work. They threw huge rocks into the sea to make a foundation for the causeway. The work progressed rapidly. After a few days, they noticed that there was something wrong. The volunteers reported to Hanuman that each day they threw huge rocks into the sea and the next day those were disappearing.

    Anjaneya collected a few volunteers and marched into the waves while others continued to throw rocks into the sea. Hanuman found a large number of mermaids (matsyakanyas) underwater. As he watched he could understand that as soon as a new rock was tossed in, the mermaids took the rock and carried it away. Hanuman searched for their leader. He spotted a lovely mermaid who was supervising the others. He swam towards her, but she skillfully evaded him. Again and again he tried, but his attempts failed.

  27. Face_The_Truth says:

    This message is for screen-name Jesus_Christ:

    DO NOT WRITE YOUR OBNOXIOUS COMMENTS ANYMORE.

    I — AS ONE POST-WRITER HERE — DO NOT WORSHIP A SON OF A JEWISH WHORE AND MY PARENTS (OR MY ANCESTORS) DID NOT WORSHIP A SON OF A JEWISH WHORE EITHER.

    IF YOU LIKE (OR PREFER) WORSHIPPING YOUR FICTITIOUS JESUS F**KING CHRIST, THAT’S YOUR PERSONAL CHOICE.

    BUT, DO NOT TRY TO IMPOSE YOUR PERSONAL PREFERENCES TO UNKNOWN PEOPLE.

    YOUR JESUS F**KING CHRIST WAS NO “SON OF GOD”.

    AND, YOUR JESUS F**KING CHRIST WAS CERTAINLY NOT BHAGWAN SHRI KRISHNA.

  28. Jesus Christ says:

    @To all my child

    There is no compulsion to believe in me to reach the kingdom of God. If you believe in humanity, compassion, forgiveness, love to all even with the people who harms you, gate of heaven open for him/her.

    Dear Ron

    Your heart is filled with hate. You are not true believer in me. I never abused and thought ill even about the people who had harmed of me.

  29. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ==============================================
    Jesus was God in the flesh (John 1:1, 14) so when people saw Him, they were seeing God. However, this is different than seeing God with all His glory and holiness displayed. People have seen visions of God, images of God, and appearances of God, but no one has ever seen God in all His fullness (Exodus 33:20).
    ================================================

    What kind of god will appear with destructible human body? only a powerless creature…Having body means having limitations, you have eat, drink, eat, piss, defecate etc….In addition, this demon mamzer jeebus was born through adultery, and had 9 months of gestation period…Now what kind of almighty God will undergo all these pain and suffering? All these show that mamzer jeebus is NOT almighty God, but a demonic, filthy sinful creature born through sinful adultery of his adulterous mother.

    Ron Says:
    ==============================================
    In our fallen human condition, if God were to fully reveal Himself to us, we would be consumed and destroyed. Therefore, God veils Himself and appears in forms in which we can “see” Him.
    =================================================

    Seeing real God in all His might should destroy all sins, end all suffering, give knowledge and bliss (at the least eventually if not instantaneously) and reward immortality, not kill him/her and punish him with instantaneous death sentence.

    Since your own bible clearly shows the opposite, it is clear that bible god is a demonic entity whose vision gives instantaneous death and destruction. ONLY DEMONS ARE CAPABLE OF THIS.

    Ron Says:
    ==============================================
    You cannot equate Hindu gods with Jesus.
    ==============================================

    Definitely I will never do the blasphemy of equating a bastard like mamzer jeebus, born through an adulterous woman, to the glorious Vedic God or glorious Vedic gods (devatas).

  30. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ==============================================
    The Bible tells us that no one has ever seen God (John 1:18) except the Lord Jesus Christ. In Exodus 33:20, God declares, “You cannot see my face, for no one may see me and live.” …….
    ==============================================

    Why? would your demon god kill the man who sees him? looks like your demon god is too ashamed and afraid of himself being seen.

    On the other hand, vision of Vedic God or Vedic gods gives lots of happiness here and here-after as per Hindu scriptures.

    The Second Mundaka: Second Khanda,

    Mantra No. 8:

    The knot of the heart is broken, all doubts are cleared and all actions perish when the Greatest Supreme Being is beheld.

    Mantra No. 9:

    The pure, partless Brahman is encased, as it were, in the great golden sheath (of the intellect). This Pure Being is the Light of lights. It is known by those who have realised the Self.

    See the difference between the results of seeing Pure Vedic God and the biblical demon god.

    Vedic God gives knowledge, intellect, bliss, freedom of karma and all weaknesses of mind etc. here and immortality here-after, after having His vision.

    while the bible demon god simply kills the man who sees him or perhaps the man dies in terror after seeing your bible demon god. Nowhere in the bible it says vision or direct seeing of your bible demon god gives any kind of knowledge or bliss or immortality….all you get is death after seeing your bible demon god. Thanks for proving your bible god is a demonic creature.

    Ron Says:
    ==============================================
    In Genesis 32:30, Jacob saw God appearing as a man; he did not truly see God. Samson’s parents were terrified when they realized they had seen God (Judges 13:22), but they had only seen Him appearing as an angel.
    ===========================================

    In other words, your demon god does appear as an angel, as per your own words. This means he does take forms such as four faced angels…..with animal, bird and even human features…

    Ron Says:
    ==============================================
    Jesus was God in the flesh (John 1:1, 14) so when people saw Him, they were seeing God. However, this is different than seeing God with all His glory and holiness displayed. People have seen visions of God, images of God, and appearances of God, but no one has ever seen God in all His fullness (Exodus 33:20).
    ================================================

    What kind of god will appear with destructible human body? only a powerless creature…Having body means having limitations, you have eat, drink, eat, piss, defecate etc….In addition, this demon mamzer jeebus was born through adultery, and had 9 months of gestation period…Now what kind if almighty God will undergo all these pain and suffering? All these show that mamzer jeebus is NOT almighty God, but a demonic, filthy sinful creature born through sinful adultery of his adulterous mother…

  31. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    You don’t find gods with animal and bird heads. The vision of Ezekiel is of creatures and is symbolic and it is a vision or dream but it is not god.
    ===================================

    Not only creatures but of ur demon god also….If it is creatures, what these were doing in presence of ur demon god?…So if creatures like that are in presence of your demon-god, then these creatures are the angels of your demon god….If angels could have such forms, then according to your claims, these creatures are also demons, so your god commands demons as your god is also a demon…

    http://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/16099/jewish/Chapter-1.htm#showrashi=true

    4. And I saw, and behold, a tempest was coming from the north, a huge cloud and a flaming fire with a brightness around it; and from its midst, it was like the color of the **chashmal** from the midst of the fire.

    Rashi’s commentary:

    it was like the color of the chashmal: “Chashmal” is an angel bearing that name, and he [Ezekiel] saw [something] like the appearance of its color in the midst of the fire. And so did our Sages say: There was an incident involving a child who was expounding on the account of the Chariot. He perceived the meaning of “chashmal,” [whereupon] fire emanated from the chashmal and consumed him. They said further that the word itself is a combination: When they asked, “What is chashmal?” replied Rav Judah, “Living beings (חֶיוֹת) of fire (אֵש) that speak (מִמַלְלוֹת).”

    15 And I saw the living beings, and behold, one wheel [was] on the ground beside the living beings for its four faces.

    Rashi’s commentary:

    for its four faces: of each living being, or the wheel had four faces. Our Rabbis said (Chag. 13b): “This is Sandalphon [the angel], who stands on the ground yet whose head reaches up among the living beings.”

    CLEARLY RASHI SHOWS THAT BIBLICAL DEMON ANGELS HAVE LEGS OF CALF, FOUR FACES, ANIMAL FACES OF OX, LION AND BIRD FACE OF EAGLE…THIS DEMON ANGELS ARE CALLED AS Sandalphon AS PER RASHI…

    Your demon god also appears like Chamshal and other demon angels…

    26 **And above the expanse that was over their heads, like the appearance of a sapphire stone, was the likeness of a throne, and on the likeness of the throne, was a likeness like the ****appearance of a man**** upon it above.**

    27 And I saw like the color of chashmal like the appearance of fire within it round about, from the appearance of his loins and above; and **from the appearance of his loins and below, I saw [a thing] like the appearance of fire, and there was a brightness round about it.**

    28 Like the appearance of the rainbow that is in the cloud on a rainy day, so was the appearance of the brightness round about; **that was the appearance of the likeness of the glory of the Lord, and when I saw, I fell on my face, and I heard a voice speaking.**

    CLEARLY YOUR DEMON gOD ALSO APPEARS LIKE THOSE DEMONIC ANGELS HERE…

  32. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    You will never find in a Jewish Synagogue or in a born-again Church images of God.
    ===================================

    What is born again church? Protestant churches…..Protestantism did not come into existence until 1500 AD. Until then every christian church had grotesque dirty half-naked bearded ugly images of mamzer jeebus nailed to the torture device the cross, in addition to the statues of adulterous mary, mother of mamzer jeebus.

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    You don’t find gods with animal and bird heads. The vision of Ezekiel is of creatures and is symbolic and it is a vision or dream but it is not god.
    ===================================

    Not only creatures but of ur demon god also….If it is creatures, what these were doing in presence of ur demon god?…So if creatures like that are in presence of your demon-god, then these creatures are the angels of your demon god….If angels could have such forms, then according to your claims, these creatures are also demons, so your god commands demons as your god is also a demon…

    http://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/16099/jewish/Chapter-1.htm#showrashi=true

    4. And I saw, and behold, a tempest was coming from the north, a huge cloud and a flaming fire with a brightness around it; and from its midst, it was like the color of the **chashmal** from the midst of the fire.

    Rashi’s commentary:

    it was like the color of the chashmal: “Chashmal” is an angel bearing that name, and he [Ezekiel] saw [something] like the appearance of its color in the midst of the fire. And so did our Sages say: There was an incident involving a child who was expounding on the account of the Chariot. He perceived the meaning of “chashmal,” [whereupon] fire emanated from the chashmal and consumed him. They said further that the word itself is a combination: When they asked, “What is chashmal?” replied Rav Judah, “Living beings (חֶיוֹת) of fire (אֵש) that speak (מִמַלְלוֹת).”

    15 And I saw the living beings, and behold, one wheel [was] on the ground beside the living beings for its four faces.

    Rashi’s commentary:

    for its four faces: of each living being, or the wheel had four faces. Our Rabbis said (Chag. 13b): “This is Sandalphon [the angel], who stands on the ground yet whose head reaches up among the living beings.”

    CLEARLY RASHI SHOWS THAT BIBLICAL DEMON ANGELS HAVE LEGS OF CALF, FOUR FACES, ANIMAL FACES OF OX, LION AND BIRD FACE OF EAGLE…THIS DEMON ANGELS ARE CALLED AS Sandalphon AS PER RASHI…

    Your demon god also appears like Chamshal and other demon angels…

    26 **And above the expanse that was over their heads, like the appearance of a sapphire stone, was the likeness of a throne, and on the likeness of the throne, was a likeness like the ****appearance of a man**** upon it above.**

    27 And I saw like the color of chashmal like the appearance of fire within it round about, from the appearance of…

  33. continuum says:

    RonSays:
    ===================================================
    Literacy rates in accordance to British in India rose from 3.2 per cent in 1881 to 7.2 per cent in 1931 and 12.2 per cent in 1947.[3]
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literacy_in_India
    =================================================

    Do you know anything about history dumb ass Ron? Do you know the timeline of British invasion of India…

    http://www.victorianweb.org/history/empire/india/timeline.html

    1600 The East India Company (EIC) is formed, 1600.
    1615 The company acquires its first territory in Bombay.
    1748 Anglo-French War In India.
    1757 War of Plassey.
    1792 The EIC defeats the Marathas and Tippu Sultan of Mysore.
    1806 10 July: Mutiny at Vellore
    1857 Mutiny of the Indian Army at Barrackpore.
    The Rebellion becomes a War of Independence
    First Indian War of Independence.
    1858 Bahadur Shah Zafar, the Last Mogul, is proclaimed as Emperor.
    The Mutiny is crushed and the Last Mogul Emperor is disposed.
    The Revolt is crushed ruthlessly.
    End of the EIC’s rule in India.
    End of Mogul rule in India.
    British Crown takes over India, beginning of the Raj.
    1869 Mahatma Gandhi born in Porbandar, Gujarat (Oct 2)
    1877 Queen Victoria becomes the Empress of India.
    1885 Indian National Congress is formed.

    By 1881, British have already systematically destroyed all of India’s established institutions…This explains why India had such a low literacy, the reason being christian British scoundrels have already destroyed Hindu educational institutions.

    RonSays:
    ===================================================
    It was the wisdom of Nehru and Gandhi who said that English should be the lingua franca of India when a lot of Hindu fanatics wanted to impose Hindi on the unsuspecting south.
    ===================================================

    Nehru and Gandhi did not achieve anything in India. Their contribution to education is nothing. The present education and literacy rate is due to individual sate government contributions.

    As far as DMK and other Tamil parties are concerned, they are one of the well know corrupt crooks, rapists of Tamil Nadu. Stalin, one of the son of x CM of Tamil Nadu has cases on him, namely attempted raoe against Fathima Babu….Periyar is another lusty scoundrel who married a young woman at age 70. The Tamil idiots do not even know he belongs to Karnataka born in Kannada family. The scoundrel under the payment roll of British scoundrels wanted to divide India and therefore wanted a separate Tamil land carved out of India, when he himself belongs to Kannada community. These people are terrorists and paid mercenaries against Indian government.

  34. continuum says:

    RonSays:
    ===================================================
    You claims about India having high literacy because of Hindu gods before the British is hollow when we read the following Wikipedia article.

    Literacy in India is a key for socio-economic progress,[2] and the Indian literacy rate has grown to 74.04% (2011 figure) from 12% at the end of British rule in 1947.[3][4]
    ==================================================

    Aren’t you one stupid idiot? 1947 is the year India got independence from British and the literacy rate of “12% at the end of British rule in 1947” actually proves my point that British did NOTHIING for the literacy of India.

    Before the arrival of British, the literacy rate of India was very high as my article shows.

    But after the British arrive, the literacy rate in India went down as low as 12% in 200 years or so. It proves that British destroyed Hindu educational system systematically.

    Now after the British has left India in 1947, the literacy rate in India did arise to 74%. Again this proves that it is Indian givernment which achieved this and NOT the scoundrel christian british..

    RonSays:
    ===================================================
    Prior to the British era, education in Indian commenced under the supervision of a guru in traditional schools called gurukuls. The gurukuls were supported by public donation and were one of the earliest forms of public school offices.
    However these Gurukuls catered only to the Upper castes males of the Indian society and the overwhelming masses were denied any formal education.
    ===================================================

    This is pure LIES again…The article proves otherwise…

    d. But the disciplines of Astronomy, Medical Science and technology based disciplines (such as Iron Work, Metallurgy, Ship building, Mechanics, Textile machinery) were dominated by other jatis, notably ‘Shudra’ jati[8].

    10. ‘Institutions of Higher learning’ – Medical Science and Surgery

    a. The data on exact number of colleges that were offering MS degree is not reliably available (One reference puts it at 1500 for Madras Presidency alone [[11]]).

    b. The educators and practitioners of surgery were often of the Shudra jati. Amongst them the Nayi jati was considered to the best by the British. In modern era however Nayis are considered to be marginal barbers[[12]][[13]].

    Only teachings of Veda mantras etc. were limited to Brahmins, while every other field was taught to every other caste..

    RonSays:
    ===================================================
    Literacy rates in accordance to British in India rose from 3.2 per cent in 1881 to 7.2 per cent in 1931 and 12.2 per cent in 1947.[3]
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literacy_in_India
    =================================================

    Do you know anything about history dumb ass Ron? Do you know the timeline of British invasion of India…

    http://www.victorianweb.org/history/empire/india/timeline

  35. Ron says:

    You will never find in a Jewish Synagogue or in a born-again Church images of God.

    You don’t find gods with animal and bird heads. The vision of Ezekiel is of creatures and is symbolic and it is a vision or dream but it is not god.

