Is God Responsible for Our Lives?

I had a discussion with a gentleman on YouTube, where I explained why I believe in God and he reasoned why he doesn’t.  In his last comment he wrote, “Ali, I suggest the major issue that divides us is my application of human values and life experience to the concept of a creator whether biblical or not. For instance, if we created a herd of creatures it is expected that we would nurture them, intervene in disputes and care for the sick, as a creator our natural inclination is to take responsibility for our creation and not to expect adulation or exaltation in return.”

I thought I should share my reply to him with my readers as I believe many people have similar concerns and road blocks in their acceptance of God. I being one of them.  So here it goes.

Dear Jim,

Now that you put God on trial, judged Him and condemned Him, let us learn the facts about Him too and see whether He deserves the verdict.

Much of your objection to the concept of God is valid.  I am a rationalist and an ex-atheist.  I did not believe in God for the same reasons you don’t.  I believe now because of the evidence.

It is true that I did not have a NDE personally. But I also did not go to the center of the earth to know it is molten magma.  There are countless things that I have not seen personally but I believe.

There is definitive evidence that the spiritual world is real.  If a person can see things happening in other rooms and their observation is confirmed by others this is evidence.  Such things are experienced by thousands of people.

In regards to your objection that the creator must also care for his creation, you make a valid argument based on your understanding of God.  You will remove that objection if you know the truth about God.  We need a change of paradigm.

Here is what I have come to understand.  This world is only the epidermis of reality.  The actual reality is hidden from us.  Think of the dark matter which is 27% of the universe and the dark energy constituting roughly 68% of the universe.  The visible universe is less than 5%.  The dark energy and the dark matter are everywhere, all around us and inside us.  We are suspended in them and yet we have no way to detect them.  While I don’t know what these are, it is clear that reality is bigger than what our senses and our instruments can detect. Are these spiritual forces?  Who knows!

Everything is made of waves. The only difference between light, sound and the atoms of your body is the length of the waves.  We can detect some waves with our senses and some with our instruments.  For example, we can hear sounds but we cannot hear radio waves, unless we change their wave length.  The spiritual world is also made of the same substance. It just vibrates with a different frequency and wave length.  Our senses and our instruments cannot detect it.  That is not evidence of the nonexistence of the spiritual world.

How can we know whether such world exists at all?  NDE provides ample evidence of its existence.  When so many people come back with information of verifiable events that they could not have possibly gained through their senses, we have no choice but to accept the reality of extra sensory perception. These people must have traveled out of their bodies.  This is the only logical explanation.  If I am in one room, dead or alive, and then claim I saw you and report accurately what you were wearing, doing and saying at that time, I must have traveled out of my body.  What other explanation can there be?

This changes everything. It means that consciousness is independent of the body and survives its death.  It means that there is a world made of a different substance of which we know nothing.

If such world exists and all evidence points to that fact, then we do not die.  Time is a byproduct of matter.  This was demonstrated by Einstein’s famous formula.  This means that our association with the material world is temporary.  We don’t belong here. One hundred years living in this world is nothing compared to our eternal existence.

Why do we come here?  This world is the world of imperfection, of injustice and of struggle. What do we gain by coming here?  We come here to face the world’s challenges. We choose to come to this world knowing that it will be difficult, because we want to overcome them. By overcoming difficulties, we become stronger spirits.

Take the example of courage. Courage is a spiritual quality.  How can we gain more courage? By overcoming fear.  In heaven, there is no threat, no loss and no fear. That is why we come here.

To grow spiritually we need to become more forgiving.  But in heaven there is no injustice. No one abuses you. To exercise forgiveness, you must face injustice.  You come here to face injustice in order to learn forgiveness.

Spiritual qualities such as compassion, confidence, creativity, determination, generosity, honesty, humility, kindness, loyalty, patience, perseverance, reliability, responsibility, service, tactfulness, thankfulness, tolerance, trust, truthfulness, etc. can only be learned in this world by overcoming their opposites.

Think of this world as a gym where you come to work out your spiritual muscles.  You don’t go to gym to relax or have fun. This world is for workout.  One woman who committed suicide met Jesus who rebuked her sternly ordering her to return. He told her that life is not supposed to be easy.

This is the point most people miss. If you think this life is all that there is, you are right to blame God.  This world is imperfect and unjust.  But if you see that this world is only a place to work out our spirit you will see the blessing of hardships and instead of complaining you will thank God for the opportunity He gave you to face them and overcome them.  Winning and losing is not important. What matters is how much we learn and how much we grow spiritually.

When you enter in this world of virtual reality you are given a headset with goggles that cuts you off from the real world and immerses you in this world.  You become a player and see this world as the only reality. You face challenges and hardships that seem real and life threatening.  The truth is that you are safe. The point is that you learn how to overcome the difficulties.  Once the game is over and you remove your goggles, you suddenly realize everything that you strove for was unreal. The only things that mattered was whether you gained any spiritual insight.  Did you learn how to love, how to forgive, how to be tolerant?  Those experiences you take along.  Everything else you leave behind. And those who miss the point of life, will be very sorry for the lost opportunity.

Near death experiencers say there is a life review where they become the recipient of things they did to others. One truck driver said in his NDE he revisited the moment when someone jumped in front of his truck some 15 years earlier. He managed to stop in time but was so scared that he came out and beat the poor jaywalker to pulp. In his NDE he saw the whole things, only this time he was the jaywalker, receiving the punches, feeling all the pain, all the 32 blows and the humiliation that the man felt. He felt the blood in his mouth.  What we do to others we do it to ourselves, literally.

What role does God play in all this? Well, he created this virtual world and let us play in it. He also told us the rules of the game. But he does not intervene, unless we ask. I assume He cannot intervene unless we ask.

Think of your body as a car. God gave it to you and you are the driver. He is sitting in the passenger seat.  You are in control. All He can do is show you the way.  He can’t steer the wheel unless you ask him and let Him.

I am not a deist. God is alive and He very much likes to be involved in our lives. All it takes is to ask.  Ask and it shall be answered; knock and it shall be opened.  That is why prayer is so powerful. When you pray and believe, you give the control of your life to God. Then stand by and watch miracles happen.

God does not expect adulation or exaltation. He expects nothing from us.  He loves to give and enjoys His generosity. It is we who need God. We worship Him so we can receive His blessings.  Worshiping God is like tuning into His vibes.  If you want to give me a gift, I must stretch my hand to receive it.  If I don’t I can’t receive what you give me freely.  We stretch our hands to receive God’s blessings in prayer. He gives freely to anyone who asks.

Blessed be our Lord. Blessed be our Heavenly father who loves us and who listens to our prayers.  While God loves us all, to receive His love, we must love him.  A lamp can become illumined only when connected to the electric current.  God’s blessings are there for all and sundry.  But if we are not connected to Him, we cannot receive it.  People shift their responsibility to God and then blame Him for what is their own shortcoming.

Ali Sina

Ali Sina is the author of Understanding Muhammad and Muslims.

63 Responses

  1. Face_The_Truth says:

    ‘There is also plenty of evidence that the Christian Gospels have been subjected to considerable EDITING in course of time.

    Passages have been interpolated as well as expunged.

    It is now well known that Mark 16.9-20, referring to Jesus’s re-appearance after death and the world mission of Christianity, have been added at a later stage.

    The original Christian Gospel comes to an end at 16.8 in the ancient manuscripts.

    The most scandalous instance of an expunction came to the notice of Prof. Morton Smith of Columbia University while he was staying at Jerusalem in 1958 AD.

    Prof. Morton Smith discovered in a monastery the correspondence between Bishop Clement of Alexandria who lived at the end of the First Century AD and a contemporary character, Theodore.

    It concerned a passage that followed immediately after Mark 10.46 which makes Jesus arrive at and
    leave Jericho.

    Scholars were puzzled for centuries as to what happened at that place, but there was NO clue.

    The correspondence between Bishop Clement and Theodore contains the passage which had been censored out of Gospel Mark for fear of raising a scandal.

    The passage says that, Jesus spent several days and nights with Lazarus, both of them remaining NAKED.

    It seems that homosexuals in the First Century Christian Churches were citing this passage in support of their practice, as homosexuals in the Christian Churches are doing today!

    The New English Bible version of the New Testament published jointly by Oxford and Cambridge Universities in 1961 AD mentions many instances where passages have been inserted or taken out.

    The most significant example is that of John 8.11, which tells the fictitious story of how Jesus saved — from being stoned to death — a woman caught in adultery!

    “This passage, which in the most widely received editions of the New Testament is printed in the text of John 7.53-8.11, has NO fixed place in our ancient manuscripts.

    Some of them DO NOT contain it at all.

    Some place it after Luke 21.38, others after John 7.36 or 7.52, or 21.24.”

    In any case, the story does NOT occur in any manuscript prior to the end of the Fourth Century AD.

    Scholars are now agreed that it is an INTERPOLATION.

    Similar is the case of Luke 23.34 where Jesus is made to cry from the Cross, “Father, forgive them; they DO NOT know what they are doing.”

    Incidentally, these are precisely the two statements, apart from the “Sermon On The Mount”, which the Indian “Hindu” admirers of Jesus quote most frequently.

    NO Christian missionary or theologian is known to have informed Indian “Hindus” that, they form NO part of the authenticated teachings of Jesus the Nazarene Jew!

    What scholars have come to suspect the most, apart from the miracles, are the Old Testament prophecies which abound in the Christian Gospels.

    Almost every event in Jesus’ life, from birth to death, is presented as fulfillment of some Jewish prophecy.

    Dr. Michael Arnheim has devoted a whole chapter (the Sixth) of his book — “Is Christianity True?” — to this subject. “One of the chief concerns — if not the chief concern — of the Christian Gospels is to ‘prove’ that Jesus was the Messiah as prophesied in the ancient Jewish scriptures!

    There are essentially two ways in which they set about doing this, depending upon the need of the case… either to bring your story into line with the Jewish prophecy or to interpret the Jewish prophecy in such a way as to bring it into conformity with the story.”

    Dr. Michael Arnheim has analyzed the various prophecies in order to show which of the two ways has been followed in which case.

    Dr. Michael Arnheim has also found instances in which both the ways have been used.

    In one case the misinterpretation of a prophecy (Zechariah 9.9) has created a ludicrous scene — that of Jesus riding into Jerusalem NOT on one but on two asses simultaneously!

    It seems that the Christian Gospel Writers did not understand the device of parallelism so often employed in Hebrew poetry.

    Zechariah never meant that the Messiah would ride on two asses at the same time.

    In the words of Dr. Morna Hooker, a British theologian and New Testament scholar, “They tear passages out of context, use allegory or typology to give old stories new meanings, contradict the plain meaning of the text, find references to Christ in passages where the original authors never intended any, and adapt or even alter the wording in order to make it yield the meaning they require.”

    Still more curious is the case of a Jewish prophecy which cannot be found in the Old Testament.

    Mathew (2.23) says that Jesus will be called a “Nazarene” in fulfillment of a Jewish prophecy.

    Commentators on this verse have searched the Old Testament for centuries, but have so far
    failed to locate the prophecy!’

  2. Ephesian says:

    Excellent article.You know,sometimes we can analyse something so much,look at something under such a powerful lens we fail to see what we are looking at.No prayer goes out from our mouths and returns void,it is answered,maybe not exactly the way we want,but our prayers are answered.Ask and it shall be given to you..Blessings in Christ..

  3. Face_The_Truth says:

    ‘SIFTING OUT THE REAL JESUS

    We know by now that the Christian Gospel is not a 100% authentic report about Jesus’s doings and sayings.

    But, it is possible to more or less sift out the authentic core from the theological additions.

    Some of the recognizable additions are the followings:

    According to the Gospels, Jesus is tried and sentenced by the Jews, with Roman Governor Pilate a mild and innocent bystander!

    In reality, Pilate was a cruel governor, and even the central rulers in Rome ended up removing him from office for causing too much trouble by his harshness.

    As for the “Jews”, it was the priests who tried Jesus, but the crowds (at least in the province) who supported him.

    But, after the defeat of the Jewish rebels at the hands of Titus in 70 AD — who was a military commander, but later became Roman emperor — it became more rewarding for the Christian missionary strategy to move closer to the Romans and emphasize their separateness from the Jews!

    These Jews could now be blamed for everything, while an early sympathy for Jesus Christ on the part of the Roman governor was also suggested.

    That is why Pilate is made to say: “I see no guilt in this man. I wash my hands in innocence.”

    On the other hand, the Jewish crowd is reported in the Christian Gospel as clamouring for Jesus’s death: “His blood may come over us and our descendents”, so that they become morally guilty of “deicide”, God-murder.

    On the basis of this Christian Gospel story, the Christian Church has considered the Jews as the murderers of Jesus, a stigma the Christian Church has only removed (and that only on condition that world’s Jews dis-identify with the Jewish generation contemporary with Jesus) in 1962 AD.

    It is possible that Pilate had sympathy for everyone who was a troublemaker to the Jews, whom he hated, but the depiction of his personality is certainly the product of Christian missionary editing.

    The allotment of guilt in the story of Jesus’s trial is in very large measure responsible for centuries of Christian anti-Semitism, culminating in Auschwitz and Birkenau of 1940’s.

    This allotment of guilt, with its far-reaching consequences, was the product of conscious history distortion by the early Christian missionaries, who considered it opportune to identify with the Romans and blame the Jews!

    A similar political turn is probably the key to the story of Jesus saying: “Give unto Caesar what is Caesar’s, and unto God what is God’s.”

    At first the Christians were very uncompromising and they refused to pay taxes: Christians expected the Second Coming and the destruction of the Empire.

    When that changed (around 55 AD, probably because at first the new Roman Emperor Nero had raised high expectations among the Christians, or because Roman Emperor Claudius’s persecutions had forced them into compromise), Christians justified this change to some of their more radical followers, and at the same time assured Roman or pro-Roman listeners about the genuineness of this new policy by invoking Jesus’s own authority.

    So, possibly this well-known episode is not historical, but a motivated insertion!

    A lot of the parables and sermons attributed to Jesus may well be common proverbs and insights of the contemporary religio-cultural scene.

    For instance, the dictum: “To him who hath, shall be given, but from him who doeth not have, even what he hath shall be taken”, may well have been a commonly known observation on life.

    Most people will feel compelled to give bigger presents to rich friends than to poor friends on a similar occasion: It is the kind of common knowledge that ends up crystallizing into a proverb.

    Jesus himself may have applied this dictum to a religious topic (the Kingdom of Heaven), but even in its application to a religious context, it may have been borrowed from the Pharisees or from one of the proliferating sects of the time.

    It is very common that the miracles of one saint are attributed to another saint by the latter’s followers.

    In Communist books, I have found Voltaire’s witticisms being attributed to Karl Marx!

    The pranks attributed to the Turkic wit Mollah Nasruddin (now popular in the People’s Republic of China as A-fan-ti, i.e., Effendi) have been appropriated in Indian sources for the Indian wit Birbal, and vice versa.

    So, it is only normal that wise and saintly statements that carried an aura of respected profundity, were put in Jesus’s mouth by followers.

    An important statement of Christian doctrine that was probably borrowed from sectarian sources, either by Jesus or by the Gospel editors, is the “Sermon On The Mount”.

    Another Christian classic, the injunction to “love thy neighbour as thyself”, is typically pharisaic, and in tune with traditional morality expressed here and there in the Old Testament.

    It can readily be linked with Pharisee Hillel’s famous statement that the Jewish law can essentially be summed up as: “What ye do not want done unto you, do not do that unto others”, the Golden Rule which Pharisee Hillel had in common with Chinese philosopher Confucius (551-479 BC), among others.

    A different type of addition by the Gospel editors is the hardening of miracle stories into fully attested reports.

    In the Gospel of John, written as the last of the four, we read that the apostle Thomas refused to believe that the man before him was the resurrected Jesus, so he asked to touch his wounds.

    And yes, they were real, it was the crucified and resurrected Jesus!

    This detail of the checking of Jesus’s wounds is not present in the other Gospels.

    What happened was that Christian preachers used to relate the story of the resurrected Jesus’s meeting with the apostles, and people in the audience would ask: “Did it really happen? Do you know this for sure?”