    The Bible tells us that no one has ever seen God (John 1:18) except the Lord Jesus Christ. In Exodus 33:20, God declares, “You cannot see my face, for no one may see me and live.” These Scriptures seem to contradict other Scriptures which describe various people “seeing” God. For example, Exodus 33:11 describes Moses speaking to God “face to face.” How could Moses speak with God “face to face” if no one can see God’s face and live? In this instance, the phrase “face to face” is a figure of speech indicating they were in very close communion. God and Moses were speaking to each other as if they were two human beings having a close conversation.

    In Genesis 32:30, Jacob saw God appearing as a man; he did not truly see God. Samson’s parents were terrified when they realized they had seen God (Judges 13:22), but they had only seen Him appearing as an angel. Jesus was God in the flesh (John 1:1, 14) so when people saw Him, they were seeing God. So, yes, God can be “seen” and many people have “seen” God. At the same time, no one has ever seen God revealed in all His glory. In our fallen human condition, if God were to fully reveal Himself to us, we would be consumed and destroyed. Therefore, God veils Himself and appears in forms in which we can “see” Him. However, this is different than seeing God with all His glory and holiness displayed. People have seen visions of God, images of God, and appearances of God, but no one has ever seen God in all His fullness (Exodus 33:20).

    You cannot equate Hindu gods with Jesus.

  36. Ron says:

    You claims about India having high literacy because of Hindu gods before the British is hollow when we read the following Wikipedia article.

    Literacy in India is a key for socio-economic progress,[2] and the Indian literacy rate has grown to 74.04% (2011 figure) from 12% at the end of British rule in 1947.[3][4] Although this was a greater than sixfold improvement, the level is well below the world average literacy rate of 84%,[5] and of all nations, India currently has the largest illiterate population.[6] Despite government programmes, India’s literacy rate increased only “sluggishly”,[7] and a 1990 study estimated that it would take until 2060 for India to achieve universal literacy at then-current rate of progress.
    There is a wide gender disparity in the literacy rate in India: effective literacy rates (age 7 and above) in 2011 were 82.14% for men and 65.46% for women.[9]
    The British period
    Prior to the British era, education in Indian commenced under the supervision of a guru in traditional schools called gurukuls. The gurukuls were supported by public donation and were one of the earliest forms of public school offices.
    However these Gurukuls catered only to the Upper castes males of the Indian society and the overwhelming masses were denied any formal education.
    In the colonial era, the gurukul system began to decline as the system promoted by the British began to gradually take over. Between 1881–82 and 1946–47, the number of English primary schools grew from 82,916 to 134,866 and the number of students in English Schools grew from 2,061,541 to 10,525,943.
    Literacy rates in accordance to British in India rose from 3.2 per cent in 1881 to 7.2 per cent in 1931 and 12.2 per cent in 1947.[3]
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literacy_in_India

    It was the wisdom of Nehru and Gandhi who said that English should be the lingua franca of India when a lot of Hindu fanatics wanted to impose Hindi on the unsuspecting south. In the 1950s DMK continued its anti-Hindi policies along with the secessionist demand for Dravidistan. On 28 January 1956, Annadurai along with Periyar and Rajaji signed a resolution passed by the Academy of Tamil Culture endorsing the continuation of English as the official language. If Hindi was imposed you would have found a broken India.
    Indias neighbours (Pakistan, Nepal and Bangladesh dropped English and went for Urdu, Nepali and Bengali)who went for the local languages lost in the global marketplace where English held the sway and will always hold the sway.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Hindi_agitations_of_Tamil_Nadu

  37. continuum says:

    RON,

    Clearly I have proven the following from history.

    1. Under Hinduism, India had the best educational system for every caste. It is the British christian missionaries in government positions like Macaulay who systematically destroyed Hindu religious/secular educational system. India had more lieracy than Britain during its time.

    2. Under Hindism, India was one of the richest nations in the world. Christian British systematically plundered India and destroyed its established industries.

    3. Christian british missionaries have been involved in spreading propaganda, LIES, calumny against Hinduism and modern scoundrel christian missionaries like you have been peddling the same LIES, propaganda and calumny against Hinduism.

    DO NOT THINK THAT HINDUS WILL KEEP QUIET WITHOUT EXPOSING SCOUNDREL MISSIONARIES LIKE YOU. HINDUS WILL EXPOSE THE DEMONIC BASTARD CORPSE WORSHIPING RELIGION OF CHRISTIANITY AS WELL..

  38. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    India has the highest number of humans in slavery
    India has the highest amount of child labor.
    India has the largest amount of poverty in the world.
    ==================================
    continued…

    http://www.preservearticles.com/2012041030164/what-was-the-economic-conditionof-vijayanagar-empire.html

    The prosperity of the Vijayanagar Empire was due to the growth of agriculture, industries, trade and commerce. The state followed a wise irrigation policy. Industries were also encouraged by the state. Commerce was inland, coastal and overseas. Calicut was the most important port on the Malabar Coast.

    The exports from the Vijayanagar Empire were cloth, rice, iron, salt, petrel, sugar and spices. The imports were horses, elephants, pearls, copper, coral, mercury, China silk and velvet. Edoardo Barbosa tells us that South India got its ships built in the Maldive Islands. The art of ship building was well-known.

    The coins of the empire were those of gold, copper and silver. There were emblems of different gods and animals on them. We may conclude by saying that the Vijayanagar Empire “served a high historical purpose by acting as a champion religion and culture against the aggressions of the Muslims in Southern India.”

    VIJAYANAGAR HINDU KINGDOM IS THE PERFECT EXAMPLE OF WHAT HINDUISM CAN DO FOR INDIA. HOWEVER, CHRISTIAN MISSIONARY SCOUNDRELS LIKE YOU HAVE BEEN PEDDLING LIES ABOUT HINDUISM.

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    India is among the bottom ten countries with the highest crime rate (in fact it is no 5)
    India ranks in the bottom quarter of most corrupt countries in the world.
    ===================================

    Most of the politicians are NOT hindus, but atheists, christians etc…..The worst criminal politicians belong to congress party, which is headed and run by an Italian catholic, Sonia Gandhi..The corrruption reached horrible levels under christian congress party.

  39. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    Yet,
    India is the rape capital of the world.
    ===================================

    Pure LIES…

    http://katehon.com/389-top-10-countries-with-highest-rape-crime.html

    Number 1 state is christian USA, the rape capital of the world. Second, is South Africa another christian nation.

    According to the National Crime Records Bureau 24,923 rape cases were reported across India, while Over 400,000 women are sexually assaulted each year in UK, a christian country…. One in 5 women (aged 16 – 59) has experienced some form of sexual violence since the age of 16.

    “Germany is on the number six in the highest rape crime with the figures of 6,507,394 in this year which is really a big figure.”

    Its clear christianity encourages rape more than any other religion.

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    India has the highest number of humans in slavery
    India has the highest amount of child labor.
    India has the largest amount of poverty in the world.
    ==================================

    None of this proves anything regarding Hinduism, as Indian laws are against Hinduism and are NOT as per Hindu laws….

    India was one of the richest nations in the world until British invasion.

    Vijayanagar Kingdom is the example of Hindu Kingdom..

    http://www.preservearticles.com/2012041030164/what-was-the-economic-conditionof-vijayanagar-empire.html

    What was the Economic Conditionof Vijayanagar Empire?

    The Empire of Vijayanagar was very rich. The foreign travellers who visited the Vijayanagar Empire have paid tributes to its wealth and splendour. According to Nicolo Conti, “The circumference of the city (Vijayanagar) is 60 miles; its walls are carried up to the mountains and enclose the valley at their foot, so that its extent is thereby increased. In the city there are estimated to be 99,000 men fit to bear arms.

    The king is more powerful than all the other kings of India.” According to Abdur Razzaq, “The country is so well populated that it is impossible in a reasonable space to convey an idea of it. In the king’s treasury there are chambers with excavations for them, filled

    with molten gold forming one mass. All the inhabitants of the country, whether high or low, even down to the artificers of the Bazar, wore jewels and gift ornaments in their ears and around their necks, arms, wrists and fingers.”

    According to Paes, the king of Vijayanagar had a lot of money. The residents of the city of Vijayanagar carried on trade in precious stones. Things were in plenty and also cheap. Barbosa refers to Vijayanagar as “of great extant, highly populous and the seat of an active commerce in country diamonds, rubies from Pegu, silks of China and Alexandria, and cinnabar, camphor, musk, pepper and sandal from Malabar.”

    The prosperity of the Vijayanagar Empire was due to the growth of agriculture, industries, trade and commerce. The state followed a wise irrigation policy…

  40. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    The British tried to stop the religious slavery system (using Manu Smriti) but faced so much opposition from the Hindu Brahmin and upper caste elite that they decided it is better to concentrate on governance and the spread of the empire.
    ==================================

    On the contrary, it is the British christians who invaded India and wanted to spread their demonic cult of christianity…Brahmins opposed the invaders of their country and NOT vice-versa….Brahmins are not the invaders here you scoundrel. Are you trying to reverse history…It is the British who wanted to spread slavery as invaders…

    http://www.columbia.edu/itc/mealac/pritchett/00generallinks/macaulay/txt_letters_later.html

    To Zachary Macaulay, 12 October 1836

    My dear Father,

    Our English schools are flourishing wonderfully. We find it difficult, indeed at some places impossible, to provide instruction for all who want it. At the single town of Hoogley fourteen hundred boys are learning English. The effect of this education on the Hindoos is prodigious. No Hindoo who has received an English education ever continues to be sincerely attached to his religion. Some continue to profess it as a matter of policy. But many profess themselves pure Deists, and some embrace Christianity. The case with Mahometans is very different. The best-educated Mahometan often continues to be a Mahometan still. The reason is plain. The Hindoo religion is so extravagantly absurd that it is impossible to teach a boy astronomy, geography, natural history, without completely destroying the hold which that religion has on his mind. But the Mahometan religion belongs to a better family. It has very much in common with Christianity; and even where it is most absurd, it is reasonable when compared with Hindooism. It is my firm belief that, if our plans of education are followed up, there will not be a single idolater among the respectable classes in Bengal thirty years hence. And this will be effected without any efforts to proselytise, without the smallest interference with religious liberty, merely by the natural operation of knowledge and reglection. I heartily rejoice in this prospect….

    CLEARLY THE SCOUNDREL CHRISTIAN MACAULAY IS WANTED TO SPREAD HIS DEMONIC CORPSE WORSHIPING RELIGION…

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    India has the highest number of godmen and god women, gurus and holy men in the world.
    ===================================

    THIS IS GOOD.

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    India has the highest number of temples in the world. India has four of five holiest Hindu shrines in the world.
    ====================================

    Temples were built centuries before the british invaded India.

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    Yet,
    India is the rape capital of the world.
    ===================================

    Pure LIES…

    http://katehon

  41. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    This resulted in evil customs of Sati, Thugging (religious robbery by Hindus by waylaying, and killing travellers) and temple prostitution (of young lower caste Hindu girls) aka Devadasi system was stopped by the Christian British despite big protests by the Brahmin and upper caste Hindu elite.
    ====================================

    http://escholarship.org/uc/item/37z853br#page-3

    Peer Reviewed Journal

    Title: THE DEVADASI SYSTEM: Temple Prostitution in India
    Journal Issue: UCLA Women’s Law Journal, 22(1)
    Author: Shingal, Ankur
    Publication Date: 2015
    Permalink: http://escholarship.org/uc/item/37z853br

    I. The Historical Devadasi System

    The historical account of the devadasi system is murky due to its early inception.13 The first confirmed reference to a devadasi was during the Keshari Dynasty in the 6th century A.D. in South India.14 The practice began when one of the great queens of the Dy- nasty decided that in order to honor the gods, certain women who were trained in classical dancing, should be married to the deities.15 The inception of the practice was one that was imbued with great respect as the women whom were chosen to become devadasi were subject to two great honors: first, because they were literally mar- ried to the deity, they were to be treated as if they were the Goddess Lakshmi16 herself, and second, the women were honored because they were considered to be “those great women who [could] control natural human impulses, their five senses and [could] submit themselves completely to God.”17 As they were married to an im- mortal, the women were considered to be auspicious. Their main duties, in addition to committing to a life without marriage, were to take care of a temple and learn classical Indian dances, usually the bharatnatyam, which they would perform at temple rituals.18 Patrons were considered to have higher status for their ability to financially sponsor devadasis.19 The esteemed status of the devadasis began to wane under Is- lamic and British rule. Following their successful invasion of North India,20 Islamic rulers began to destroy Hindu temples throughout the region.21 Once the Hindu temples in the northern part of the subcontinent were destroyed, the devadasis, who were effectively tied to the temples, were left to fend for themselves. With the de- struction of the temples, devadasis lost not only their patronage, but also their status in society, leading to the beginnings of their exploitation.22

    =================================================

    THIS IS ENOUGH EVIDENCE TO REFUTE YOUR CHARGES THAT HINDUISM ALLOWS TEMPLE PROSTITUTION.

    Thugging etc. are NOT from Hindu scriptures at all. Sati is a self-voluntary act, otherwise it is murder.

  42. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    Some on this forum continue to perpetrate the thinking and even claim to know better Sanskrit than Dr Srinivas Bhattacharya who has two PHDs in Sanskrit and Hindu Scriptures from Benares Hindu University who realised the evil in the Hindu gods/religion, had a miraculous encounter with Jesus and got saved as a Christian. These people on the forum who I presume are from the HIndu Brahmin or upper caste elite do not want people to know the truth (ie. evil of Hinduism) .
    =================================

    THE FIRST 20 SECONDS OF THE VIDEO CLEARLY SHOWS your Dr Srinivas Bhattacharya is a fraaud and a con man. You must know basic Sanskrit to realize it.

    Can you or he provide the actual degree certificates online where we can go and check the University degrees conferred from Banaras Hindu University. NO..he cannot provide it as this fellow is a fraudulent christian missionary out to make money from gullible idiots.

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    These Brahmins and upper caste Hindus created these idols which do not answer or communicate but were used to perpetrate belief in gods (demons).
    ===================================

    Says you…..

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    This resulted in evil customs of Sati, Thugging (religious robbery by Hindus by waylaying, and killing travellers) and temple prostitution (of young lower caste Hindu girls) aka Devadasi system was stopped by the Christian British despite big protests by the Brahmin and upper caste Hindu elite.
    ====================================

    I have already clearly proven from peer-reviewed jouranl that Devadasi system was not originally prostitution at all.

    EVIDENCE FROM PEER REVIEWED JOURNAL THAT DEVADASI SYSTEM WAS ORIGINALLY A BENEVOLENT SYSTEM:

    ==============================================
    http://escholarship.org/uc/item/37z853br#page-3

    Peer Reviewed Journal

    Title: THE DEVADASI SYSTEM: Temple Prostitution in India
    Journal Issue: UCLA Women’s Law Journal, 22(1)
    Author: Shingal, Ankur
    Publication Date: 2015
    Permalink: http://escholarship.org/uc/item/37z853br

    I. The Historical Devadasi System

    The historical account of the devadasi system is murky due to its early inception.13 The first confirmed reference to a devadasi was during the Keshari Dynasty in the 6th century A.D. in South India.14 The practice began when one of the great queens of the Dy- nasty decided that in order to honor the gods, certain women who were trained in classical dancing, should be married to the deities.15 The inception of the practice was one that was imbued with great respect as the women whom were chosen to become devadasi were subject to two great honors: first, because they were literally mar- ried to the deity, they were to be treated as if they were the Goddess Lakshmi16 herself, and second, the women were honored because they were considered to be “those great women who [could] control…

  43. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    Also, gods with such animal and bird heads can only be monsters or demons and not gods.
    ===================================

    http://biblehub.com/ezekiel/1.htm

    1 In my thirtieth year, in the fourth month on the fifth day, while I was among the exiles by the Kebar River, the heavens were opened and **I saw visions of God**.

    4 I looked, and I saw a windstorm coming out of the north–an immense cloud with flashing lightning and surrounded by brilliant light. The center of the fire looked like glowing metal,

    5 and in the fire was what looked like four living creatures. In appearance their form was human,

    6 but each of them had four faces and four wings.

    7 Their legs were straight; **their feet were like those of a calf** and gleamed like burnished bronze.

    8 Under their wings on their four sides they had human hands. All four of them had faces and wings,

    10 **Their faces looked like this: Each of the four had the face of a human being**, and on the **right side each had the face of a lion**, and on the **left the face of an ox**; each **also had the face of an eagle**.