    And so, to anticipate these questions, John fabricated a certificate of empirical proof.

    Similarly, in the successive Gospels, the report on the baptism of Jesus in the river Jordan becomes ever more “realistic”.

    Mark reports it as a subjective impression: “Jesus saw the heavens open and a dove descend on Him”.

    In Matthew this becomes: “And lo! The heavens opened and He saw God’s Spirit descend on Him in the shape of a dove.”

    The seeing of the dove is still a matter of Jesus’s own subjective perception, but the interpretation that it was God’s Spirit has been added.

    According to Luke, “It happened that the Heavens opened and the Holy Spirit, in the physical shape of a dove, descended on Him”.

    Now, the whole episode has become an objective fact. Finally, John goes another step further: “And John [the Baptist] gave testimony and said: ‘I have seen that the Spirit descended as a dove from heaven. I have seen it myself and attested: this is the son of the Lord.’”

    This time, there is even a witness willing to testify.

    What has started as a report of Jesus’s subjective experience, recorded from Jesus’s own report, has become an objective and even a well-attested fact.

    A theology as well as a polemical fortification is increasingly being imposed on the original innocent report.

    Now, all such insertions, suspected omissions, and reworked versions, can more or less be traced and mapped.

    After that, a solidly historical core remains.

    Among the reliably historical elements are those which go against the intentions of the Christian preachers, or those which are beyond their capacity of invention.

    Therefore, a solidly historical element in the Gospel narrative is the psychopathological syndrome which is clearly present in Jesus’s personality.

    The Gospel writers could not have invented such a coherent description of a well-defined syndrome even if they had wanted to, and secondly they certainly didn’t want to pass on such information about their Saviour.

    The syndrome so well illustrated in the Christian Gospel is called paraphrenia.

    Jesus was sentenced to crucifixion.

    This was a Roman, not a Jewish punishment, and Bible scholars have debated a lot about this seemingly unnecessary hand-over of Jesus by the Jewish authorities to the Roman Governor Pilate, who proceeded to implement the death penalty which Jesus had deserved according to the Jewish law.

    Crucified convicts were tied (not nailed) to a cross, and their death was brought about by torture and by breaking their bones.

    Interestingly, the Roman soldiers refrained from breaking Jesus’s bones, no doubt because they had orders to do so.’

    Book Source:

    Koenraad Elst, “Psychology of Prophetism: A Secular Look at the Bible”, New Delhi, 1993

  4. stanley says:

    Ron… I really admire your patience and persistence, after all you are still responding to Face the Truth…. can you not see that he is demon possessed? He will not see the truth, let alone face it unless the demons of deception have been cast from him…. I wonder if that is what Ali ws referring to…that you can know God exists by looking at demonic activity. The presence of darkness tells you that there is light.
    Anyway in my journey as a Christian , I have prayed for many Hindus and it is amazing that when we pray in the name of Jesus, these other spirits like Kali,and Hanuman, who are worshipped as gods, manifest, scream and come out of these people. They then follow Jesus Christ, who delivers people from darkness to loght. No argument or debate here- just a supernatural experience.

  5. Steve says:

    Ron you said.

    “Watch this video and may be you will find the truth.” Ron what is truthful about the doctrine of a loving God sending his son who is supposed to be sinless to be tortured and die on a cross for the “sins” of other people (which is in fact not their sin but that of the mythical first human couple Adam and Eve – for the “crime” of taking an apple from a tree (after being persuaded by satan who was created and put their by God) who given he is all knowing knew what would unfold before he created this world and then knew he would have to send himself or his son to be tortured and killed in order to rescind his own action? Isn’t this being insane? Surely an omnipotent being could have created a different couple with a saintly character (like Christains claim Jesus had) or a garden that didn’t contain this tree or satan? A world where there is no evil people or “monsters” as many people call them like Richard Kuklinski or Bin Laden or Isis and the other countless monsters? A world where everybody is aware of the existence of their Heavenly Father? Wouldn’t this have been a better world to create and a better way of having a relationship with human beings than the insane master plan of creating a couple with a sinful nature and then sending your son the one saintly human to be humiliated, tortured and nailed on a cross in order to correct your own error? Perhaps he didn’t create that world because he doesn’t exist and Christianity is man made?

  6. Ron says:

    Hi Steve,

    You have raised some very interesting questions and you are truly searching for the truth.

    Watch this video and may be you will find the truth.

  7. Steve says:

    “Why do we come here? This world is the world of imperfection, of injustice and of struggle. What do we gain by coming here? We come here to face the world’s challenges. We choose to come to this world knowing that it will be difficult, because we want to overcome them. By overcoming difficulties, we become stronger spirits.” This reply may make some sense if it wasn’t for the existence of people with an evil character. https://hubpages.com/politics/Richard-Kuklinski—The-Mafia-Torturer (though it doesn’t cover natural evil)

    “Richard Kuklinski is one of the most dangerous criminals that we have ever come across in this state. He’s not a drug-crazed wild man running around with a machine gun,” Mr Carroll told HBO.“He’s not a person that is driven by perverse sexual desires. He doesn’t drink. He doesn’t gamble. “Richard Kuklinski instead is nothing more than a predator on human beings. His motivation is greed and his method of murder is very varied and very extreme.”

    What purpose do predators like this serve? Why God lets them loose on humanity? Isn’t this (at the very least) massively irresponsible on his part?

  8. Vijai Singh says:

    From England – Jul 6 at 5:49 AM
    To: Vijai Singh Message body
    Namaste Vijai ji,
    At Hammersmith and Fulham Libraries across London,they have blocked your website (http://www.vjsingh.info/index.html) on their internet.., because it is classified as “Hate speech!”
    I have spoken to the one of the library staff at the reception, and told them it is not a Hate speech website,..unfortunately they told me that there is nothing they can do about it.
    Thank you,
    Namaste,
    Dean.

  9. Continuum says:

    Ron says:
    ====================================
    What does research over 1000 NDES show?
    Answer: 12 commonalities among which is that Heaven is true and Jesus is King of Heaven
    =====================================

    There are couple of very simple explanations about this…

    1. Since the christian evangelist business is booming business for fraudsters (as proven above through links), it is obvious that FRAUDSTERS WILL WEAVE FAIRY TALES and/or COLLECT ONLY NDE STORIES THAT CONFORM TO CHRISTIAN THEOLOGY TO MARKET THEIR PRODUCT.

    Hence the christian stories are over-represented as compared to other NDE stories…

    2. There could be more NDE stories of Islam or Hinduism or Buddhism etc. than that of christianity in reality. Almost every family (including mine) I have asked in India has NDE stories about seeing Lord Yama (God who takes souls after death to give them their due results).

    Unlike the propaganda based religion like christianity where they collect, collate and present cases for propaganda, other religions do not do the same. Hence it appears as though most NDEs are based on mamzer jeebus.

    3. There is no way that anybody can verify which part of NDE is reality and which part of NDE is hallucination. THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT POINT.

    NDEs as the name suggests, is what the patients see during physically traumatic period of time. Lack of enough oxygen and lack of enough blood pumped to the brain causes many hallucinations mixed with reality.

    Now the question is why does this jeebus always appear only in NDEs? Why does he not appear to normal people? Trauma can lead to many hallucinations. Death is a painful process. Nobody sane wants to die. Hence survival instincts cause such hallucinations. Strongly held beliefs start to kick in and the person starts to hallucinate and mix reality with halluncination…

    This is clearly seen among patients of parkinson’s disease…..For example if these patients are afraid of neighbors or family members who are after their property (strongly held belief), they start to hallucinate and hear things about neighbors and family members plotting to kill him and take property. Here they mix reality (motive of family members being after properties may be true) with hallucination (plots which are pure imagination).

    This is what is happening due to NDEs….Strongly held religious beliefs begin to surface in traumatic times as survival instinct…Now how do we know these experiences are hallucinations and NOT reality?