    25 Then there came a voice from above the vault over their heads as they stood with lowered wings.

    CLEARLY YOUR DEMONIC BIBLE TALKS ABOUT SUCH CREATURES AS YOUR DEMONIC gOD.

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    The last vestiges of such mythological and demonic mindset still exist in India/Nepal and the Hindus and is perpetrated largely by the Hindu upper castes in India to exert mind, political and status control over other castes in the name of Hinduism.
    ====================================

    YOUR DEMONIC BIBLE gOD does LOOK LIKE part HUMAN, part animal.

    Second, brAhmins provided extensive education to all castes as shown in the article. YOU HAVE BEEN DISPROVED AGAIN WITH HISTORY.

    Ron Says:
    ===================================
    The Hindu Brahmins and upper castes learnt Sanskrit or at least bluffed knowledge of Sanskrit and conferred upon themselves the sole interpreters of Sanskrit and continued this scam (knowingly or unknowingly) because of generational intense indoctrination.
    ===============================

    In order interpret a text in any language, one must be an expert in that language. Do you expect a complete illiterate in that language to interpret the texts for you? Where is the scam you idiot?

    The real scam is the absurdly idiotic christian belief in a god who commits suicide to save his creation from his own judgment…IT IS CHRISTIAITY WHICH IS CLEARLY A SCAM…

  44. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ==================================
    With the conquest of these lands by Christians came the spread of Christianity along with literacy and science and the generally these mythologies were discarded and just disappeared as false as people realised that the sun, moon, river, trees, monkeys, cats, dogs, cows, birds etc. cannot be god.
    ==================================

    CONTINUED…

    c. Stopping printing of Oriental Literature (Vedic texts)

    21. **Lord Macaulay to his father (paraphrased), “When Indian are educated in these convent schools, they will be Indians by body, but by their minds they will be such that, they will know nothing about their own country, their own culture, they will know nothing about their traditions, they will not know their clichés, they will all will be foreigners. And when such children will start taking birth in India, then even when British leave India, English will not leave the country.”**

    22. He was sure that a Hindu who received English education would never remain faithful to his religion and some of them would embrace Christianity and if the British education plan was followed, there would not be a single idolater among the respected classes
    Reference : Macaulay wrote a letter on Oct 12, 1836 to his father, Zachary Macaulay, 12 October 1836

    http://www.columbia.edu/itc/mealac/pritchett/00generallinks/macaulay/txt_letters_later.html

    References

    The Beautiful Tree: Indigenous Indian Education in the Eighteenth Century, by Dharampal, Other India Press, Mapusa 403 507, Goa, India

    W. Adam: Reports on the State of Education in Bengal 1835 and 1838, edited by Anathnath Basu and reprinted, Calcutta, 1941.

    House of Commons Papers, 1831-32, Vol.9.

    Madras Collectors reproduced in Annexures A(i)-(xxx).

    ITS CLEAR BRITISH SYSTEMATICALLY DESTROYED THE HIGHLY ADVANCED INDIAN EDUCATION SYSTEM OF ITS TIME AND REPLACED IT WITH CHRISTIAN EDUCATION IN ORDER TO RULE OVER THEM. HERE IS THE EVIDENCE FROM BRITISH MACAULAY…

    http://www.columbia.edu/itc/mealac/pritchett/00generallinks/macaulay/txt_letters_later.html

    To Zachary Macaulay, 12 October 1836

    My dear Father,

    Our English schools are flourishing wonderfully. We find it difficult, indeed at some places impossible, to provide instruction for all who want it. At the single town of Hoogley fourteen hundred boys are learning English. The effect of this education on the Hindoos is prodigious. No Hindoo who has received an English education ever continues to be sincerely attached to his religion. Some continue to profess it as a matter of policy. But many profess themselves pure Deists, and some embrace Christianity. The case with Mahometans is very different. The best-educated Mahometan often continues to be a Mahometan still. The reason is plain. The Hindoo religion is so extravagantly absurd that it is impossible to teach a boy astronomy, geography, natural history, without completely destroying the hold which that religion has on his…

  45. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ==================================
    With the conquest of these lands by Christians came the spread of Christianity along with literacy and science and the generally these mythologies were discarded and just disappeared as false as people realised that the sun, moon, river, trees, monkeys, cats, dogs, cows, birds etc. cannot be god.
    ==================================

    CONTINUED…

    14. Other textbooks

    a. Chemistry and Metallurgy : Rasendra mangala, Rasarathnakara, Karshaputa, Lohasastra, Kakachandeesvarathanthra, Rasahrudaya thanthra, Rasendra choodamany, Rasprakash sudhakar, Rasaratnakara, Asahrudaya, Rasachintamany, Rasendra Chintamany, Rasamanjari, Bhavaprakasha, Rasakoumudi, Vaseshika darsana gives the structure of compounds and elements as the basic principles

    b. Weapon making : Dhanurveda

    c. Gandharva Veda : fine art of making musical instruments.

    d. Botany : Vrukshayurveda, Bruhat samhita, Sarngadhara’s Vrukshayurveda, Parasara’s Vrukshayurveda

    15. Consequences (work in progress)

    a. The author is of the opinion that, Brahmin education continued Shudra declined, a perception created that Shudras were never educated.

    16. Westernization and Christianization of Indian knowledge and rebranding as western knowledge and dissemination of the same back in India (section work in progress)

    a. Rajiv Malhotra’s U turn theory.

    b. Rhinoplasty traditionally referred to as Nasikasandhana, was called ‘Carpue’s operation’ when introduced in the west by J. C. Carpue. The Indian source of this knowledge was erased. The British ideologists and policies denigrated the Indian education literally erased the knowledge transfer and thus practise of such advanced surgical methods. The credit to the Indian origin of modern plastic surgery happened only in the recent times. Rhinoplasty is a typical example

    c.

    17. The state of finances of the education system (section work in progress)

    a. The government under the kings, funded many universities

    b. The British government continue this till a certain time

    c. Education in these traditional institutions—which were actually kept alive by revenue contributions by the community including illiterate peasants.

    18. Indian Education Act.

    19. The purpose was to create a class of Indian which would be used a new class of Indians who would actively co-operate and collaborate with the rulers.[17]

    20. Highlights of the act:

    a. Diversion of funds from native Education to English Education

    b. Stopping stipends offered to students

    c. Stopping printing of Oriental Literature (Vedic texts)

    21. **Lord Macaulay to his father (paraphrased), “When Indian are educated in these convent schools, they will be Indians by body, but by their minds they will be such that, they will know nothing about their own country, their own culture, they will know nothing about their traditions, they will not know their clichés, they will all will be foreigners. And when such children…

  46. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ==================================
    With the conquest of these lands by Christians came the spread of Christianity along with literacy and science and the generally these mythologies were discarded and just disappeared as false as people realised that the sun, moon, river, trees, monkeys, cats, dogs, cows, birds etc. cannot be god.
    ==================================

    CONTINUED…

    e. In 1890, A.O. Hume, Collector of Madras, issued a notification, making it a legal offence for Paraiyar jati to make temples. Paraiyar today are projected as a caste that was highly oppressed and abused by Brahmins and all this involves a great lot of caste politics and social issues. However some historians believe that it was systematic intervention by the British that resulted in backwardness of the community which were traditionally great architects [9].

    12. Subjects offered in traditional schools, and their textbooks

    a. Most commonly used : Ramayanum, Maha Bharata, Bhagvata

    b. Manufacturing Classes : Nagalingayna-Kutha, Vishvakurma-Poorana, Kumalesherra Kalikamahata

    c. Lighter Literature : Punchatantra, Bhatalapunchavunsate, Punklee-soopooktahuller, Mahantarungenee

    d. Dictionaries and Grammars : Nighantoo, Umara, Subdamumburee, Shubdeemunee-Durpana, Vyacurna, Andradeepeca, Andranamasungraha, etc.

    e. Accounts : both commercial and agricultural

    13. Books used in Punjab (it is not clear which amongst these were used in schools and which were used in colleges)

    a. Grammer : Saraswat, Manorama, Chandrika, Bhashya, Laghu Kaumudi, Paniniya Vyakaran, Kaumudi, Siddhant Kaumudi, Shekar, Prakrita Prakasa

    b. Lexicology : Amar Kosh,Malini Kosh,Halayudh

    c. Poetry, Drama and Religious History : Raghu Vans, Mahabharat, Megh Duta, Venisanhara, Magh, Sakuntala, Kirat Arjun, Naishadha Charita, Ramayan, Mrichhakatika, Sri Mad Bhagwat, Kumara Sambhava

    d. Rhetoric : Kavya Dipik, Kavya Prakash, Sahitya Darpana, Dasu Rupa, Kuvlayanund

    e. Mathematics, Astronomy, Astrology : Siddbant Shiromani, Nil Kanthi, Mahurta Chintamani, Brihat Jatak, Shighra Bodh, Parasariya, Garbh Lagana

    f. Medical Science : Sham Raj, Nighant, Susruta, Sharang Dhar, Charaka, Bhashya Parichehed, Madhava Nidan, Vagbhat

    g. Logic : Nyaya Sutra Vritti, Gada dhari, Vyutpattivad, Tarkalankar, Tark Sangrah, Kari kavali

    h. Vedant : Atma Bodh, Sarirak, Panch Dashi

    i. Law : Manu Smriti, Parasara Smriti, Yagya Valk, Gautama, Mitakshara

    j. Philosophy : Sankhya Tatwa Kaumudi, Patanjali, Sutra Britti Sutra with Bhashya, Sankhya Pravachan Bhashya, Vedanta, Vedantsar, Vaiseshika, Siddhant Mimansa, Sutra with Muktavali Sutra with Bhashya Artha Sangraha a commentary

    k. Prosody : Srut Bodh, Vritta Ratnakar

    l. Prose Literature : Hitopadesa, Vasavadatta, Dasa Kumara Charita

    m. Religion : Rigveda Sanhita (rare), Samaveda, Mantra Bhaga, Yajurveda, Shukla Yajur Chhandasya Archika(very rare), Vajasneyi Sanhite

    14. Other textbooks

    a. Chemistry and Metallurgy :…

  47. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ==================================
    With the conquest of these lands by Christians came the spread of Christianity along with literacy and science and the generally these mythologies were discarded and just disappeared as false as people realised that the sun, moon, river, trees, monkeys, cats, dogs, cows, birds etc. cannot be god.
    ==================================

    CONTINUED…

    f. ‘Cutting of nose’ or “naak kata leyna” has traditionally been considered as a sign of shame in India. There have been numerous cases when a British officer, a high ranking officer, or his sub-ordinate, lost his nose partially or completely during war (with an Indian kingdom), as a sign of shame inflicted on him. Battles between Haider Ali and Colonel Coote being noteworthy examples [[14]]. Sometimes the cut nose was completely burned to avoid being surgically fixed. Even such cases were treated by a complete reconstruction of nose along with nostrils. But it was only possible by an Indian surgeon (or Nayi). Interestingly such surgeons were available at the village level. In current era it is unimaginable to find a surgeon let alone a plastic surgeon in an Indian village. The Indian surgical practises were not only advanced they involved use of anaesthesia [[15]] which was unknown to the west as thus the operation was not barbarous and painful as in the west.

    11. ‘Institutions of Higher learning’ – Architecture

    a. The data on exact number of colleges is not reliably available (One reference puts it at 2200-2300 for Madras Presidency alone. [9])

    b. The architectural principles of Hindu temples in India are described in Shilpa Shastras and Vastu Sastras and civil Construction described in Sthapatya Shastra. There are an extremely large number of voluminous books entirely or partially dedicated to this subject, Agamas being one of them. Architecture. Temples throughout the world (India, Cambodia, and Indonesia) were constructed as per these.

    c. The ancient texts of Parāśara states that all crafts were practiced by anyone irrespective of family’s occupation [[16]].

    d. Paraiyar jati were one of the pioneers educators (acharyas) and experts in the field of temple architecture. Some Examples of

    i. Padmanabhaswamy Temple : Known for 28 pillar balustrades, which can produce musical notes in all four corners when tapped.

    ii. Meenakshi Amman Temple, Madurai : One of the most magnificent temples

    iii. Brihadeshwara Temple, Thanjavur : The world’s largest granite structure. The chief architect and engineer Kunjara Mallan Raja Raja Perumthachan’s mother belong to the Paraiyar jati.

    e. **In 1890, A.O. Hume, Collector of Madras, issued a notification, making it a legal offence for Paraiyar jati to make temples. Paraiyar today are projected as a caste that was highly oppressed and abused by Brahmins and all this involves a great lot of caste politics and social issues. However some historians believe that it was systematic intervention by the…

  48. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ==================================
    With the conquest of these lands by Christians came the spread of Christianity along with literacy and science and the generally these mythologies were discarded and just disappeared as false as people realised that the sun, moon, river, trees, monkeys, cats, dogs, cows, birds etc. cannot be god.
    ==================================

    CONTINUED…

    d. But the disciplines of Astronomy, Medical Science and technology based disciplines (such as Iron Work, Metallurgy, Ship building, Mechanics, Textile machinery) were dominated by other jatis, notably ‘Shudra’ jati[8].

    e. It should also be noted that adherence of a jati to discipline was not rigid. A person of ‘Shudra’ jati, could very well be in a discipline dominated by the ‘Brahman’ jati and vice-versa.

    10. ‘Institutions of Higher learning’ – Medical Science and Surgery

    a. The data on exact number of colleges that were offering MS degree is not reliably available (One reference puts it at 1500 for Madras Presidency alone [[11]]).

    b. The educators and practitioners of surgery were often of the Shudra jati. Amongst them the Nayi jati was considered to the best by the British. In modern era however Nayis are considered to be marginal barbers[[12]][[13]].

    c. The education Ayurveda (Indian traditional medicine) was based on ancient texts such as Charaka Saṃhitā.
    Sutra Sthana (General principles), Nidana Sthana (Pathology), Vimana Sthana (training of a physician, ethics, etc), Sarira Sthana (embryology & anatomy of a human body (with a section on other living beings)), Indriya Sthana (Sensory organ based prognosis), Cikitsa Sthana (Therapeutics), Kalpa Sthana (Pharmaceutics and toxicology), Siddhi Sthana (Success in treatment)

    d. Other text books : Sham Raj, Nighant, Sharang Dhar, Bhashya Parichehed, Madhava Nidan, Vagbhat

    e. The education of surgery was based on ancient texts such as medico–surgical compendium Suśruta Saṃhitā (c. 500 BC), which were written by the ayurvedic physician Sushruta (c. 800 BC) who is considered the father of modern Surgery. It covers anatomy, treating fractures, general surgery, reconstructive plastic surgery, anaesthetics, rhinoplasty, perineal lithotomy, the suturing of wounds, and the extraction of foreign objects etc. The level of detail it covers goes into describing how foetus develops seven layers of skin, naming each layer and the specific diseases which may affect that layer in adult life, which is unimaginable for that era and made possible today only by microscopy, ultrasonography and X–rays.

    f. ‘Cutting of nose’ or “naak kata leyna” has traditionally been considered as a sign of shame in India. There have been numerous cases when a British officer, a high ranking officer, or his sub-ordinate, lost his nose partially or completely during war (with an Indian kingdom), as a sign of shame inflicted on him. Battles between Haider Ali and Colonel Coote being noteworthy examples [[14]]. Sometimes…

  49. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ==================================
    With the conquest of these lands by Christians came the spread of Christianity along with literacy and science and the generally these mythologies were discarded and just disappeared as false as people realised that the sun, moon, river, trees, monkeys, cats, dogs, cows, birds etc. cannot be god.
    ==================================

    CONTINUED…

    d. The method of school teaching was superior and it is this very method which is said to have greatly helped the introduction of popular education in England but which had prevailed in India for centuries.

    e. School attendance, especially in the districts of the Madras Presidency, even in the decayed state of the period 1822-25, was proportionately far higher than the numbers in all variety of schools in England in 1800[[7]].

    f. The conditions under which teaching took place in the Indian schools were less dingy and more natural; and, it was observed, the teachers in the Indian schools were generally more dedicated and sober than in the English versions.

    7. Imparted Education to commons

    a. The term Scheduled caste and Scheduled Tribes did not exists during that era, but were mentioned as ‘other castes’ (also known as ‘pachamas’) in the report[[8]].

    b. 70% of the students (70% in Salem and Tinnevelly to over 84% in South Arcot) were from ‘Shudra’ jati[1] and ‘other castes’. This was the trend for most of country. The lowest was observed in Telgu speaking districts 35%.

    c. Around 20% of the students were of of ‘Brahmin’ and the ‘Vaishya’ jati[1].

    d. In some villages of Bihar, ‘Chandal’ and ‘Dom’ jati accounted for 50% of the students. In Bihar, nowhere did the ‘Brahmin’ and ‘Kayastha’ jati accounted for more than 40% of the total students[[9]]

    8. Home tutoring, and apprenticeship (section work in progress)

    a. This was not covered by the survey other than by a few Collectors.

    b. Girls were mostly home tutored.

    c. Agraharams, or usually at home

    9. ‘Institutions of Higher learning’

    a. The term, ‘Institutions of Higher learning’ was used in the report to indicate colleges.

    b. The exact data on total number of colleges is not reliably available, as many collectors had not reported the required data, but based on the districts that were rigorously surveyed, for every 10 schools, there was one ‘Institute of Higher learning’.[[10]]
    Rajahmundry – 279 colleges – for about 1000 villages, Coimbatore – 173 colleges, Guntoor – 171 colleges, Tanjore – 109 colleges,Nellore – 107 colleges, North Arcot – 69 colleges, Salem – 53 colleges, Chingleput – 51 colleges, Masulipatam – 49 colleges.

    c. The disciplines of Theology, Metaphysics, Ethics, and to a large extent of the study of Law was dominated by ‘Brahman’ jati[8].

    d. But the disciplines of Astronomy, Medical Science and technology based disciplines (such as Iron Work, Metallurgy, Ship building, Mechanics, Textile machinery) were dominated by other jatis, notably…

  50. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ==================================
    With the conquest of these lands by Christians came the spread of Christianity along with literacy and science and the generally these mythologies were discarded and just disappeared as false as people realised that the sun, moon, river, trees, monkeys, cats, dogs, cows, birds etc. cannot be god.
    ==================================

    Do you know anything about history you foolish ignoramus? Do you think only knowledge of English language constitutes literacy and that Science was non-existent before christian invasions? You are a fool…MISSIONARIES ARE SCOUNDRELS AND LIARS…

    India was more literate than the British before colonial invasion. British systematically destroyed India with its policies in every sector from education to business.

    State of Indian Education, before Macaulay’s English Education act, 1835

    The Beautiful Tree, Dr. Dharampal

    1. Official Survey of Indigenous Education in the Madras 1822-26, which was order by the British Government and executed by the district collectors in accordance to the circular sent from the Board of Reve­nue.

    2. Extracts from W. Adam’s State of Education in Bengal: 1835-38

    3. Unofficial survey made by G.W. Leitner in 1882 for Punjab

    The report had been archived in India Office Library & Records (I.O.R.), London and Tamil Nadu State Archives.

    1. The Indian Education system, which was at least a few thousand years old, older than most Abrahamic religions, was completely wiped out in a century during the British Rule.

    4. Sir Thomas Munro, the Governor, observed that the Indian education would certainly have been far ahead during its glorious peak[[2]], during the times the times of Takshila and Nalanda University. Indian education system was already damaged and suffering due to series of invasion and increasing poverty of the population.

    5. As per W. Adam’s report, there was at least one school in every village. He observed that there exist about 1,00,000 village schools in Bengal and Bihar around the 1830s.

    6. Comparison to state of education in Europe and particularly England

    a. The content of studies was better than what was then studied in England.

    b. The economy at which education was imparted impressed British collectors that they suggested it be replicated in Britain[[4]], which indeed did inspire the British education later on.

    c. The duration of study was more prolonged. The collectors (apart from Nellore and Salem) stated that the duration of study varied from a minimum of 5 to about a maximum of 15 years[[5]]. Average schooling year in Britain was 1 year in 1835, and 2 years in 1852.
    For Indian traditional schools typical age of enrolment was 5 years. The duration of schooling hours was also much longer. It started at 6 AM, had one or two short intervals for meals, finishing about at sunset[[6]].

    d. The method of school teaching was superior and it is this very method which is said to have greatly…

  51. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ================================
    All primitive and demonic cultures had idols of god with heads of birds, animals, snakes, or heads of humans but bodies of animals, birds, snakes etc.

    We find this rampant in Greek mythology, Egyptian, Hindu mythology, Mayan, Aboriginal, African (Zulu, Bantu, Masa, Mbuti etc.).
    ================================

    Is this not ironical Ron? Don’t christians have the ugly looking bearded half-naked statues of zombie mamzer jeebus nailed to a cross almost in every damn church around the world? Don’t these churches have demonic grotesque gargoyles everywhere in churches….So do you agree christianity is a primitive and demonic culture? I agree that christianity is a demonic, primitive religion…

    On the other hand, carving of idols shows an advanced culture where art, architecture and other arts are highly developed in that society, unlike the barbaric society which hates art and iconography. WHat did the jews or say mooslimes achieve in art, language, sciences or any other thing for more than 5000 years of Jewish history or first few centuries of Islamic history until they mixed with the unbelievers….The Jews produced worth nothing in history, except recently and except inventing religious rules for sexual slavery, genocide, stoning etc. in the demonic bible.

    While the greek produced so much in terms of architecture, Science etc. 2000 years back. Hindus produced so much sciences in metallurgy (see Ashoka pillar), medicine (Ayurveda), developed worlds first sophisticated grammar (Panini in BC), construction, arts, etc. This shows who was developed culture, the so called idolatrous cultures were more tolerant and more advanced than the demonic, superstitious, primitive bible based cultures.

  52. Ron says:

    All primitive and demonic cultures had idols of god with heads of birds, animals, snakes, or heads of humans but bodies of animals, birds, snakes etc.

    We find this rampant in Greek mythology, Egyptian, Hindu mythology, Mayan, Aboriginal, African (Zulu, Bantu, Masa, Mbuti etc.).

    With the conquest of these lands by Christians came the spread of Christianity along with literacy and science and the generally these mythologies were discarded and just disappeared as false as people realised that the sun, moon, river, trees, monkeys, cats, dogs, cows, birds etc. cannot be god.

    Also, gods with such animal and bird heads can only be monsters or demons and not gods. The last vestiges of such mythological and demonic mindset still exist in India/Nepal and the Hindus and is perpetrated largely by the Hindu upper castes in India to exert mind, political and status control over other castes in the name of Hinduism.

    The Hindu Brahmins and upper castes learnt Sanskrit or at least bluffed knowledge of Sanskrit and conferred upon themselves the sole interpreters of Sanskrit and continued this scam (knowingly or unknowingly) because of generational intense indoctrination.

    Some on this forum continue to perpetrate the thinking and even claim to know better Sanskrit than Dr Srinivas Bhattacharya who has two PHDs in Sanskrit and Hindu Scriptures from Benares Hindu University who realised the evil in the Hindu gods/religion, had a miraculous encounter with Jesus and got saved as a Christian. These people on the forum who I presume are from the HIndu Brahmin or upper caste elite do not want people to know the truth (ie. evil of Hinduism) .

    These Brahmins and upper caste Hindus created these idols which do not answer or communicate but were used to perpetrate belief in gods (demons). This resulted in evil customs of Sati, Thugging (religious robbery by Hindus by waylaying, and killing travellers) and temple prostitution (of young lower caste Hindu girls) aka Devadasi system was stopped by the Christian British despite big protests by the Brahmin and upper caste Hindu elite.
    The British tried to stop the religious slavery system (using Manu Smriti) but faced so much opposition from the Hindu Brahmin and upper caste elite that they decided it is better to concentrate on governance and the spread of the empire.
    That is why you see that
    India has the highest number of godmen and god women, gurus and holy men in the world.
    India has the highest number of temples in the world. India has four of five holiest Hindu shrines in the world.
    Yet,
    India is the rape capital of the world.
    India has the highest number of humans in slavery
    India has the highest amount of child labor.
    India has the largest amount of poverty in the world.
    India is among the bottom ten countries with the highest crime rate (in fact it is no 5)
    India ranks in the bottom quarter of most corrupt countries in the world.

  53. Face_The_Truth says:

    Sanatana Dharma (aka “Hinduism”) was not created or expounded by one individual human being such as by a fictitious “Son of God” or by a criminal-psychopath “Messenger of Allah”; rather Sanatana Dharma says things which are based on many an individual seeker’s perception(s) and experience(s) of the divine!

    Sanatana Dharma (aka “Hinduism”) says that God is everywhere and God is in everything, which automatically includes all humans on earth as well and, as such, it is not the goal of a human being to reach “Heaven” or “Paradise” or any fantasy-land after death; rather the goal of a human being is to realize God within him or herself (i.e., “Atmanam Vidhi” = Know Thyself & Be Free).

    Nobody today says that Ramayana or Maha-Bharata is a pure history book par excellence based on exactly dated historical records!

    However, today nobody needs to dispute that both Ramayana and Maha-Bharata have recordable historical truth in them — without having any chronological date conspicuously inserted in them by the original author(s).

    Problem with historical dating of “Hindu” religious texts is also due to the widescale arsoning of “Hindu” libraries and “Hindu” archives by Muslim invaders during medieval time.

    As a result of widespread arsoning by Muslim invaders, today we have many scattered historical “Hindu” religious texts that lack symmetry from their originations to their end-products.

    For example, we have all heard the word “Vedas”, but we’ve never heard who the human writers of those “Vedas” and in what exact calendar year those human writers were born and died.

    For example, we have all heard the word “Puranas” and “Puranic Gods and Puranic Goddesses” when the word “Purana” literally means too old or too ancient and that raises an important question such as how “old” or how “ancient” those “Puranic Gods and Goddesses” actually are — are they 1000 years old or are they 10,000 years in existence?

    For example, we have all heard the word “Hanuman” who was an ardent devotee of Raja Rama Chandra and Rani Sita Devi, but we are being told by many nefarious anti-“Hinduism” sources that “Hanuman” was a monkey or an ape, which raises an important question whether the word “Hanuman” actually represented creatures of modern science of evolutionary process “that led to the emergence of anatomically modern humans” from earlier primates and, if that is the case, then “Hinduism” must be over 10,000 years old!

    LINK

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_evolution

  54. Face_The_Truth says:

    For further example, we have all heard the word “Smriti” which means memory or memorization and which literally indicates the fact that when those “Smrities” were propagated — if at all — there was no human writing ability and, so, generation after generation “Hindu” people memorized or remembered various acceptable (or unacceptable) doctrines to guide (or misguide) themselves, which also points out the fact that “Smrities” were (and could be) considered outdated for being too ancient or pre-historic.

    Plus, Brihaspati Smriti very specifically says the following:

    Kevalam Shastra-Mashritya Kim Kartavya Vinirnaya
    Yuctihin Vicharena Dharmahani Prajayate.

    Meaning:
    Just because something is in a “religious” book, that something doesn’t automatically become the “Guiding Principle” for all humans and for all human societies for eternity!

  55. Sakat says:

    AH
    Say’s
    /Have you been authorized to have the correct interpretation? To be honest there is no authorized body in Hinduism that claims to have the correct interpretation. It is just another opion./

    Well ,you have not perhaps interpreted my comment properly,seriously!!.
    I said , one cannot interpret Veda’s or Upanishads through intellectual gimmicks .To understand them one has to become Veda’s themselves .The question is how to become Veda ?,very simple ,one has to learn to do meditation properly under the able guidance of an established master.Once a person properly established in meditation the Vedas starts to reveal themselves.The puzzle is are we ready to travel so far …………if not then why the wrong interpretation?

  56. continuum says:

    A.H. Says:
    =================================
    Have you been authorized to have the correct interpretation? To be honest there is no authorized body in Hinduism that claims to have the correct interpretation. It is just another opion.
    ==================================

    Hinduism may not have a central body like your catholic church to say which is right interpretation. But there are one set of Hindu scriptures (vyakarana or grammar for Sanskrit, nirukta or etymology, Phonetics, Brahma Sutras, Brahma Tarka (logic) etc.), which gives the rules of interpretation for other Hindu scriptures (vedas, Puranas etc.). Unlike your stupid religion, Vedic Hinduism comes with strict rules of interpretation based on language, grammar, etymology etc. These are all part of Vedic scriptures (called as Vedangas, ) as a whole.

  57. A.H. says:

    “When you don’t have an iota of knowledge about the holly vedas ,why to contaminate them with wrong interpretation?”

    Have you been authorized to have the correct interpretation? To be honest there is no authorized body in Hinduism that claims to have the correct interpretation. It is just another opion.

  58. A.H. says:

    “Christmas or X-mas is nothing but continuation of Hindu tradition in a different form. Christmas literally means Krishna-Maas or month of Krishna.”

    Holy cow! According to you Chrisianity can be proven even from Hindu Scriptures, but your fellow-countryman with screen-name F*ck the Truth constantly tries to disprove Christianity and Islam from Christian Scriptures. The question is, who is right.

  59. Sakat says:

    Ron
    When you don’t have an iota of knowledge about the holly vedas ,why to contaminate them with wrong interpretation? .Have you read Kathopanishad,No?This is the darling Upanishad of all 118 of them.So be careful while mentioning Veda’s or Upanishads in your comments .You cannot understand them by simply reading or hearing sermon about them.Yada panchavadantistm jzanani manasa sah budhischen vichestati tamahu param gati ( that which your senses cannot comprehend or the intellect cannot assess ,one has to reach that state of mind to realize the supreme existence (or god). I don’t have any qualm against Jesus unlike Mohammed,but to say he is god or the ultimate savior;looks awkward to me and many visitors here.

  60. Jesus Christ aka krishna says:

    @ for All my children

    CHRISTMAS IS KRISHNA MAAS
    1. Christmas or X-mas is nothing but continuation of Hindu tradition in a different form. Christmas literally means Krishna-Maas or month of Krishna.

    The X in X-mas or ‘Dec’ in December refers to number 10. Because if we calculate as per Hindu Calendar which starts in March, December is the 10th month. As per English calendar, December is 12th month and hence number 10 in X or Dec does not make any sense.
    December is root of Dashambar meaning tenth part of sky meaning tenth month of the year.

    Bell, Book and Candle – the major symbols of Christmas are nothing but reminiscent of Hindu temple where bell is a must, book refers to holy book and candle is equivalent of Deepak or light of Yajna. Bell is derived from Sanskrit word “Bal” meaning strength. Bell is used in temples to provide strength to prayers.
    25th December is neither first day of the year, nor 25th December the date of Christ’s birth nor midnight the time of his birth, as admitted by Christian scholars themselves. Then why is Christmas celebrated on 25th December?
    Contribute:
    Because this was time of another famous festival Saturnalia festival which was part of traditions before Christianity was forced upon.

    “The Plain Truth about Christmas” was published by a staunch Christian Organization named Worldwide Church of God. It admitted to these theories and appealed to Christians to stop following non-Christian traditions of Christmas.
    The idols of Mother Mary with baby Christ are no different from those of Yashoda with Krishna. To an unbiased observer, there is no difference in Janamashtmi idols and Christmas depictions of Mother and Child. Even the story has surprising similarities. Jesus was gifted to Mary by God. And Krishna too was gifted by fate to Yashoda!

    THE VATICAN PAPACY
    1. Christianity is derived from Sanskrit term “Krishna Neeti” implying the way of life expounded by Kirishna.

    Pope derives from “PaapaH” meaning remover of or absolver from Sin.
    Vatican derives from “Vatika” which means a hermitage. In Vedic tradition, sages used to live in hermitages.
    Etruscan Museum of Vatican displays several Shivalingas with cobra raising its hood over Shiva’s head.
    Priest and Abbot derive from “Purohit” and “Bhat” respectively, both signifying Vedic priests.