    Lets take the example of christian NDEs, where mamzer jeebus ALLEGEDLY appears…IF THIS MAMZER JEEBUS APPEARS IN REALITY AND THAT MAMZER JEEBUS IS REALLY “GOD” THERE MUST BE CONSISTENT DESCRIPTION OF HIS FEATURES IN ALL NDE EXPERIENCES. OBJECTIVE REALITY IS SAME INDEPENDENT OF SUBJECT INVOLVED.

    What does the data show?

    http://www.theblaze.com/news/2014/04/18/boy-who-claims-he-nearly-died-and-went-to-heaven-reveals-how-an-image-on-cnn-captured-exactly-what-he-saw/

    “Well he has brown hair, brown beard, a very bright smile — brightest that I’ve ever seen,” Burpo, the subject of the new film ………“And his eyes were just beautiful sea blue.”

    FOLLOWING IS THE TABLE THAT COLLATES SOME OF THE DIFFERENT EXPERIENCES OF NDEs..

    http://www.near-death.com/science/research/jesus.html#a03

    NDE Experiencer——–Hair————Eyes—————Skin

    Valvita Jones———–dark brown and light red wavy——-blue, piercing, transparent———–olive and light golden

    Lorraine Tutmarc———-auburn, wavy————beautiful, large, full of meaning ——

    Susan————-dark brown————dark brown——

    Clara————–dark brown, shoulder length————dark eyes with black around eyelids, eyes of liquid love———olive

    “Children tend to be explicit about skin tones when talking about any religious figure who visited them. Jesus is seen as a man with tan skin. Adults are the ones who usually see Jesus as white.” (P.M.H. Atwater)

    The author of website says “**Perhaps the greatest reason why Jesus is described in differing ways in NDEs** can best be described by Margaret Tweddell who revealed that Jesus appears in a way that you can recognize him and/or just as you’ve always imagined you see him.

    https://books.google.co.in/books?id=LesEBwAAQBAJ&pg=PA53&lpg=PA53&dq=NDEs+christ+blonde+hair&source=bl&ots=fVAaPkb0zR&sig=ksG06l211rR3z6_Q3voihkaFp2s&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiZ24n8w9rUAhVKqI8KHV0jAYEQ6AEIYDAP#v=onepage&q=NDEs%20christ%20blonde%20hair&f=false

    The Near Death Experience: A Clinical Investigation
    By Duncan Alexander McKenzie R.N.

    Page 53 (Jun-Jun from Manila Has NE experience)

    “I was in my father’s arm when I saw Jesus Christ with a beard and long blond hair”

    CLEARLY THE AUTHOR OF THE WEBSITE HIMSELF FEELS THERE ARE INCONSISTENT DESCRIPTIONS OF JEEBUS (some see auburn haired jeebus, while others see blonde or brown haired jeebus, some see dark eyes, while others see blue eyed WHITE jeebus).

    THIS INCONSISTENCY OF PHUSICAL APPEARANCE OF JEEBUS IS CLEAR EVIDENCE THAT ALL NDES ARE MERE HALLUCINATIONS AND DO NOT PROVE ANYTHING. THE APPEARANCE OF MAMZER JEEBUS IS IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE IMAGINATION/BELIEF OF THE BELIEVER. NDEs ARE NOT EVIDENCE FOR BELIEF IN MAMZER JEEBUS.

  10. Continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ======================================
    There are fraudsters in every religion but that doesn’t mean that Christ is false.
    ======================================
    ———————–
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/walterpavlo/2013/11/18/fraud-thriving-in-u-s-churches-but-you-wouldnt-know-it/#6353ca49d9d4

    Fraud Thriving In U.S. Churches, But You Wouldn’t Know It
    ———————-

    There are fraudsters in every religion, but christian churches are places where fraudsters thrive unlike other religions (exception being islam)….Even judaism does not believe in such nonsense…

    When mooslimes are blamed for almost all terrorist acts, they claim that every religion has its terrorists….but we know majority terrorists are islamic….similarly majority religious fraudsters, pedophiles, boy buggers are christian missionaries…How do we know…we know through news channels just as we know about terrorists….

    The theology of christianity is based on fraudulent claims of its founder, mamzer jeebus who claimed to have healed sick and other such baloney claims and that his followers also will be able to do miracles…To this day nobody has proven scientifically that these fraudster christians can heal anybody….All those who claim that bastard jeebus could heal and that they could heal others, they themselves age, become sick and die ultimately…All christian followers see this fact, but are gullible enough to believe in such baloney such as christian miracles of “healing”

    Now why does christianity have large number of fraudsters and thieves as compared to other religions…see the blog below…

    http://blog.congregationalsecurityinc.com/tag/embezzlement/#.UoUGgI2E554

    The reason is the theology of christianity allows frauds to thrive among them as they believe uncritically in miracles and bogus claims of bible….christianity is based on propaganda rather than critical self-evaluation based spiritual practices. This is why fraudsters thrive in christianity. You can see this even among christian sects which are more propaganda based than others… For example protestant sects thrive more based on propaganda as compared to catholic sect…however, all sects of christianity are based on false propaganda…

    Mamzer jeebus followers are oblivious to logic and rational thought process. Despite the fact that it has been proven with logical arguments that suicidal ritual sacrifice of mamzer jeebus born through adultery cannot be logically/morally consistent with the idea of “perfect God”, still the followers cling to this blind belief and miracles…

  11. Ron says:

    What does research over 1000 NDES show?
    Answer: 12 commonalities among which is that Heaven is true and Jesus is King of Heaven

    There are fraudsters in every religion but that doesn’t mean that Christ is false.

    Christ is the only one who heals, who gives life, who gives boldness to the missionary and who even makes evil gangsters and witch-doctors afraid and drives them away.

    Jesus Christ is the only way, the truth and life

    Don’t follow religion but follow Christ and have a strong relationship with Christ as Christ is the only way, the truth and life.
    Watch this broadcast by Megyn Kelly of Fox News who is now with NBC news

  12. Continuum says:

    MORE CHRISTIAN CONMEN AND FRADULENT MIRACLE HEALERS…

    Inside Edition Investigates TV Preachers Living Like Rock Stars

    Copeland is an avid pilot. He has a 20 million dollar Cessna Citation jet. It’s the fastest private jet which money can buy. He claimed that he needed it to better serve the Lord. He proudly did a fly-by for his followers after the church bought it.

    It was in fact found that Copeland had a fleet of planes registered to the church. He has his very own airport (the Kenneth Copeland airport) located right next to his mansion.

    Ole Anthony, president of the Trinity Foundation, a religious watchdog group, says “I think Copeland is unbelievably greedy”. The Foundation worked closely with the Senate Committee investigating Copeland and other TV preachers.

    “Televangelism alone is at least a two-and-a-half to three billion dollar industry, untaxed, unregulated”, says Anthony.

    Copeland and his church take in tens of millions a year, through donations and selling books and DVD’s to his donors.

  13. Continuum says:

    SOMETHING SPECIAL FOR RON FROM SOME MOOSLIMES…

    Caught on video: Allah destroys Christian Idol ————LOL

  14. Continuum says:

    Peter Poppoff exposed many years ago as a conman, yet still conning people today

    Christian evangelist world is full of FRAUDULENT FAITH HEALERS LIKE THESE….WHY ONLY CHRISTIANITY HAS SO MANY FRAUD FAITH HEALERS AS COMPARED TO OTHER RELIGIONS….THE BIGGEST CON-MAN IN HISTORY WAS THE SUICIDAL MENTAL RETARD JEEBUS, FOUNDER OF CHRISTIANITY…ITS OBVIOUS WHY CHRISTIANITY ENCOURAGES SUCH FRAUDSTERS…FROM TERESA TO FAITH HEALERS, CHRISTIANITY IS THE RELIGION OF FRAUDSTERS AND GULLIBLE IDIOTS…

  15. Continuum says:

    ALL I SEE IS MORE CHRISTIAN DECEPTION, LIES AND CHRISTIAN SCOUNDREL CON-MEN PERFORMING FRAUDULENT MIRACLE SHOWS…

  16. Ron says:

    How Jesus Heals the Blind.

    Apostle Ankur Narula is the Senior Pastor and Overseer in The Church of Signs and Wonders which is the largest and fastest growing church in Punjab,India.

    Born on 5 January,1985 in a non-believer family(Hindu and Sikh family), Apostle Ankur Narula came to know about Lord Jesus Christ at suicide point frustrated from intoxications and sickness. He surrendered himself to God for the gospel and started his ministry with 3 people in the church in the year 2008 which grew to 500 members in the year 2009, 2000 members in the year 2010, 4000 members in the year 2011, 8000 members in the year 2012, 13000 members in 2013, 18000 members in 2014, 25000 members in 2015 and the numbers is increasing at a very high pace as hundreds of people take baptism in the church every month.

    This is despite local, state and Federal Government machinery opposing Christian conversions.
    Christianity has always grown in persecution.

    You may allegedly find fault with Christians but you cannot find fault with Jesus.
    Jesus is the way, the truth and life.

    Woman Healed Blind In One Eye In The Church Of Signs And Wonders (Apostle Ankur Narula Ministries)

  17. Continuum says:

    Tainted Saint: Mother Teresa Defends Pedophile Priest

  18. Continuum says:
  19. Continuum says:

    LIES, DECEPTION, TRICKERY, PROPAGANDA, EXAGGERATION, HIDING TRUTH THESE ARE ALL THE FORTE of all christians/christian organizations.

  20. Ron says:

    How Jesus can change lives against the most formidable evil enemy.

    Until it was pulled down, the Walled City was Hong Kong’s most foreboding territory. It was a lawless place, dominated by the Triads, and which the police hesitated to enter. Strangers were unwelcome. Drug smuggling and heroin addiction flourished. It was a place of prostitution and pornography, extortion and fear. Even the police feared to enter it.

    When Jackie Pullinger set out from England, she had no idea that God was calling her to the Walled City in Hong Kong. Yet, as she spoke of Jesus Christ, brutal Triad gangsters were converted, prostitutes quit, and Jackie discovered a new treatment for drug addiction: baptism in the Holy Spirit.

    She entered alone and fearlessly into the dens of the drug lords and personally rescued drug addicts and people enslaved by them. The mighty drug lords just who were even feared by the local populace as well as the police just could not stop her.

    That is the power of the Holy Spirit which you receive when you are baptized and your faith is strong even as you accept and follow Jesus Christ.

    You must watch this amazing story

  21. Face_The_Truth says:

    My readers should notice that, Ali Muhammad Amir Abd’Allah Umar Salehi ibn Sina is not Avicenna (980 — 1037 A.D.).

    Avicenna’s full Islamic name was Abu Ali al’Ḥussein bin Abd’Allāh ibn al’Ḥassan ibn Ali ibn Sina.

    Avicenna was an adherent and follower of the ideology of Islam as well as a strict practitioner Islam’s prophet’s Sunnah.

    Contrary to that, Ali Muhammad Amir Abd’Allah Umar Salehi ibn Sina, however, rejected both the ideology of Islam and Islam’s prophet’s Sunnah.

    My readers should know that, Islam is a one-way-street as one can only enter Islam, but cannot leave!

    Because, when Yawm al’Qiyāmah (i.e., “Islamic Day of Judgment”) will descend on earth, the almighty one and only Islamic Allah will ask Ali Muhammad Amir Abd’Allah Umar Salehi ibn Sina the following questions:

    “Why did you reject me in spite of being born in a faithful Muslim household?”

    “Why did you reject my Last Messenger?”

    “Why did you not follow my Last Messenger’s lifestyle?”

    “Why did you fail to say that, there’s no God, but Allah and Muhammad was my Last Messenger?”

    “Why did you not wage Islamic Jihad against non-believers of Allah and non-believers of my Last Messenger?”

    Unfortunately, Ali Muhammad Amir Abd’Allah Umar Salehi ibn Sina will not be able to answer any of the questions of almighty one and only true God named “Allah”.

    Then, Islamic Allah will be so angry with Ali Muhammad Amir Abd’Allah Umar Salehi ibn Sina that, folks, I cannot write here anymore!

  22. Face_The_Truth says:

    =============================================================================
    Ali Muhammad Amir Abd’Allah Umar Salehi ibn Sina loves the “Miracles” of Jesus the Nazarene Jew!

    BELIEVE IT OR NOT!!!
    =============================================================================

    ‘For a first example of “Miracles of Jesus the Nazarene Jew” of a pathological description, we can take a very clear and simple case from the Christian Gospel.

    It does not concern Jesus or another prophet, but a “possessed” child, cured by Jesus according to Luke 9:37-43, Mark 9:14-29, Mathew 17:14-21.

    The Christian Gospel relates how a child is brought to Jesus, because it is possessed by a deaf-and-dumb demon which it has had since birth.

    When the child sees Jesus, it gets a crisis, shakes and with foaming lips falls to the ground.

    Jesus raises it up and the crisis is over, “the demon has gone out”.

    Remark that the text doesn’t say that henceforth the child can hear and speak!

    Even a layman can recognize this as an epileptic crisis which, as is normal, subsides after a few minutes.

    But, the story gives two important details that complete the syndrome.

    Firstly, the child gets the crisis when it is confronted with Jesus.

    Typically, these crises erupt after sudden emotions, such as a child may feel when confronted with this strange man with his charismatic airs, probably accompanied by a number of followers.

    Here, the story does not say that the child was already having a crisis before Jesus came in.

    It was the other way round:

    Apparently, Jesus’s entry was causally related to the crisis.

    Secondly, the child has been deaf (and therefore it can also not speak) since birth.

    Now, one typical physiological cause of epilepsy can be a trombophlebitis occurring around the time of birth, which leaves a scar on the brain, thus indirectly causing epilepsy while directly causing deafness.

    This simple story thus gives us important conclusions.

    Firstly, this “possessed child” must have existed.

    It is so completely improbable that a Christian Gospel writer who knew nothing about these subtler points of the epileptic condition, would have invented this story.

    It could only be an account of a real case.

    Secondly, from the fact that the story is told as a report of a miracle wrought by Jesus, it is clear that the writer did believe that a cure took place, and that Jesus’s extraordinary powers had been demonstrated.

    In fact, from the details of the story, it seems that Jesus himself believed this!

    Yet, both the writer and Jesus were wrong: Epileptic crises always subside, and that is no indication of cure at all.

    This shows how easily people in those days could be made to believe in the miraculous power of anyone who had the guts to style himself a miracle-worker; and how some people, notably Jesus, could erroneously believe such a thing about themselves.

    As Dr. Herman Somers writes: “The features, found in the text, are all coherent with the syndrome of epilepsy and especially with an infantile form: Perinatal infection of the ears with inflammatory complications, causing thrombo-phlebitis in the brain with the consequence of epileptic seizures and deaf muteness.

    In the text of Mark 9, all symptoms are described with precision: The child is mute, falls in the water and the fire (a loss of consciousness), utters a cry and is agitated, has foam on his mouth, becomes like dead and after a while is “cured”.

    Obviously, 2000 years ago nobody was aware of the true nature of epilepsy and the typical features of this illness in young children.

    If a witness describes so correctly the phenomena of an epileptic seizure in a child with all concomitant circumstances, this fact has precedence over all philological arguments and constitutes proof of authenticity and historicity.

    If moreover, the witness mentions all these features in order to prove his incorrect view on the facts (viz. that Jesus effected a miracle cure), it is clear that the testimony is beyond suspicion.

    If anything here depends on culture, it is the interpretation, in this case: That it is the devil who causes the seizure.”

    Another example of “Miracles of Jesus the Nazarene Jew” is the “exorcism” related in Matthew 8:28-34, Mark 5:1-20.

    A man was possessed by a host of demons, and dangerous.

    The man had broken the chain in which people had put him, and now lived in caves and on burial-grounds, and the people were afraid of him.

    Jesus asked the “demon” in this man for his name, as was customary in exorcisms.

    The name was “Legion”, since there were many demons at once!

    Then Jesus drove the demons out, into a flock of pigs, who became mad, threw themselves into the lake, and drowned.

    The man became calm and asked to stay with Jesus, but was not allowed to.

    The people of the area asked Jesus to go away.

    This man apparently suffered from schizophrenia with catatonic agitation.

    In a fit of rage, such people can develop an unbelievable strength, enough to break handcuffs.

    Even Jesus, after “curing” him, is apprehensive about having him around, and consequently sends him away.