    Deity, devotee, divinity are all derivatives or equivalents of Sanskrit words such as diva, devata and devaniti.
    Pontiff is a corruption of the Sanskrit term ‘puntah’.
    The Pope was the Shankaracharya for the European region of world Hinudom until hisseat was pounced upon and was forced to turn Christian by emperor Constantine, around 312 AD
    Saint obviously is offshoot of ‘Sant’. Apostle is Sanskrit ‘Aap-Sthal’ signifying one who proceeds from place to place (for preaching).
    Several scholars, like H Spencer Lewis, have talked about hidden and secret records in Vatican. If there is indeed anything genuine about Jesus Christ, why it is being hidden?
    Papacy…

  61. Face_The_Truth says:

    This message is for screen-name Lizzie:
    [Evil people will be terminated and decent people belonging to the misguided religions will be reassigned to Christianity. You may scoff at this but I tell you God’s truth with certainty and no matter what you worry about shelve it and have confidence in the Lord God.]

    Your belief in a son of Jewish whore — as your “God” — doesn’t make the Sun move around the Earth.

    You believe in a merely 2000-year-old false religion called “Christianism” and tell non-believers to accept your Jesus F**king Christ, since you believe that the end of Christian days are nearing!

    Because, your Christianism was (is) based on proven lies after proven lies and, thereby, your Christianism is doomed in North America and Europe as more and more Christians are becoming former-Christians in North America and Europe.

    And, so I thank God that, the days of your belief in Jesus F**king Christ are coming to an end eventually!

    Because, your Christian idol Jesus F**king Christ was no “Son of God”, rather was a son of a whore.

    =====================================================================

    William Benjamin Smith, “Ecce Deus: Studies of Primitive
    Christianity”, London, 1912

    l. Gordon Rylands, “Did Jesus Ever Live?”, Watts & Co., London, 1929

    William James Durant, “The Story of Civilization, Part III, Caesar and
    Christ”, Fourth Printing, New York, 1944

    Paul Johnson, “A History of Christianity”, Penguin Books, London, 1978

    Michael Thomas Walter Arnheim, “Is Christianity True?”, London, 1984

    George Albert Wells, “Did Jesus Exist?”, Second Edition, London, 1986

    Daniel Edwin Barker, “Losing Faith in Faith: From Preacher to
    Atheist”, Fourth Printing, Freedom From Religion Foundation, Inc.,
    USA, 2003

    =====================================================================

    LINK

    http://www.kyroot.com/

    LINK

    http://infidels.org/library/modern/keith_parsons/whynotchristian.html

    LINK

    http://markhumphrys.com/christianity.killings.html

    LINK

    http://www.drabruzzi.com/ZINDLER-JESUS.PDF

    LINK

    https://orphicplatonism.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/jesus-christ-an-artifice-for-aggression-by-sita-ram-goel.pdf

    LINK

    http://www.jesusneverexisted.com/

    LINK

    http://www.i4m.com/think/bible/historical_jesus.htm

    =====================================================================

  62. continuum says:

    Lizzie Says:
    ==================================
    Happy New Year to everyone. God be praised there are just three years and five months left until the end.
    ===================================

    Who told you this Lizzie? Is it your mamzer jeebus?

    Lizzie Says:
    ==================================
    On this final day there will be change and upheaval. Evil people will be terminated and decent people belonging to the misguided religions will be reassigned to Christianity.
    ===================================

    Sorry…christianity is falsehood, just as your “end” is your delusion and falsehood.

    A person born through adultery cannot be God….A belief which claims that some god killed himself in order to convince himself to forgive his own creation is absurd and illogical and is clearly falsehood…What is illogical belief cannot be true…

    Lizzie Says:
    ==================================
    You may scoff at this but I tell you God’s truth with certainty and no matter what you worry about shelve it and have confidence in the Lord God.
    So many wonderful blessings for mankind.
    ===========================

    Illogical crustian belief is NOT God’s truth…It is falsehood and EVIL. Bible is as evil and demonic as Quran…Both have genocide of unbelievers, sexual slavery of even little girls (Numbers 31:17-18), looting, raping etc…Evil beliefs springing from evil bible and evil quran cannot be good, much less God’s truth.

  63. Lizzie says:

    Happy New Year to everyone. God be praised there are just three years and five months left until the end.
    On this final day there will be change and upheaval. Evil people will be terminated and decent people belonging to the misguided religions will be reassigned to Christianity.
    You may scoff at this but I tell you God’s truth with certainty and no matter what you worry about shelve it and have confidence in the Lord God.
    So many wonderful blessings for mankind.

  64. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    =====================
    It is true Krishna was a pig!!!
    (See the proof below link)
    =====================

    Your link proves nothing Ron….As I said, all avatara of Lord Vishnu are spiritual in nature, including the varaha avatar. Every Form Lord Vishnu aka Vedic God takes in spiritual in nature.

    Now did mamzer jeebus have a human body born through adultery? yes….you crustian god is a filthy piece is sinful wretch….

    Unlike the degenerative dirty filthy crustian mamzer jeebus, Vedic God’s Forms are absolutely spiritual in nature as shown from Vedic scriptures.

    Ron says:
    =========================
    Then criminals like Brahma, Krishna and Rama who indulged in bestiality, incest, murder, gangrape, serial rape, homosexuality, robbery, voyeurism, lewdness, exhibitionism as documented in their own scriptures.
    ==========================

    Sorry Ron…You have failed to show anything as such….All your claims were disproven with logic…

    On the other hand I have shown clearly from goose-pels that mamzer jeebus was born through adultery, as demon jeebus’ nature is that of filth and garbage.

  65. Ron says:

    It is true Krishna was a pig!!!
    (See the proof below link)

    Now we have Hindus who must have begun worshipping the one true Creator then slowly degenerated into worshipping creations, lowlife forms and dung.
    With evil demonic influences they must have left worshipping the true Creator God and started with the below list
    First after the evil influence they must have started Worship sun, moon, stars,
    Then rain, fire, mountain, river, seas, earth,
    Then ancestors,
    Then criminals like Brahma, Krishna and Rama who indulged in bestiality, incest, murder, gangrape, serial rape, homosexuality, robbery, voyeurism, lewdness, exhibitionism as documented in their own scriptures.
    Then women,
    then vagina and menstrual blood, and penis
    Then cow, cow dung,
    then rat, mice, snakes,
    then tree, stones, money
    then birds,
    then monkeys.
    then pigs

    (I am not sure of the degenerative order of worship but the above list is not exhaustive, there might me more to discover)
    http://www.indian-temples-history.in/2011/07/varaha-avataram-boar-third-avatar-of.html

  66. continuum says:

    Ron says:
    ================================
    The creation can never be the Creator.
    Jesus is the way, the truth and life.
    ================================

    Is human body part of creation? Yes

    According to bible, did mamzer jeebus possess a human body which is destructible? Yes…Therefore, mamzer jeebus is part of creation and hence mamzer jeebus is no creator.

    Did jeebus die as per bible? yes

    Does creator die? NO…as He supercedes creation….Hence mamzer jeebus is no creator…

    Crustians are worshiping creation. hence mamzer jeebus cannot be way or truth or life, when mamzer jeebus himself dies and cannot save his own life…

  67. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ===========================
    Later Krishna committed murder, kidnapping, manslaughter, homosexuality, gang rape, serial rape, had multiple wives but was elevated to be a godman by Hindus. Krishna has a long rapsheet of offences.
    ===========================

    continued…

    http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m05/m05159.htm

    Baffling the nooses of Mura and slaying by his might that Asura, and vanquishing Naraka, the son of the Earth, Hrishikesa, while recovering the begemmed ear-rings (of Aditi), with sixteen thousand girls and various kinds of jewels and gems, obtained that excellent bow called Sarnga.

    CLEARLY THE GIRLS WERE RESCUED FROM THE DEMON. THE GIRLS KNEW KRISHNA’S DIVINE NATURE AND PREFERRED ONLY MARRYING HIM. This is confirmed in Mahabharatha again.

    http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m01/m01068.htm

    And, O king, the portions of the tribe of Apsaras which I have mentioned already, also became incarnate on earth according to Indra’s commands–And sixteen thousand portions of those goddesses became, O king, in this world of men, the wives of Vasudeva.

    Even the 16000 girls are celestial beings, not mere human beings. When the entire story itself is about supernatural beings, His marriage and every activity of Lord Krishna is also about supernatural events. You cannot FOOLISHLY make idiotic accusation here without knowing the context itself.

    Mahabharatha MAKES IT VERY CLEAR, NO SEXUAL LUST IS INVOLVED HERE.

    Ron Says:
    ===========================
    One Hindu told me that Krishna also became a pig and saved the earth (which is sphere) world from drowning in the cosmos sea.
    The creation can never be the Creator.
    ===========================

    It refers to varaha avatar of Lord Vishnu. Every avatar of Lord Vishnu or Vedic God is divine in nature. None of His Forms are material, but are absolutely spiritual or divine in nature. There is no rincarnation here. Just as Narasimha (man-lion Form) appeared out of pillar, Varaha manifested as purely spiritual Form.

    On the other hand, it is you CRUSTIANS WHO BELIEVE THAT CREATOR BECAME A CREATION, by believing in MAMZER JEEBUS WHO POSSESSED A DESTRUCTIBLE HUMAN BODY is God.

    CRUSTIAN gOD MAZER JEEBUS IS PART OF CREATION.

  68. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ===========================
    Later Krishna committed murder, kidnapping, manslaughter, homosexuality, gang rape, serial rape, had multiple wives but was elevated to be a godman by Hindus. Krishna has a long rapsheet of offences.
    ===========================

    You are a fool making claims without any evidence….

    There is no instance of murder or manslaughter anywhere……Killing evil people is the responsibility of a King. As Lord Krishna was a King, He discharged His duty of punishing people.

    There is no instance of homosexuality, gang rape or serial anywhere…this is purely empty LIES….

    Multiple wives do NOT show anything bad about His character. The same Mahabharatha which showed he had multiple wives, also shows He has no material body, but spiritual Body.

    Now you say Hindus made Lord Krishna into a godman. The same story which says Lord Krishna married 16000 women after defeating Naraka, a demon, also says in the same context He is God without any material body. You cannot pick and chose what to believe in the same story. Here is the story of Naraka in Mahabharatha.

    http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m05/m05048.htm

    The Asuras had a city named Pragjyotisha, which was formidable, inaccessible and unbearable. It was there that the mighty Naraka, the son of the Earth, kept the jewelled ear-rings of Aditi, having brought them by force. The very gods, who, fearless of death, assembled together with Sakra at their head were incapable of conquering him. Beholding Kesava’s prowess and might, and weapon that is irresistible, and knowing also the object of his birth, the gods employed him for the destruction of those Asuras. Vasudeva, too, endued with all the divine attributes that ensure success, agreed to undertake that exceedingly difficult task. In the city of Nirmochana that hero slew six thousand Asuras, and cutting into pieces innumerable keen-edged shafts, he slew Mura and hosts of Rakshasas, and then entered that city. It was there, that an encounter took place between the mighty’ Naraka and Vishnu of immeasurable strength. Slain by Krishna, Naraka lay lifeless there, like a Karnikara tree uprooted by the wind. Having slain the Earth’s son, Naraka, and also Mura, and having recovered those jewelled ear-rings, the learned Krishna of unparalleled prowess came back, adorned with beauty and undying fame.

    The entire story of Naraka (a demon, not human) and his killing is the story of war between demons and gods, where Vedic God alias Lord Krishna kills the demon. Notice, how Indra alias Sakra (a god in the form of a god, not human, is present in this story). In fact the Mahabharatha itself is the story of war between asuras (demons born as kauravas in human form) and devatas (gods born as Pandavas in human form). Everything from the birth, acts etc. of Pandavas, Kauravas etc. all are supernatural and beyond normal births. Mahabharatha from start to end is a story of supernatural beings.

    http://www

  69. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ===========================
    The early Hindus started out worshipping the one true God (Creator). They then got distracted due to sins and evil influences and started worshipping the creations.
    They created idols of demons and started worshipping demons (who they think as god).
    ============================

    In the Rig Veda, the very first of the Vedas, the very first hymn praises for Agni (fire). This shows your knowledge of Vedas is zero. It worships Fire, its controlling Vedic god, Agni and also Agni’s immanent controller (Vedic God), all three simultaneously. Your claims are laughable nonsense.

    Ron you are an imbecile. Please do not try to interpret what Vedas teach.

    Ron Says:
    ===========================
    That explains why they worship Krishna (may be a created god, or myth or demon) who started with petty theft as a juvenile (stealing of milk products and its derivatives) which went unchecked and undisciplined.
    ============================

    Wrong….A juvenile is previous stage to adulthood. Here Lord Krishna is in the Form of a child much less than 5 years old.

    Ron Says:
    ===========================
    Krishna then progressed to Voyeurism and had this obssesive compulsory disorder / habit of watching women taking bath in the pond, and robbing their clothes and bartering to give it back only after they show him their nudity.
    ==========================

    wow…..LIAR…….This act was when Lord Krishna was in a Form of a child much less than 5 years old….There is ONLY one such act performed by Lord Krishna in the Form of a Child less than 5 years old. For OCD you need many such acts..

  70. continuum says:

    Ron says:
    ==================================
    ” Om shri Martha Namaha”
    “The Holy Spirit of God I worship thee”
    ==================================

    मर्त means a mortal….not unholy spirit

    Ron says:
    ==================================
    ” Om shri Kannisuthayeha namaha”
    This means “The Lord who is born to a virgin we worship thee”
    ——————————————————————————–

    This is NOT even Sanskrit…Its total bull shit….There is no such word as Kanni in Sanskrit, it is Malayalam, the native language of the fraud Ninan…

    Ron says:
    ==================================
    ” Om vidyshtayaha Namaha”
    The Lord who had the circumcision I worship thee.
    ==================================

    Again no such word in Sanskrit at all…..This is bull shit of Ninan…

    Ron says:
    ==================================
    ” Om shri Panchkayika namaha”
    The Lord who had the five injuries for the sake of mankind we worship thee.
    ——————————————————————————–

    pancha means five
    kAyika means corporeal or performing something with body

    panchakayika can mean a corporeal body made of five elements ….

    has nothing to do with mamzer jeebus nor is there such a mantra anywhere in Vedas…

    Ron says:
    ==================================
    “Om shri vriksh shula arudayaka nama
    vrisha pondha marthil shulathil siluthayil
    baliyanavare,umbaye nan namaskarikunen”
    ===================================

    unholy mamzer jeebus shit…..This is NOT even Sanskrit, but entirely in Tamil language and that too horrible Tamil…

    THIS SHOWS HOW MUCH CRUSTIAN CORPSE WORSHIPERS WILL LIE TO PROVE THEIR MESSED UP RELIGION.

  71. continuum says:

    Ron,

    Yes…there is a reason I do not take neo-Vedantist or new age cultist originators like Vivekananda, Dayanand Saraswato of Arya Samaj, Brahmo samaj etc. Exactly because they twist Vedic scriptures, interpret them in weird ways and write nonsense combining different completely incompatible religions.

    Lets just concentrate in so called mantras you have quoted. Its clear now you have switched your fraudulent claims towards Vedic scriptures. HAVEN’T YOU BECOME DESPERATE TO PROVE FALSEHOOD OF MAMZER JEEBUS…

    YOUR LACK OF SANSKRIT KNOWLEDGE SHOWS THAT SOME SO CALLED MANTRAS ARE NOT EVEN IN SANSKRIT, BUT MADE UP IN TAMIL.

    RON SAYS:
    ===============================
    The Shanti Mantra of the Katha Upanishad reads:

    Om Saha Nau-Avatu |
    Saha Nau Bhunaktu |
    Saha Viiryam Karavaavahai |
    Tejasvi Nau-Adhiitam-Astu Maa Vidvissaavahai |
    Om Shaantih Shaantih Shaantih ||

    Meaning:
    1: Om, May God Protect us Both (the Teacher and the Student),
    2: May God Nourish us Both,
    3: May we Work Together with Energy and Vigour,
    4: May our Study be Enlightening and not give rise to Hostility,
    5: Om, Peace, Peace, Peace.
    ===============================

    THIS MANTRA has nothing to do with the liar, hypocrite mamzer jeebus. It is a sublime prayer to Vedic God, not some low life born through adultery.

    RON SAYS:
    ===============================
    “Om Shri brahmaputhraye namaha”

    What does this mean?
    ===============================

    It literally means son (Putra) of Brahma….Brahma can mean Vedic God or the first being created, also called as BrahmA.