    Such people’s personalities totally disintegrate, they eat their own excrement and live worse than animals.

    Jesus speaks to the man, and the next thing we read is that the pigs become mad and run away, into the lake!

    Unless you believe in miracles, this seems to mean that the man went into a rage and didn’t take on Jesus, but went after the pigs.

    Seeing the madman in his rage, the pigs naturally ran away, and afraid as pigs can be, some of them even ran into the lake.

    But then, as always, the rage subsides and the afflicted man becomes quiet.

    Jesus sends the man away, and a proof that this indeed was a lasting cure is not even attempted.

    In this story we have a smaller number of elements, so the improbability of the Christian Gospel writer just making it up is not as striking as in the first story.

    Still, the picture of the sick man here is realistic, as is the impression that mere passers-by, such as Jesus’s followers (who don’t get to see his regular crises followed by equally regular periods of calm), would think that after a fit of rage everything has come back to “normal”, and that a cure has been effected.

    According to Dr. Herman Somers: “Similarly, the attempts by some philologists to explain the story of the possessed man of Gerasa (Mark 5) as a synthesis of two or three others, mixed with folklore, is now superseded by a realistic understanding of the story through psychopathological examination.

    The possessed of Gerasa shows all symptoms of schizophrenia with catatonic agitation.

    The story is quite realistic, including the delusion that he was possessed by a legion of devils.

    Mark’s text is rather precise: The man was subject to a grandiose delusion; he was agitated especially during the night, he roamed amidst the graves, howling, and he mortified himself with stones.

    Nobody could control him, he broke all chains.

    It is not very strange that such a lunatic chases a herd of pigs while uttering loud shrieks, sending his devils into them!

    All these elements confirm the diagnosis of catatonic schizophrenia.’

    Book Source:

    Koenraad Elst, “Psychology of Prophetism — A Secular Look at the Bible”, New Delhi, 1993

  23. Continuum says:

    Mentally retarded mamzer jeebus wanted to die intentionally, i.e. COMMIT SUICIDE – CERTIFIED MENTAL FELLOW

    By the way Jeebus behavior did NOT result in his death unintentionally. Jeebus intentionally wanted to die in this case you dumb ass moron. For the umpteenth time your bible itself says so as it is evident.

    John 18:11

    Jesus commanded Peter, “Put your sword away! Shall I not drink the cup the Father has given me?”

    What does the above verse mean?

    http://biblehub.com/commentaries/john/18-11.htm
    ===============================
    Gill’s Exposition of the Entire Bible

    the cup which my Father hath given me: by the cup is meant, the wrath of God, and punishment due to sin, endured by Christ in his sufferings, and is said to be given him by his Father; because he called him to these sufferings, they were appointed and determined by him; yea, he was even ordered, and commanded by his Father, to drink of this cup;
    ===================================

    GOSPEL VERSES AS EVIDENCE FOR JEEBUS PLANNING SUICIDE FOR LONG TIME

    John 10:15 Young’s Literal Translation

    according as the Father doth know me, and I know the Father, and my life I lay down for the sheep,

    John 10:11

    “I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep.

    John 10:17

    The reason my Father loves me is that I lay down my life–only to take it up again.

    John 10:18

    No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have authority to lay it down and authority to take it up again. This command I received from my Father.”

    THESE VERSES CLEARLY SHOW THAT JEEBUS WAS PLANNING INDIRECT SUICIDE THROUGH RITUAL SACRIFICE, SUICIDE BY ROMAN SOLDIERS. JEEBUS SIMPLY MASKED HIS SUICIDE WITH GRANDIOSE CLAIMS WHICH IS TYPICAL FOR PEOPLE WHO COMMIT INDIRECT SUICIDE.

  24. Continuum says:

    Mamzer Jeebus was a mentally retarded indiividual for he believed he is “son of god” and that his suicidal human sacrifice will lead to absolution of sins.

    There is much evidence from goose-pels (which Ali Sina conveniently rejects) that mamzer jeebus was suicidal maniac.

    PROBLEM DEFINITION:

    Now can Jeebus’ death saving from satan be logically consistent with a belief in perfect God? Lets see this.

    CLAIM:

    God in order to save humanity from sins, sent his only son to be sacrificed as a “sacrificial goat” to atone for the sins of mankind.

    ANALYSIS:

    (a.) God in order to save His own creation from His own judgment, sacrificed His own son to Himself, to convince Himself to forgive His own creation from His own judgment.

    Does a perfect God create absurd rules for justice?

    Imagine a judge do this in order to forgive murderers, where the judge sends his own son or himself to be hanged. You would send the judge to a mental asylum as he is not fit mentally.

    Then why would anyone expect God to act like a mentally retarded individual, where He punishes innocent in order to forgive the guilty? Clearly this is NOT how a perfect God behaves. This is a morally inconsistent behavior for a perfect God to have and hence logically not consistent position for a perfect God.

    (b.) Second, it is the perfect God who created all of mankind as per bible. A perfect being will create only what is perfect and good.

    If any evil or sins of mankind exists, then it is because of the creator Himself has created mankind with sins. If mankind was created “perfectly good”, then no evil can exist. Free-will is irrelevant here. A “perfect good” being will NOT chose evil even out of its free-will as it is against its “perfectly good” nature.

    Since evil exists as per Christianity, which requires a sacrifice for atonement of sins, then God did NOT create mankind that is “perfectly good”. It is absurd and illogical for God to punish His own creation for He has created such an imperfect mankind. It is even more logically inconsistent and morally reprehensible to believe that a “perfect God” would require an innocent sacrificial offering to forgive the guilty.

    Thus the entire belief is immoral, illogical, inconsistent with the idea of perfect God.

    Hence the belief that Jeebus is the “sacrificial goat” for atonement of sins of mankind is logically and morally inconsistent idea with existence of a perfect God.

    CONCLUSION:

    Since Jeebus believed in an idea of “voluntary human sacrifice” which is logically inconsistent and morally inconsistent with the idea of a perfect God, Jeebus essentially committed a “ritual indirect suicide” based on superstitious, illogical and irrational ideas.

    Just because one has an apparently altruistic idea of self-sacrifice, it does NOT imply it is necessarily good and correct. An apparently altruistic idea of self-sacrifice can be based on superstitious stupidity and leads only to pure evil. Only right knowledge can lead to truly altruistic idea.

    https://books.google.co.in/books?id=zY0O7OIhd2MC&pg=PA119&lpg=PA119&dq=indirect+suicide+suicide+by+cop&source=bl&ots=OFUA4EdVOZ&sig=va6Rju9L0vtOkT3e6nz1qYUhBP8&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi_9Jy9j-vLAhWKA44KHS-dAXUQ6AEIJjAC#v=onepage&q=indirect%20suicide%20suicide%20by%20cop&f=false

    Title: “Suicide by Cop: Committing Suicide by Provoking Police to Shoot You”

    Authors: By Mark Lindsay, David Lester

    “Karin Andriolo (1998) has described a number of cultures in which people commit suicide by getting other to kill them…………This method of committing suicide has been called indirect suicide, vicarious suicide, or masked suicide. Masked suicide is a public performance, and therefore, a public property. The suicide conforms to the cultural norms and values and thus confirms them. The suicidal person of this type also does not act impulsively, but rather seeks a cause, and the scenario offers solemnity, symbolism, and purpose. The ritual induces control and calmness in the suicide.”

    THIS IS PERFECT DESCRIPTION OF JEEBUS COMMITTING INDIRECT SUICIDE THROUGH SOCIALLY ACCEPTABLE RITUAL OF SUFFERING AND TORTURE. JEEBUS COMMITTED INDIRECT SUICIDE SEEKING SOME IMAGINARY CAUSE, ATONEMENT FOR SINS.

  25. Continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    =========================
    Jesus clearly said that we have to love those who hate us. Bless those who curse us. Do good to those who hurt you. Forgive them unconditionally.
    ==========================

    No matter how much a mamzer jeebus worshiper LIES through his teeth, the fact remains, did bastard jeebus “unconditionally” love others?

    Does unconditional love teach the following and wish for eternal hell for those who do not accept one’s teachings and/or oneself..

    WHERE IS THE SO CALLED LOVE AND FORGIVENESS OF BASTARD JEEBUS?

    Matthew 10

    14 And if anyone will not welcome you or heed your words, shake the dust off your feet when you leave that home or town.

    15 Truly I tell you, it will be more bearable for Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of judgment than for that town.

    IN THE ABOVE VERSES, the adultery born bastard jeebus shows his real heart, where he wishes eternal hell for those who do not accept his demonic teachings that he is son of OT demon-god. Clearly, bastard jeebus is a hypocrite, who teaches one thing for others and holds unlimited hatred for those who do not accept him.

    It is this same HATE adultery born jeebus shows to jews who did not accept this mad fellow.

    “Ye are of your father the devil and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar and the father of it. And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not. Which of you convinceth me of sin? And I say the truth, why do you not believe me? He that is of God heareth God’s words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God” (John 8.43-47)

    Jeebus wishes death and torture for his enemies, the jews…Bastard jeebus wishes eternal hell for jews….so much for love…

    “The children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” (Matthew 8.12)

    Bastard Jeebus calls Jews as the murderers of prophets, just like QURAN CALLS the Jews

    “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets and stonest them that are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Behold your house is left unto you desolate.” (Matthew 23.37,38) Then answered all the people (Jews) and said, “His blood be on us and on our children” (Matthew 27:25). 1 “But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you to councils, and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten” (Mark 13.9)

    “Why then have you killed the Prophets of Allah aforetime, if you indeed have been believers?” Quran. 2:91

  26. Ron says:

    Ali and Jim,
    How do evil people tackle the truth and divinity about Jesus
    1) They try to deny he ever existed historically
    If that fails
    2) They try to show that he existed but was bad
    If that fails
    3) They try to show that he existed but his teachings were taught before
    If that fails
    4) They show that try to attach a stigma to his birth, saying that because he had an unusual birth he is bad
    If that fails
    5) They twist some of his teachings to show that he is mad
    If that fails
    6) They twist some of his teachings, taking words out of context to show that he was evil
    If that fails
    7) They character assassinate the followers of Jesus
    If that fails
    8) They resort to name-calling, verbal-abuse and attack (Christians).

    Jesus clearly said that we have to love those who hate us. Bless those who curse us. Do good to those who hurt you. Forgive them unconditionally.
    There are many people like Dawkins, Harris, Hitchens, Shermer, Denett etc who are atheists and don’t believe in Jesus as divine, but they acknowledge that Jesus’ moral teachings are great and good.

    There is a difference between those who are evil, deny and hate Christ and those who are lost and don’t believe in Christ.
    But Jesus said that there is hope of salvation for both of them. We need to love them. We need to pray for them We need to forgive them for they do not know what they do. Jesus loves them also.

    Matthew 5:38-47 (NIV)
    Eye for Eye
    38 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’[a] 39 But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. 40 And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. 41 If anyone forces you to go one mile, go with them two miles. 42 Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you.
    Love for Enemies
    43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor[b] and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47 And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that?

    You can see how Jesus healed this evil person of incurable disease when she decided to try Jesus. This is a must watch.
    This is part -2 of the earlier video.

  27. Face_The_Truth says:

    Falsehood of Christianism has NO other parallel.

    Not even in Islam.

    At least, to this day Muslims are upfront about and openly kill non-believers of Allah and Allah’s messenger.

    Whereas Christians constantly lie about everything!

    Hence there is a saying that, if there’s no lying, there will be no Christianism on earth.

    ‘Consider the belief in miracles, for long the mainstay of popular Christian religion.

    Both Protestants and Catholics believe in miracles, though with a different flavour.

    Protestants always talk about Jesus: Jesus gave me the strength to do this, everything changed when Jesus came into my life, etc.

    Many of them are very serious about faith healing, and some of them even reject modem medicine and vaccination on the ground that the Bible doesn’t allow it, or that only Jesus should heal them.

    The Catholic Church leaves the miraculous cures preferably to the saints, in their places of pilgrimage!

    It also recognizes a number of miraculous appearances of the Virgin Mary, around which more places of pilgrimage have sprung up, where people go for miraculous cures.

    A critical scrutiny of the miracles shows that nothing genuinely miraculous is going on.

    In the case of miracle cures, it turns out that NO actually supernatural things ever happen, such as an amputee getting back his lost limb!!!

    What routinely happens, is that psychosomatic diseases are cured, due to a psychological jump from despondency to faith.

    “Your faith has saved you”, is what the priest will say (quoting Jesus) on such occasions, and correctly so: but not the faith in Jesus, much less Jesus himself, but faith in the possibility of cure.

    Medicine has so far underestimated the psychic factor in health, and “miracle workers” do address that inner strength by creating confidence with the aid of powerful mental images, one of which may be Jesus, or the Virgin Mary.

    Other Gods, other prayers, other rituals could do the job just as well, provided they create a sufficiently strong impression on the patient’s mind.

    While consciousness is dawning that the miracle cures effected in Lourdes and other places of pilgrimage, are merely applications of an as yet insufficiently explored healing power within ourselves, there has also been research into that other Christian miracle: The apparitions of the Virgin Mary.

    Some striking facts: Over 90% of the apparitions concerns children between nine and fifteen; what they see, is the typical Virgin Mary of the statuettes in churches, dressed in blue and white; the geographical spread of the apparitions is such that the Virgin Mary hardly ever appears in Protestant countries, where she is neither worshipped nor depicted; she only appears to people who are believers already.

    So, the Virgin Mary appears only to people who already have emotionally charged images of her in their heads, and perfectly fits the image they have of her.

    That points to a purely psychological phenomenon.

    The recipients are children at an age when they are very susceptible to what the German psychologist Erich Rudolf Jansch (1883-1940) called “eidetic images”: Mental images of emotionally charged objects, that seem very lively and real.

    The contents of what Virgin Mary has to say fits this age-group.

    On the one hand, Virgin Mary offers a bit of simple platitudinous theology: Calls to better their lives, to turn to her or to God, to pray and to spread the Gospel.

    Virgin Mary doesn’t come up with something that those youngsters couldn’t have thought up themselves.

    On the other hand, Virgin Mary often pays a lot of attention to the recipients’ personal problems, encourages them, gives them confidence: just what an understanding educator does towards kids in that self-searching stage of life.

    In the cases where several children saw her at the same time, it turns out that the first time they see different images, but after they exchange information on what they have seen, the image seen by the “leader” among them, is also seen by the others.

    In several cases, it was noticed they declared seeing the same image.

    For instance, in the apparition in Beauraing (Belgium, on November 29, 1932) one child declared it saw the Virgin Mary with a golden heart on her breast (just like in many statuettes).

    The next time, the two other children saw the same thing.

    Their descriptions were, however, not identical to the detail, and observers noticed they were focusing on a different spot.

    Essentially, the image was in their minds.

    So today, people see through these “miracles”, and they are convinced that what miraculous elements there were in Jesus’s life, must have been of a similar nature (if not fiction concocted by the Gospel-writers).’

    Book Source:

    Koenraad Elst, “Psychology of Prophetism — A Secular look at the Bible”, New Delhi, 1993

  28. Continuum says:

    Ali Sina Says:
    =========================================
    Christ did not advocate abandoning justice.
    ======================================

    I am happy you understand this much Ali Sina, that adultery born jeebus did not teach abandoning justice system of courts, police force etc. So you agree that jeebus’ teachings were simply limited to the context of personal relationships and NOT ABOUT LEGAL LAWS. So, jeebus’ teachings are NOT that great.

    Now the only question is what kind of “Justice system” that this adultery born jeebus believed in. Anybody with minuscule amount of brain will know that Jeebus was all for OT laws….I have quoted below from goose-pels where jeebus supports all OT laws including slavery and stoning.

    Matthew 23
    2 “The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat.
    3 So you must be careful to do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach.

    Clearly jeebus approves Mosaic laws…..

    Ali Sina Says:
    =========================================
    I had read a book called Who Wrote the Bible by Richard E. Friedman who makes a very compelling argument that the Old Testament was written centuries after the alleged Moses. In fact when I read the book of Leviticus I felt this book is written by the Rabbis so they can be taken good care of. The Old Testament is not the word of God. It is a collection of diverse religious teachings.
    ===========================================

    You also agree that old testament is one filthy book just like quran is.