    Son of Brahma (God) refers to the first being created known by the name BrahmA, one who married Saraswati.

    Son of BrahmA (first created being) refers to so many mind born sons, the numbers are so many.

    Now the question is, this in no way refers to mamzer jeebus. Second no such known mantra exists anywhere in any Hindu scripture. The scoundrel christian missionary Ninan created this mantra out of think air..

  72. Ron says:

    This is another Hindu Brahmin who found Jesus in the HIndu Scriptures.

    The early Hindus started out worshipping the one true God (Creator). They then got distracted due to sins and evil influences and started worshipping the creations.
    They created idols of demons and started worshipping demons (who they think as god).

    That explains why they worship Krishna (may be a created god, or myth or demon) who started with petty theft as a juvenile (stealing of milk products and its derivatives) which went unchecked and undisciplined. Krishna then progressed to Voyeurism and had this obssesive compulsory disorder / habit of watching women taking bath in the pond, and robbing their clothes and bartering to give it back only after they show him their nudity.

    Later Krishna committed murder, kidnapping, manslaughter, homosexuality, gang rape, serial rape, had multiple wives but was elevated to be a godman by Hindus. Krishna has a long rapsheet of offences.

    One Hindu told me that Krishna also became a pig and saved the earth (which is sphere) world from drowning in the cosmos sea.
    The creation can never be the Creator.
    Jesus is the way, the truth and life.

  73. Ron says:

    continued from below….
    ——————————————————————————–
    ” Om shri Martha Namaha”
    “The Holy Spirit of God I worship thee”
    Who is the Holy Spirit of God?
    Again it is the Lord Jesus Christ.
    ——————————————————————————–
    ” Om shri Kannisuthayeha namaha”
    This means “The Lord who is born to a virgin we worship thee”
    ——————————————————————————–
    ” Om vidyshtayaha Namaha”
    The Lord who had the circumcision I worship thee.
    ——————————————————————————–
    ” Om shri Panchkayika namaha”
    The Lord who had the five injuries for the sake of mankind we worship thee.
    ——————————————————————————–
    “Om shri vriksh shula arudayaka nama
    vrisha pondha marthil shulathil siluthayil
    baliyanavare,umbaye nan namaskarikunen”
    “The Lord who suffered and died on the wooden Cross, for the sins of the mankind we worship thee”
    Who is the Lord who died on the cross of Calvary ?
    All this is our Lord Jesus Christ. Our God is not a dead God. It is true that he came as a messiah to this world. He preached the gospel. He cancelled the devils and the demons. He healed the sick people and brought salvation to so many people and finally he died on the cross of Calvary , he was buried but he did not become sand.
    ——————————————————————————–
    “Om Shri mrithyu nayaya namaha”
    The Lord who resurrected from the depths of the Earth on the third day
    I worship thee.

    Jesus is the way, the truth and life

  74. Ron says:

    What did Swami Vivekananda say about Jesus Christ?

    From the very first century of A.D. itself ever so many Hindus in India received Christ and Christianity. But the very first Hindu who really knew Jesus was swamy Viveakananda. Throughout the entire literature given by Swamiji, Jesus is adored as God himself. He said “If I adore Jesus, there is only one way for that Worship him as God, not as anything else.”

    (Selections from Swamy Vivekananda – Page 411 chapter – “Isa Messiah”)

    He did not like to see Jesus as a man. Quoting from the Bible, on several occasions, he tries to establish this fact beyond doubt. He said “I will worship Jesus Christ just according to his will.. Not by preparing feast on his birthday but in fasting and prayers.” This example is being followed by the disciples of Swamiji even now. The members of Sri. Ramakrishna Math, all over India , celebrates Christmas Eve and the Christmas day every year, with a camp fire, in prayers and conducting seminars on Christian teachings.

    While teaching his students in Thousand Islands Park ‘Swamiji opened his lecture, reading from the Holy Bible. Gospel of St. John Chapter – 1 “In the beginning was the word, and the word was with God and the word was God” Then he began to preach “Hindus call this as Vanity. Hindus call it as the evolution of God because it is the power of God. The reflection of the Absolute being, through this universe, through the ages, is called Vanity (Nature)..But the most valued imitation of the Absolute, Jesus Christ, is unknown, un attainable, incomprehensible. But the son, we know, we can attain. Only through Jesus we can see the Absolute, the father.

    (Complete works of Swamy Vivekananda- vol. VI page 317)

    Jesus left twelve fisher men in this world. But that small group conquered the empire of Rome !

    (Complete works of Swamy Vivekananda – vol. VI page 422)

    “Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God”. Even if all the books and the prophets perish this verse will endure and care for the whole mankind”

    (Complete works of Swamy Vivekananda – vol.. VI page 424)

    May be inspired by the oneness of the Vedic, Upanishadic verses with the Biblical ones Swami Vivekananda has ascribed Jesus at the highest in the holiest of the holy as the God himself.

    (Kathopanishad – Santhi Patha)

    “Ohm ! Saha navavathu saha nowbhunakthu

    Saha veeryam karavaavahai

    Thejaswi navadheethamasthu

    Maa vidwishaavahai”

    Ohm ! Saanthi !Saanthi! Saanthi!

    Let the Lord almighty save us together, feed us together. Let us try to attain the wisdom of God together. Let the wisdom, we attain, be radiant. Let us not hate each other. Let us have peace in all our spheres of life, divine, material and Spiritual.

    “Om Shri brahmaputhraye namaha”

    What does this mean?

    “Son of God we worship thee”.

    “The only begotten son I worship thee”

    Who is the only begotten Son?

    It is the Lord Jesus Christ.

    ——————————————————————————–

    ” Om shri…

  75. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ==================================
    Dr Srinivas Bhattacharya is a double PHD (gold medallist) in Sanskrit and Hindu Scripture from Benares Hindu University .
    ==================================

    Ron, you are a moorkh (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E0%A4%AE%E0%A5%82%E0%A4%B0%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%96) of first order…

    THIS FELLOW (allegedly Bhattacharya) IS A CON MAN, fraud and a scoundrel…If you know basic Sanskrit you will understand that I am telling truth….

    The first 20 seconds of your audio proves this fact….The idiot claims that a salutation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abhivadaye) told by brAhmins as his “Full Name”….ONLY a FOOL of first order with no knowledge of Sanskrit will claim Abhivadaye is his full name, much less a double PhD in Sanskrit..

    Have you heard a real PhD guy in Sanskrit talk in Sanskrit. The clarity of speech from such a guy will be very high standard, much less need to be told about his intonation etc. This fellow lacks the very basic knowledge of brAhmin practices even, much less about Sanskrit.

    YOU HAVE YET AGAIN PROVEN THAT CRUSTIANS ARE LIARS, FRAUDS, DECEITFUL IDIOTS AND CON MEN OUT TO CON IGNORANT PEOPLE.

    THIS AGAIN PROVES THAT MAMZER JEEBUS WHOM CRUSTIANS WORSHIP (MISSIONARIES IN PARTICULAR) IS A FRAUDULENT DEMON COME TO TAKE SOULS TO ETERNAL HELL. IT IS NO COINCIDENCE THAT MAMZER JEEBUS IS CALLED A SHEPHERD OF SOULS (SHEEP), FOR SHEPHERDS HERDS SHEEP TO SLAUGHTER HOUSES..

  76. Ron says:

    Dr Srinivas Bhattacharya is a double PHD (gold medallist) in Sanskrit and Hindu Scripture from Benares Hindu University . He was felicitated even by the President of India for his academic achievements. He comes from a generational line of Hindu Priests and he himself was a chief priest in a Hindu temple. His brother is the chief priest in Guruvayoor temple in India. He was a RSS youth leader.

    He found similarities between the Biblical scriptures and some verses in Vedas. Some of them are similar to what is quoted by Face the truth. He discovered that “Christ as a sacrifice for sins” is mentioned in the Vedas and quotes those Sanskrit verses.

    He became a Christian underwent tremendous persecution and his testimony and miracles in his life are related here. (Preferably use google/ chrome)

  77. Ron says:

    madfijian,
    You can use the argument of religion and no religion against many countries.

    e.g. India has the highest number of godmen and god women, gurus and holy men in the world.
    India has the highest number of temples in the world. India has four of five holiest Hindu shrines in the world.
    Yet,
    India is the rape capital of the world.
    India has the highest number of humans in slavery
    India has the highest amount of child labour.
    India has the largest amount of poverty in the world.
    India is among the bottom ten countries with the highest crime rate (in fact it is no 5)
    India ranks in the bottom quarter of most corrupt countries in the world.

    So, would you blame Krishna, Rama or Hinduism for it?

    Wonderlist gives a list of 10 countries with the highest crimes (they are USA, India, Brazil, Germany, UK Jamaica, France, Columbia Sweden, Belgium)

    http://www.wonderslist.com/10-countries-with-highest-crime-rate/

    Atheist and Buddhist countries have relatively higher number of suicides and euthanasia rates than other countries.

    Nordic countries may be secular but they are not atheist. The laws of work, rest, bankruptcy, family and inheritance and crime etc. are Christian based.

    I would suggest you guys to visit an Amish colony in Pennsylvania, Ohio or Indiana. You will be surprised at the lowest crime rate in the whole world. 90% church attendance. They help build each others homes and help in each other farms. Of course, they shy away from modern technology, but the love, care and respect for elders and is tremendous.

    Truly atheist countries like erstwhile Albania, Soviet Union, erstwhile Eastern European countries, China under Mao, North Korea, Cambodia have shed enormous amounts of human blood. The human body bag count is more than 100 million in the 20th century.

    Jesus is the truth, the way and life. If you sincerely search for Him, He (Jesus) will reveal himself to you.

  78. madfijian says:

    Ron i have been seeking answers since i was 12. Your Jesus is a non existent entity who only thrives in the minds of brainwashed minions. Countless millions have died praying to your Jesus without any answers and countless millions have been killed in the name of your fictitious God. How many lives will it take to stop this evil of my God is better than yours BS.

    In Fiji a good 60% of our population is Christian and i mean bloody mad Christians. Jesus at every juncture mad. Yet within the same group 80% of them have no hope in life. They are poor, struggling from pay chq to pay chq and generally have a fucked up life. Why is your Jesus not helping them? Have you also ever wondered why the the most secular and God less countries have the lowest amount of violent crimes,less poverty, greater human development etc etc.

    Obviously your God is selective in helping people and he seems to love those who don’t believe in him. Another example is Africa. One of the most Jesus fearing region of the world and yet the most fucked up continent of them all. I hope you get the point.

    I am happy using my rational judgement to make moral decisions in life and proud to be Godless.

  79. Face_The_Truth says:

    This FaithFreedom.Org website has now become a place of Christian and Muslim proselytizers!

    Christians want to convert non-believers of Jesus F**king Christ into the falsehood and debauchery again and again.

    Similarly, Muslims engage in Dawat al’Islam, which is basically — in Arabic language –invitation for submission to Allah and Allah’s final messenger; because, world’s Muslims know that Allah will not send another prophet to teach non-believers anything and, as such, non-believers are doomed if they do not submit to Allah and Allah’s final messenger by paying attention to Dawat al’Islam.

    But, non-believers should know that by reading so many of my posts that, world’s Christians believe in Jesus F**king Christ and world’s Muslims believe in Muhammad the Arabian bastard.

    World’s Christian liars say, “In God We Trust” and world’s Muslim bastards say, “Din Muhammad Sal’Allah La Illaha Il’Allah”.

    Because, Christianism and Islamism are two false religions that have been forced upon mankind or womankind with bloody military might by early Christian M*****F*****s and generational Muslim bastards!

    However, since my writings are essentially on this FaithFreedom.Org website for non-believers worldwide, let me ask world’s non-believers today if they have ever heard something like the followings in either Christianism or Islamism!

    ॐ असतो मा सद्गमय ।
    तमसो मा ज्योतिर्गमय ।
    मृत्योर्मा अमृतं गमय ।
    आविराविर्म एधि ।
    ॐ शान्तिः शान्तिः शान्तिः ॥

    Om Asato Maa Sad-Gamaya |
    Tamaso Maa Jyotir-Gamaya |
    Mrtyor-Maa Amrtam Gamaya |
    Aavira-Avir-Ma Edhi |
    Om Shaantih Shaantih Shaantih ||

    Meaning:
    Lead us from the unreal to the real
    Lead us from darkness to light
    Lead us from death to immortality
    Let the Knowledge of the Self-Manifest Atman Grow in Me
    Aum peace, peace, peace!

    ॐ पूर्णमदः पूर्णमिदं पूर्णात्पुर्णमुदच्यते
    पूर्णश्य पूर्णमादाय पूर्णमेवावशिष्यते ॥
    ॐ शान्तिः शान्तिः शान्तिः ॥

    Om Puurnnam-Adah Puurnnam-Idam Puurnnaat-Purnnam-Udacyate
    Puurnnashya Puurnnam-Aadaaya Puurnnam-Eva-Avashissyate ||
    Om Shaantih Shaantih Shaantih ||

    Meaning:
    Aum! That is infinite, and this (universe) is infinite.
    The infinite proceeds from the infinite.
    (Then) taking the infinitude of the infinite (universe),
    It remains as the infinite alone.
    Aum! Peace! Peace! Peace!

  80. Face_The_Truth says:

    This FaithFreedom.Org website has now become a place of Christian and Muslim proselytizers!

    Christians want to convert non-believers of Jesus F**king Christ into the falsehood and debauchery again and again.

    Similarly, Muslims engage in Dawat al’Islam, which is basically — in Arabic language –invitation for submission to Allah and Allah’s final messenger; because, world’s Muslims know that Allah will not send another prophet to teach non-believers anything and, as such, non-believers are doomed if they do not submit to Allah and Allah’s by paying attention to Dawat al’Islam.

    But, non-believers should know that by reading so many of my posts that, world’s Christians believe in Jesus F**king Christ and world’s Muslims believe in Muhammad the Arabian bastard.

    World’s Christian liars say, “In God We Trust” and world’s Muslim bastards say, “Din Muhammad Sal’Allah La Illaha Il’Allah”.

    Because, Christianism and Islamism are two false religions that have been forced upon mankind or womankind with bloody military might by early Christian M*****F*****s and generational Muslim bastards!

    However, since my writings are essentially on this FaithFreedom.Org website for non-believers worldwide, let me ask today non-believers if they have ever heard something like the followings in either Christianism or Islamism!

    ॐ असतो मा सद्गमय ।
    तमसो मा ज्योतिर्गमय ।
    मृत्योर्मा अमृतं गमय ।
    आविराविर्म एधि ।
    ॐ शान्तिः शान्तिः शान्तिः ॥

    Om Asato Maa Sad-Gamaya |
    Tamaso Maa Jyotir-Gamaya |
    Mrtyor-Maa Amrtam Gamaya |
    Aavira-Avir-Ma Edhi |
    Om Shaantih Shaantih Shaantih ||

    Meaning:
    Lead us from the unreal to the real
    Lead us from darkness to light
    Lead us from death to immortality
    Let the Knowledge of the Self-Manifest Atman Grow in Me
    Aum peace, peace, peace!

    ॐ पूर्णमदः पूर्णमिदं पूर्णात्पुर्णमुदच्यते
    पूर्णश्य पूर्णमादाय पूर्णमेवावशिष्यते ॥
    ॐ शान्तिः शान्तिः शान्तिः ॥

    Om Puurnnam-Adah Puurnnam-Idam Puurnnaat-Purnnam-Udacyate
    Puurnnashya Puurnnam-Aadaaya Puurnnam-Eva-Avashissyate ||
    Om Shaantih Shaantih Shaantih ||

    Meaning:
    Aum! That is infinite, and this (universe) is infinite.
    The infinite proceeds from the infinite.
    (Then) taking the infinitude of the infinite (universe),
    It remains as the infinite alone.
    Aum! Peace! Peace! Peace!

  81. continuum says:

    Truth Seeker
    ========================================
    Islam, Christianity and even Hindu who believe in any supreme person are under the definition of cult.
    ========================================

    Have you heard of the term Purushotthama (Supreme Person literally)? This word occurs in Bhagavad Gita itself. I know the neo-Hindu Arya Samaj cultists reject Bhagavad Gita…

    Yadā paśyaḥ paśyate rukma-varṇaṁ kartāram īśam puruṣam brahma-yonim, tadā vidvān puṇya-pāpe vidhūya nirañjanaḥ paramaṁ sāmyam upaiti (Mundaka Upanishad 3.1.3)

    Sa vedaitat paramam brahma dhāma yatra viśvaṁ nihitam bhāti śubhram, upāste puruṣam ye hy akāmās te śukram etad ativartanti dhīrāḥ (Mundaka Upanishad 3.2.1)

    Yathā nadyas syandamānās samudre astam gacchanti nāma-rūpe vihāya, tathā vidvān nāma-rūpād vimuktaḥ parāt-param puruṣam upaiti divyam (Mundaka Upanishad 3.2.8)

    The verse from Mundaka Upansihad also uses the word puruṣam (person) to refer to Vedic God (paramatma inside every being) in many places.

    Again I know that Arya Samaj cultists reject Upanishads as well…

    Now even Rig Veda mantra portion has an entire sukta named as Purusha Sukta (refering to the supre person or supreme God). Now, I know Arya samaj cultists even reinterpeted this to mean something else, when in reality entire mantra portion of Vedas is praises for Purusha (Supreme person).

    vedāham etam puruṣam mahāntam, ādityavarṇam tamasaf-parastāt ||
    am evaṃ  vidvān amṛta iha bhavati, nānyaf-panthā  vidyate’yanāya ||18||
     
    I know the Great Person (Puruṣam) who is beyond darkness (ignorance), and whose splendour is comparable to that of the Sun. Knowing Him thus in this life itself, one becomes immortal (by knowledge). There is no other path leading to ‘mokṣa’. (18)

    According to your definition UnTruth Seeker, even Vedic teachings will be called as a cult….

  82. continuum says:

    Truth Seeker
    ========================================
    A Cult : starts by a person. Cult can not survived without believing in a supreme human.
    ========================================

    You have redefined cult according to your whims and fancies of Arya Samaj cultists like yourselves.

    You say “starts by a person”. Arya samaj cult fits this definition, where Dayananda saraswati fits nicely into this definition.

    You say “Cult can not survived without believing in a supreme human”……Which dictionary defines this way?

    Truth Seeker
    ========================================
    Islam, Christianity and even Hindu who believe in any supreme person are under the definition of cult.
    ========================================

    Have you heard of the term Purushotthama (Supreme Person literally)? This word occurs in Bhagavad Gita itself. I know the neo-Hindu Arya Samaj cultists reject Bhagavad Gita…

    Yadā paśyaḥ paśyate rukma-varṇaṁ kartāram īśam puruṣam brahma-yonim, tadā vidvān puṇya-pāpe vidhūya nirañjanaḥ paramaṁ sāmyam upaiti (Mundaka Upanishad 3.1.3)

    Sa vedaitat paramam brahma dhāma yatra viśvaṁ nihitam bhāti śubhram, upāste puruṣam ye hy akāmās te śukram etad ativartanti dhīrāḥ (Mundaka Upanishad 3.2.1)

    The verse from Mundaka Upansihad also uses the word puruṣam (person) to refer to Vedic God (paramatma inside every being) in many places.

    Again I know that Arya Samaj cultists reject Upanishads as well…

    Now even Rig Veda mantra portion has an entire sukta named as Purusha Sukta (refering to the supre person or supreme God). Now, I know Arya samaj cultists even reinterpeted this to mean something else, when in reality entire mantra portion of Vedas is praises for Purusha (Supreme person).

    I hope this is enough to show that Truth seeker is not seeking any truth in fact, but seeks to impose Arya samaj cultist belief system..

  83. Truth seeker says:

    @Ali Sina

    There is no mention of Jesus in the scripture written before thousands or lacs years before birth of Jesus. Rigveda world oldest book, Geeta, Upnishad, Six darshan. nowhere said Jesus is way to God. Patanjali Rishi in his book Yog Darshan said all stages to reach realization the supreme soul. Jesus no where mentioned. Only after realization Supreme soul (God) who is all pervading, one can be free from misery birth and death again and again.

  84. continuum says:

    Ron says:
    ======================================
    I choose to believe that this North Korean had got a real encounter with Jesus and that makes a difference. they are now no longer afraid of persecution.
    ======================================

    You can choose to believe whatever you want. It does not become truth just because you choose to believe something, just because it is your wishful thinking.

    You may choose to believe that some man-god killed himself in order to convince himself to forgive his own creation…Just because you choose to believe this absurd, illogical nonsense it does NOT become true..

    Now, you are claiming that this North Korean chose suffering and death knowingly and hence his belief is true…Your assumption is somebody accepting pain, suffering and even death makes for an belief system makes the belief true..

    Even terrorists like Osama Bin laden, chose pain, suffering and even death for his belief system. Which individual in the right mind will chose to go against nation states, much less a super power like USA. Does that make Osama’s belief system true? Absolutely not…

    Again, it is irrelevant if Osama killed others or not, Osama chose a path of difficulty which includes lots of pain, suffering and death by being shot dead, just like North korean also chose fight against a state, North Korea.

    All these fellows are suicidal retards, just like your delusional mamzer jeebus, who is also a mental retard.

  85. Truth seeker says:

    A Cult : starts by a person. Cult can not survived without believing in a supreme human. Islam, Christianity and even Hindu who believe in any supreme person are under the definition of cult.

  86. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    =========================================
    Rama had multiple wives (As per Valmiki Ramayana but let’s give him benefit of doubt)
    =========================================

    Clearly FALSEHOOD

    Ron Says:
    =========================================
    Rama was NOT forgiving (when he killed Shambunath or Sugriva).
    ===========================================

    Its called judgment. If your corpse god can send souls to eternal hell, so can Vedic God kill for doing wrong actions.

    Ron Says:
    =========================================
    Jesus practiced and taught to forgive unconditionally
    ========================================

    As usual PURE LIES….Mamzer jeebus a hypocrite and could not even forgive those who did not accept him as son of demon god, jehova.

    HERE JEEBUS WISHES FOR ETERNAL HELL FOR JEWS SIMPLY FOR REJECTING HIS TEACHINGS.

    “The children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” (Matthew 8.12)

    HERE HYPOCRITE MAMZER JEEBUS CALLS JEWS AS “PROPHET KILLERS”, JUST AS MUHAMMAD CALLS JEWS SIMILARLY.

    “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets and stonest them that are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Behold your house is left unto you desolate.” (Matthew 23.37,38) Then answered all the people (Jews) and said, “His blood be on us and on our children” (Matthew 27:25). 1 “But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you to councils, and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten” (Mark 13.9)

    “Why then have you killed the Prophets of Allah aforetime, if you indeed have been believers?” Quran. 2:91

    HERE HYPOCRITE MAMZER JEEBUS CALLS JEWS AS SONS OF SATAN…THUS SOWING THE SEEDS OF ANTI-SEMITISM…

    “Ye are of your father the devil and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar and the father of it. And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not. Which of you convinceth me of sin? And I say the truth, why do you not believe me? He that is of God heareth God’s words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God” (John 8.43-47)

    1. SO ITS CLEAR JEEBUS TAUGHT ANYTHING BUT TO FORGIVE UNCONDITIONALLY…
    2. ITS CLEAR THAT JEEBUS TAUGHT HATRED FOR UNBELIEVERS.
    3. MAMZER JEEBUS ALSO LAID THE FOUNDATION FOR ANTI-SEMITISM.

    Clearly mamzer jeebus is a hypcrite full of spite for unbelievers….NO BEING WISHING FOR ETERNAL HELL FOR UNBELIEVERS CAN BE CALLED AS UNCONDITIONALLY FORGIVING…

  87. continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    =========================================
    Using their own yardstick, we find Krishna killed people (whether rivals, enemies, war etc.).
    ==========================================

    Look at christian hypocrisy here….Its clear that jeebus sends souls to eternal hell….

    Jeebus wishes death and torture for his enemies, the jews…Bastard jeebus wishes eternal hell for jews….so much for love…

    “The children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” (Matthew 8.12)

    When I quoted this verse, Ron says its judgment. So it is right for demonic mamzer jeebus man-god to send to eternal hell and make them suffer for eternity, but when Vedic God judges for actions it is killing and wrong.

    THIS IS CLASSIC CRUSTIAN HYPOCRISY IN JUDGMENT OF mamzer jeebus and Vedic God.

    Ron Says:
    =========================================
    Krishna raped and did gangrape (but let’s say it was consent and give him benefit of doubt even of pedophilia),
    ==========================================

    This is pure LIES. No evidence whatsoever..

    Ron Says:
    =========================================
    Krishna married multiple times (16108. For sure it is more that 2) times.
    ==========================================

    So what is wrong in marriage…The assumption is marriage is only for sexual congress. This has been proven wrong already as Lord Krishna has NO body and His Form is purely spiritual as per Hindu scriptures. So this claim is strawman.

    Ron Says:
    =========================================
    Krishna committed homosexuality (though it was with consent).
    =========================================

    Pure lies again..no such thing ever took place.

    Ron Says:
    =========================================
    Krishna did petty theft of milk products and derivatives. (let us give him benefit of grand theft)
    =========================================

    A mischievous play as a child to attract attention is NOT a crime. You are talking as though a bank robbery took place here. Its a child just taking butter and eating from neighbor’s house, neighors who play with the child. Only a dumb ass idiot would call this grand theft.

    Ron Says:
    =========================================
    Krishna was NOT forgiving (he killed Sisupala when he crossed the threshold of 100 abuses) (For other offenders there was no threshold)
    =========================================

    Its called judgment Ron..

    Ron Says:
    =========================================
    Using their own yardstick, we find Rama killed people (whether rivals, enemies, war etc.). (innocent victims include Shambunath who was his own devotee and Sugriva a talking ape)
    =========================================

    Shanbuka is a criminal who wished for the wife of a Vedic god, who did intense tapas (no translation for this word) for the same purpose. He was killed for having unethical goals and attempting to achieve it.

    Ron…

  88. Ron says:

    South Korean law states that if a North Korean enters South Korea by any means, he is deemed a citizen and can apply and get welfare and all benefits immediately. This makes even the refugee from North Korea richer than the average North Korean in Korea.
    Moreover he gets real freedom immediately.

    In spite of all these the North Korean convert to Christianity decided to risk it all and go to North Korea and preach Christ. Either he is certainly a fool or he has got a real encounter with Jesus.

    I choose to believe that this North Korean had got a real encounter with Jesus and that makes a difference. they are now no longer afraid of persecution.

    Christianity grows during persecution. In China and India we find Christianity growing despite persecution. In China the growth is more because the persecution of Christians is more.

  89. Ron says:

    Hear the story from North Korea. He went to prison in China, and twice in North Korea and in all these places he was tortured for his belief.

    But once Jesus reveals himself to you, then madfijian you will leave the security of Fiji and perhaps will be preaching Jesus and maybe answering many blogs/forums and trying to save souls whether they are skeptics and anti-Christians.

    You are on the right path, do the challenge to Jesus and try. Remember every story cannot be fake. Nobody is doing a grand conspiracy on a global scale. Nobody is doing it for money.

    Christians sincerely want to spread the love of Jesus and the good news.

    May God bless you even as you sincerely search for Him (Jesus), He (Jesus) will reveal himself to you,

  90. madfijian says:

    Ron”. The only problem with all of what you say is this. Most of what Jesus taught was already taught and practiced by the likes of Budha 500bc and many other mythical beings in the Egyptian belief system, and Greek mythology. Moreover their is no clear and distinctive evidence that a men by the name of Jesus ever existed. None nada. All the so called evidence pertaining to him has been proven to to be false including the shroud of Turin even the so called accounts of him in one testimony and that is that of Josephus has been proven to be a late current entry. Now all that you have to fall back on is these 2 so called books allegedly inspired by God and or Jesus himself as he is deemed to be God. Now when you have 2 books written with so many inaccuracies both scientific and immoral than you have but one rational thing to do and that is to question the validity of the religion itself as the entire faith is based on the 2 holy books.

    If Jesus himself came down from heaven right know and told me to believe in him (and their is no reason why he cant if he is God) i would become a believer as the evidence than to me would be convincing until than all you have is faith and faith without convincing evidence is stupid.

  91. Ron says:

    This Hindu guy did not believe but as a last resort tried Jesus, got healed without medicines and is now a pastor

  92. Ron says:

    Brother madfijian

    Now you have seen that Jesus is different from the rest of the contenders.

    You now don’t believe in Jesus because of the Leviticus and Det books.

    Well the OT and these books are books which recorded history and covers what happened after the exodus from Egypt. The prescriptive laws were for the Jews during that time of war and unrest.
    Old Testament passages that deal with God’s commands to the Jews to kill members of the surrounding cultures must be seen in the proper light in order to understand and ascertain their meaning. It might seem unjust to casual observers some thousands of years removed, but understand that the nature of the world at that time was much more brutally violent than in our own times. Many cultures would kill for the sheer joy of it, for the sake of dominance. And their weapons were much more primitive and death was painful.

    God commanded the Jews to take over the land that would become Israel and to kill all the members of the cultures that resided there. The purpose was to establish spiritual purity.
    Many of the surrounding cultures were vile and wicked and did child and human sacrifices to Molech etc. The surrounding cultures would have corrupted the Jews and God wanted them to remain true to his Commandments. Of course, they disobeyed him and didn’t kill all the women, children, and animals as he commanded and the surrounding cultures corrupted them.

    I am not an expert on the Bible, but I believe in Jesus not only because of the reasons meant below in the earlier post but also because many people all over the world even those who have never heard of Jesus, have had encounters with Jesus in the dreams, visions, NDEs, physical encounters and miraculous events which are well documented.

    You need to check these events out and then consider whether there was a supernatural element to the event. Try and vet out other testimonies of miracles by Jesus on people you may know or in your proximity. (I can network someone in Nadi or Suva)

    And/or you may also directly and brazenly challenge Jesus to reveal himself to you within a time limit of say a week and then vow to go back to your old ways of pantheism, atheism, non-christianism if you don’t get the answer which satisfies you.

    But if he does answer and reveal himself (I know He (Jesus) will answer) then vow to follow him all days of your life and spread the Gospel.

  93. Ron says:

    Brother madfijian,
    Let us pre-suppose that all the words spoken/written/teachings of every religious personality born on this planet is true and their compilation is also true as documented or allegedly documented in their respective books.
    Now if you compare the teachings of Jesus with all other personalities born on this planet, you will find the following difference.

    Jesus never killed anybody,
    Jesus healed the sick, lame, crippled
    Jesus gave life to the dead,
    Jesus gave eyes to the blind, ears to the deaf, words to the dumb,
    Jesus saved the accused from punishment,
    Jesus fed the hungry,
    Jesus practiced and taught to forgive unconditionally
    Jesus taught to reconcile with your fellow men
    Jesus said to bless your enemies even when they persecute you and curse you.
    Jesus said to do good to your enemies.
    Jesus set very high moral standards that even if you see a woman with lust then you also you have sinned.
    Jesus was the only one who died, rose again.
    Jesus alone was righteous, loving, compassionate, healing, forgiving and claiming that He was the way, the truth and life.

    Using their own yardstick, we find that Mohamed himself said that He doesn’t know that he will be saved by Allah. He killed people (whether rivals, enemies, war etc.). He raped, He married multiple times. Married and had sex with a 9-year-old etc.

    Using their own yardstick, we find Krishna killed people (whether rivals, enemies, war etc.).
    Krishna raped and did gangrape (but let’s say it was consent and give him benefit of doubt even of pedophilia),
    Krishna married multiple times (16108. For sure it is more that 2) times.
    Krishna committed homosexuality (though it was with consent).
    Krishna did petty theft of milk products and derivatives. (let us give him benefit of grand theft)
    Krishna was NOT forgiving (he killed Sisupala when he crossed the threshold of 100 abuses) (For other offenders there was no threshold)

    Using their own yardstick, we find Rama killed people (whether rivals, enemies, war etc.). (innocent victims include Shambunath who was his own devotee and Sugriva a talking ape)
    Rama had multiple wives (As per Valmiki Ramayana but let’s give him benefit of doubt)
    Rama was NOT forgiving (when he killed Shambunath or Sugriva).

    Buddha deserted his wife and son and went in search of enlightenment and peace.

    He preached rebirth and said that if you are at the receiving end in this life is because of your actions in the past lives. He never healed anyone, never gave life to the dead, never did miracles etc.
    So, in comparison to the three, you will find Jesus stands different.

    Try to reach Jesus and he will answer you.

  94. Face_The_Truth says:

    This message is for Walter_Sieruk:

    President Donald John Trump is facing an uphill battle with Republican politicians such as Senator John Sidney McCain and House Speaker Paul Davis Ryan as the following LINK shows.

    http://www.teaparty.org/traitor-john-mccain-turns-trump-stop-trumps-agenda-210121/

    Republican politicians will sabotage President Trump’s any effort to curtail ongoing Muslim migration to the United States!

    U.S. Representative Muhammad Keith Ellison took the oath of his Congressional office by placing his Islamic hand on America’s founding father President Thomas Jefferson’s copy of al’Quran.

    Al’Quran and the practice of soon’Nah have been part and parcel of soon-to-be ex-President Baraq Hussein Obama, Jr.

    America’s first Muslim President Baraq Hussein Obama, Jr. has made sure the process of Islamization of America will not stop at his leaving the White House.

    American Muslims will probably change the name of the White House to “The Black House” one day; because, the color black was the official Islamic color of choice by Islam’s founder Muhammad the Arabian bastard.

    As more and more foreign-born Muslims are coming and settling in America, American government will eventually forced to change its official motto from “In God We Trust” to “Din Muhammad Sal’Allah La Illaha Il’Allah”.

    Increasing Muslim population in the United States will impose the laws of Allah and Allah’s final messenger on every American.

  95. [email protected] says:

    This alertness and need for good security is important because since the new year has arrived of Islamic terrorism is still with us, be the threats in the form of cyber threats or physical threats of jihad violence so we still should not live in fear or be afraid to go different places and do different things Nevertheless, but still be aware of our surrounding and be on the outlook for anything that seems not to look quite right As in “What’s wrong with this picture?”. Then if some wrong is seen then go and tell the right person about it, as a police officer. This may be summed up well as a former US President who declared “Let the eye of vigilance never be closed.” – Thomas Jefferson

  96. [email protected] says:

    Since the new year has thus arrived and the ISIS jihad threat against the USA and American’s citizens to continues a good time to make it clear that Bible based Christian churches in America are very good bulwarks against Islam with its many false doctrines. For those false doctrines of Islam are exposed in the light of the Bible as being extremely erroneous. Nevertheless, even though I go to such a church , from first hand observation, of Christians in church , it seems many Christians do need to take some time for Christian introspection of their priorities in the news of current events In the world today concerning Islam and its different kinds of jihad.
    For example, this year on March 21, no more than eleven miles from the home church there was a speaker who in times pasts, was both a Christian and a Muslim and lived in Iran as an Iranian citizen. Now he’s a Christian and an American and lives in America in an district of Pennsylvania. During the lecture he exposed, from the Quran, the violent and deadly nature of Islam. Likewise he also exposed, for the Quran and the Bible, that the god of Islam is not the God of the Bible.
    The point is of the many people at the lecture not even one person from my home church want to hear him. In contrast a month of two later a number of people ,at church, signed up to take a group trip to go to see baseball game that was about sixty miles away.
    A few month later the Sunday before the Sunday of the fifteenth anniversary after the service no one was, as far as I know , talking about the coming fifteenth anniversary of that vicious demonic jihad attacks by Al Qaeda jihadist on September 11, 2001. The only talk I head was about sports. Those Islamic attacks were heinously wicked and murderous. For the Bible view, those jihad attacks on 9/11 was a sin unto God as well as an affront to God. Furthermore the jihad attacks by the powers and forces of Islam were also a heinous crime against humankind and an affront against America as well as an affront against all that is good and right . Nevertheless I head one mentioned it . Then next exact Sunday that was September 11, 2016 no mention was made of September 11, 2001 .as if the hideous wicked and tragic events of the day never happen. What a shame. In conclusion, in this twenty first century “war of idea’s “ between the Christian West and Islamic East many Christians need to set their priorities right and invest their time and effort ,not so much on frivolous things as sports but subject of value and worth . as the reading and study of book by Christian scholars who used to be Muslims . As for example , the books , ISLAM AND TERRORISM by Mark A. Gabriel and also UNVEILING ISLAM by Eegun Mehmet Caner and Eethi Caner . Likewise, there is the book ANSWERING JIHAD by Nabeel Qureshi .

  97. continuum says:

    UTTER STUPIDITY OF crustian FREE-WILL ARGUMENT

    “You Send Yourself To Hell”

  98. madfijian says:

    Richard and Ron in particular i ask Ron. All the BS conversion videos that you parade on this blog aside, have you actually read the Quran? Have you read the old testament in particular Leviticus and Deuteronomy and understood it in detail. If you answered yes and if indeed you have read them and you are still paddling this BS that your Christian crap is better than that of Islam than you either are a liar and you have not read them both, or you live in a perpetual state of denial or you are dumb as 2 very short planks.
    The basic premise of Christianity is the acceptance of the old and new testament as the word of God.One is not complete without the other. Anyone who has read both the Quran and old Testament will realize very quickly that they are almost identical books in ideology. Since Islam is about 1400 years old and Christianity is about 3000 its an easy conclusion that the pedophile pig shit Muhammad simply copied the Christian faith. In other words Islam is but a offshoot of Christianity. Both are vile, barbaric, murderous faiths at its core and if followed to the letter Christianity is no better than Islam. The fact that you and most Christians do not go around killing infidels does not change the fact that your faith demands you to do so. You may be a good person despite your faith just as their are Muslims who despite their faith are good people. You really need to get out if this trance you are in dude and start looking at the fundamentals of your faith with a critical eye. Its not too hard the bible has been translated into English and stop cherry picking the good versus.

  99. Face_The_Truth says:

    “Richard says: Sorry — you are wrong about Christianity. It is NOTHING like Islam.”

    SO, AS ALL READERS AT FAITHFREEDOM.ORG WEBSITE CAN REALIZE ISLAMISM AND CHRITIANISM ARE 2 SIDES OF THE SAME COIN.

    MOST MUSLIMS CLAIM THAT THEY ARE VERY “MODERATE” PEOPLE, ESPECIALLY WHEN MUSLIMS ARE SMALL-MINORITY IN ANY NON-MUSLIM-MAJORITY COUNTRY ON EARTH.

    WHEN MUSLIMS ARE ABLE TO INCREASE THEIR POPULATION SIZE VIA MIGRATION, CHILD-MARRIAGE, AND POLYGAMY, MUSLIMS SHOW THEIR REAL FACES BY IMPLEMENTING ISLAMIC LAWS AND ISLAMIC CUSTOMS EVEN IN NON-MUSLIM-MAJORITY LANDS WHERE CHRISTIANS ROUTINELY EMBRACE ISLAMIC CULTURE, ISLAMIC CUSTOMS, AND WHERE CHRISTIANS ROUTINELY ALLOW PARALLEL ISLAMIC LAWS TO FUNCTION IN THE HOPE THAT MUSLIMS WILL SOMEDAY CONVERT TO CHRISTIANISM — WITH ALL HISTORICAL EVIDENCES TO THE CONTRARY.

    CHRISTIAN IMPERIALISTS CREATED “PAKISTANS” IN INDIAN SUBCONTINENT IN THE HOPE THAT SOMEDAY THE ISLAMIC PAKISTANS WOULD SUPERSEDE “HINDU”-MAJORITY INDIA BOTH FINANCIALLY AND MILITARILY AND, AS A RESULT, WOULD ONE DAY OBLITERATE ALL “HINDU” KUFFARS FROM EARTH.

    BUT, CHRISTIAN DIABOLICAL PLANS ALWAYS BACKFIRE ON CHRISTIANS.

    CHRISTIANS ARE CONGENITAL LIARS AND OVER 2000 YEARS OF CHRISTIAN LIES ONLY PULL CHRISTIANS INTO THE QUICKSAND OF ISLAMIC PROCLAMATION THAT THERE IS NO GOD, BUT ALLAH AND MUHAMMAD WAS ALLAH’S LAST MESSENGER.

  100. Face_The_Truth says:

    “Richard says: Sorry — you are wrong about Christianity. It is NOTHING like Islam.”

    SEE, ALL READERS AT FAITHFREEDOM.ORG WEBSITE?

    HAS FAITHFREEDOM.ORG WEBSITE BECOME A PROPAGANDA SITE FOR CHRISTIAN LIARS TO CONTINUOUSLY PROSELYTIZE AND WHITE-WASH BLOODY, GORY, GENOCIDAL HISTORY OF CHRISTIANISM???

    http://www.kyroot.com/

    STATUS OF WOMEN

    There are numerous scriptures in the “Super Holy” Christian Bible that clearly pronounce that a man is superior to a woman, which was consistent with the times it was written.

    Consider the following Christian scriptures to find similarity with Islamic Shariat:

    I Corinthians 11:3

    “But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.”

    I Corinthians 11:8-9

    “For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man.

    Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.”

    I Corinthians 14:34-35:

    “Let your women keep silence in the churches: For it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.

    And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.”

    But times have changed.

    Societies the world over have bent over backwards to give women equal status and opportunity.

    Most marriages are now viewed as a 50/50 venture, a 2-person team, as opposed to a master and a helper.

    The sticking point is that a real God and those he allegedly inspired would have foreseen this ultimate evolution of societal mores!

    This point is best summed up by the following quote from a former Christian — Paula Kirby:

    https://www.onfaith.co/onfaith/author/paula-kirby

    “[Christian] religion is one lie after another: The lie of original sin, the lie of eternal life, the lie of hell, the lie of answered prayer, the lie that life can have no meaning without religion, the lie that religion is the source of morality, the lie of creationism, the lie of a spy-in-the-sky who hears your every word and reads your every thought.

    And to this list we must add the lie that it views men and women as equal [which is exactly similar to Islamic Shariat in origin].

    It has got away for so long with the kind of lunatic word-games that allow death-by-torture to be presented as an act of love, and eternal torment in the flames of hell to be seen as a necessary act of justice, that we should perhaps not be surprised that it has also managed to dupe its followers into seeing the systematic suppression and silencing of women as an act of liberation and equality.

    Nevertheless, it is a lie, like all the others: a cynical and wicked lie.

    It is time women everywhere woke up to it.”

    http://www.kyroot.com/

  101. Ron says:

    Why Christianity is different and is the TRUTH:
    The way to be right with God in every religion is by earning your way. It is based on works, not grace. Christianity is different from every religion in this aspect. All other religions (including Mormonism, Islam, Hinduism, and Buddhism) state that you must earn the right to be reconciled with God. It is by what you do in this life (good deeds or bad deeds) that determines your eternal destiny.
    Christianity is completely different from this. It is not religion. Religion is the creation of man and is not the intention or design of God.
    JESUS DIDNT COME TO START A RELIGION, BUT HE CAME TO DIE FOR OUR SINS. That whosoever believes in Him should have eternal life with Him. JESUS CAME TO US, TO SHOW US THE RIGHT PATH AND TO FOR US TO FOLLOW HIM.
    ACCORDING TO THE PEOPLE…Christianity is an religion BUT ITS NOT A RELIGION. BUT THE ULTIMATE TRUTH…WHICH. has only one God in three personality. and is based on the life and teachings of Jesus of Nazareth which is the TRUTH.
    “The difference between Christianity and every other faith in the world is that all other religions are about man trying to reach up to God. Christianity is about God reaching down to man.”
    You can over come death…by accepting Jesus and lead an eternal life…He came to save us from our sins If we believe and accept Him.
    No, we don’t want to shove religion down peoples throat rather we need to have faith in Jesus.
    When we have faith in Jesus miracles do happen!!! You start to receive blessings…
    2 Peter. 3:10
    The day of the Lord will come as a thief. No one can set a day or year. Those who set dates mark themselves as false teachers, for they claim to know what the Bible expressly says no one can know.
    Romans 2:5-11 – Those who disobey truth, but do evil, will receive indignation, wrath, tribulation, and anguish. Those who continue doing good will receive glory, honor, immortality, peace, eternal life.
    Matthew 25:41,46 – The wicked go to everlasting destruction, the eternal fire prepared for the Devil and his angels. Righteous people will receive eternal life.
    1 Thessalonians 4:17; 5:9,10 – Saved ones will live forever with Jesus. [Cf. Matt. 5:10-12; 1 Peter 1:3f.]
    Revelation 20:11-15 – Anyone not found in the Book of Life will be cast into the lake of fire, the second death.
    2 Corinthians 5:10 – We must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ.
    Romans 2:6 – God will render to every man according to his deeds.
    Matthew 25:32 – All nations will be present.
    Romans 14:10-12 – We shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ. Every knee shall bow and every tongue shall confess. Every one of us shall give account of himself to God. He shall JUDGE THE LIVING AND THE DEAD!!
    JESUS is love and will answer prayers but we need to try praying to him and see what happens.
    You will be surprised and blessed when he answers PEACE BE WITH YOU. Amen.

  102. Ron says:

    Famous Bollywood Hindu artiste (ex ISKCON) accepts Christ…

    Only Christ answers, Christ heals…(try Christ…challenge Him (Christ) to reveal Himself if you doubts…Christ always answers if you sincerely search for the truth)
    Christ is the way, the truth and life…
    Watch

  103. Face_The_Truth says:

    Islam cannot be reformed for peaceful co-existence with non-believers.

    Followers of Islamism know that, Islam is the creation of Allah and Allah’s final messenger as Allah will not send another prophet to edify correct human behaviors!

    So, today world’s Muslims are stuck with Allah and Allah’s final messenger since any reform of Islam will require followers of Islamism to abandon the directives of Allah and Allah’s last messenger to the world.

    Therefore, the only way to reform Islam is killing combative Muslims and shun Islamic laws in non-Muslim-majority countries.

    And that will probably not happen, because Islam is a sister religion of Christianity as world’s Christians will continue to aid and abet Muslims and Islam.

  104. Walter Sieruk says:

    On the topic of a reformation within Islam , a very different yet possible valid and true view on this had bee explain by the Christian, Nabeel Qureshi ,who was in the past was a Muslim .He wrote in his book which is entitled ANSWERING JIHAD wrote about the suggestion “that Islam needs a reformation .What they may not realize is that radical Islam is the Islamic reformation. This might sound shocking ,but consider : Just as the Protestant Reformation was an attempt to raze centuries of Catholic tradition and return to the canonical text, so radical Islam is an attempt to raze centuries of traditions of various schools of Islamic thought and return to the canonical text of the Quran and Muhammad’s life. This desire to return to the original form of Islam can be seen not only in the words of Sayyid Qutb, but also in his method. He focused almost entirely on references to the Quran. it is true also of the Muslim Brotherhood and ISIS today, whose publications and proclamations are punctuated by references to the Quran and hadith literature. Radical Muslim organizations are explicit in their aim to reform Islam.” page 75. Further on pages 79,80 the author makes his case clear by writing that “Radical Islam is the Islamic reformation . The endeavor to modernize Islam and make it relevant to the twenty -first century is called progressive Islam. Progressive Muslim thought leaders, though few in number and limited in influence, are present and are working to recreate Islam’s religious framework from within. Indeed, that is what it would take for Islam to become devoted to peace – not reformation but reimagination. “

  105. Ali Sina says:

    Yes AH I noticed the mark of the Beast on his forehead. But so far he has shown to be a good person. His speech in the church last year almost made me cry.

  106. Face_The_Truth says:

    Many Muslims appear very “Moderate” when they are non-Muslim-majority countries and world’s Muslim leaders who are dependent on infidels’ (i.e., non-believers’) financial and military supports for survival pretend to be very “Moderate” too as long as financial and military supports from infidels (i.e., non-believers) are continuing.

    However, when opportune time comes world’s Muslims always act as snakes as all Muslims are!

  107. A.H. says:

    The accompanying picture depicts Sisi as a pretty westernized guy, but notice the dark stains in his face, especially his forehead. In my opinion caused by intensively contacting (highly contaminated) carpets in the mosk. I give him the benefit of the doubt.

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