    Now you also say the goose-pels contains words of jeebus. *****Ponder on the following verses of jeebus from the goose-pels ali sina…****

    Matthew 5:17 Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them, but to fulfill them.

    Matthew 15:3

    For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; [a] and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’

    Jeebus himself admits that God commanded these barbaric laws of OT of putting children to death.

    In addition, Jeebus mentions Moses explicitly in many places in gospels and believes literally in many OT stories about Moses, including Moses as Law giver (every violent barbaric law like stoning).

    John 6:32

    Jesus then said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, it is not Moses who has given you the bread out of heaven, but it is My Father who gives you the true bread out of heaven.

    John 7:23
    “If a man receives circumcision on the Sabbath so that the Law of Moses will not be broken, are you angry with Me because I made an entire man well on the Sabbath?

    Mark 12:26 `And concerning the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the Book of Moses (at The Bush), how God spake to him, saying, I [am] the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob;

    Luke 20:37Young’s Literal Translation (YLT)

    37 `And that the dead are raised, even Moses shewed at the Bush, since he doth call the Lord, the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob;

    John 3:14

    14 `And as Moses did lift up the serpent in the wilderness, so it behoveth the Son of Man to be lifted up,

    Matthew 12:40 (NASB95)

    40 for just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the sea monster, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

    Matthew 24:37–38 (NASB95)

    37 “For the coming of the Son of Man will be just like the days of Noah.

    38 “For as in those days before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark,

    Matthew 23:35 (NASB95)

    35 so that upon you may fall the guilt of all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, the son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar.

    SO did jeebus abolish old laws?

    NOWHERE JEEBUS ABOLISHES ANY OT LAWS..

    ALi Sina Says:
    ===========================================
    The message of Jesus is in the Gospels. I asked you to find one filth in the teachings of Christ. Even then we must not assume that the Gospels are the word of God or infallible.
    ==========================================

    Jeebus was a mental retard who believed that his death will bring salvation. There is much filth and hatred in his teachings against those who did not accept his teachings.

    ALi Sina, you have gone from following a pedophile profiteer to a mental retarded profiteer. Thats about it.

  29. Continuum says:

    I challenge you to show me one “filth” in the teachings of Christ. Show me where did he encourage his followers to hate others,
    =========================================

    Did you say “Hate”? Here it is Ali Sina

    WHERE IS THE SO CALLED LOVE AND FORGIVENESS OF BASTARD JEEBUS?

    Matthew 10

    14 And if anyone will not welcome you or heed your words, shake the dust off your feet when you leave that home or town.

    15 Truly I tell you, it will be more bearable for Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of judgment than for that town.

    IN THE ABOVE VERSES, the adultery born bastard jeebus shows his real heart, where he wishes eternal hell for those who do not accept his demonic teachings that he is son of OT demon-god. Clearly, bastard jeebus is a hypocrite, who teaches one thing for others and holds unlimited hatred for those who do not accept him.

    It is this same HATE adultery born jeebus shows to jews who did not accept this mad fellow.

    “Ye are of your father the devil and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar and the father of it. And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not. Which of you convinceth me of sin? And I say the truth, why do you not believe me? He that is of God heareth God’s words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God” (John 8.43-47)

    Jeebus wishes death and torture for his enemies, the jews…Bastard jeebus wishes eternal hell for jews….so much for love…

    “The children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” (Matthew 8.12)

    Bastard Jeebus calls Jews as the murderers of prophets, just like QURAN CALLS the Jews

    “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets and stonest them that are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Behold your house is left unto you desolate.” (Matthew 23.37,38) Then answered all the people (Jews) and said, “His blood be on us and on our children” (Matthew 27:25). 1 “But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you to councils, and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten” (Mark 13.9)

    “Why then have you killed the Prophets of Allah aforetime, if you indeed have been believers?” Quran. 2:91

  30. Continuum says:

    Ron Says:
    ==========================================
    But I felt that the teachings of Christ and his work when he walked on earth are of such a high moral standard that they have to be divine.
    =================================================

    ALi Sina says
    ==================================
    The message of Jesus is in the Gospels. I asked you to find one filth in the teachings of Christ. Even then we must not assume that the Gospels are the word of God or infallible.
    ==========================

    Only a fool will believe in this LIE.

    Lets look at so called high moral standard of this jeebus….Ali Sina here is the filth….but then you will selectively say these are not words of your adultery born jeebus…you will start to pick and choose what you want…

    “Ye are of your father the devil and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar and the father of it. And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not. Which of you convinceth me of sin? And I say the truth, why do you not believe me? He that is of God heareth God’s words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God” (John 8.43-47)

    Jeebus wishes death and torture for his enemies, the jews…Bastard jeebus wishes eternal hell for jews….so much for love…

    “The children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” (Matthew 8.12)

    Bastard Jeebus calls Jews as the murderers of prophets, just like QURAN CALLS the Jews

    “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets and stonest them that are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Behold your house is left unto you desolate.” (Matthew 23.37,38) Then answered all the people (Jews) and said, “His blood be on us and on our children” (Matthew 27:25). 1 “But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you to councils, and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten” (Mark 13.9)

    “Why then have you killed the Prophets of Allah aforetime, if you indeed have been believers?” Quran. 2:91

  31. Ron says:

    I was following debates of Ali Sina with Islamic apologists in the early 2000s. Ali was that time an ex-Muslim and a strong atheist, very rational and was anti-Islam and also anti-Christian and he never believed in Jesus. In one of his debate exchanges Ali said to his opponent that if you convert from Islam to Christianity you are only jumping from frying pan to the fire.

    But when he saw the evidence in NDEs of afterlife, heaven, hell, Jesus as ruler in Heaven he reluctantly accepted Jesus.

    Here Ali is showing that demons and evil entities are true in this video on magic and so conversely God and his good angels have to be true.

    In South Africa the witch doctors (shaman, pagans) are feared practically by all (the locals, the whites, the Muslims and the Indians) as they do such blood curdling magic, but surprisingly they are afraid of the name of Jesus and are afraid of born-again Holy Spirit filled and Jesus believing Pastors.

    I was anti-religion because I felt religion was for the weak and believed the Marxist rhetoric that religion is an opium for the masses. But I felt that the teachings of Christ and his work when he walked on earth are of such a high moral standard that they have to be divine.

    We may argue about the Bible, origin of life, Jesus’ birth and death but you cannot find anything wrong about His teachings and his practices in life. No other person’s teaching and practice shows such unconditional mercy, love and compassion and forgiveness as that by Jesus.

    Jesus is divine and the Son of God. Jesus is the way, the truth, and life.

  32. Vishal Kumar says:

    If i am inspire most in my life it is Ali Sina. I have great respect for him. Great spiritual person I have ever seen, great intellectual. The way Ali Sina explains the complex things in easiest way is a great ability in him.

  33. Ali Sina says:

    Jim,

    There is another way to prove the existence of the spiritual reality and that is, by paying attention to demonic magicians. Some magics are slight of hand, smoke and screen. That is art. But some are only possible with the help of spiritual beings that are basically demonic. Watch this video and others on the same subject. I think they are convincing.

  34. Ali Sina says:

    Jim,

    True, miracles are hardly enough to abandon reason. However, facts are strong evidence and reason demands that we pay attention to them.

    There is only one reason I believe in afterlife and that is the fact that people who apparently die and come back report verified events that they could not possibly know. I don’t care whether you were dead or alive, if you can tell me where I was at a certain time, what I was wearing, what I was doing, what I said, and even what I was thinking and feeling, there is only one logical explanation and that is you must have been here at that time. If, however, at that very time your body was in another country, it follows that your consciousness has been here. Now if at the exact time there is a medical report that you had died, I have no other explanation but to conclude that your consciousness separated from your body, which means you are not your body and will survive its demise.

    If this happens once, I’d call it a fluke. When it happens millions of times, and I have read hundreds of such cases, I must accept it as evidence of the survival of consciousness or I would be intellectually dishonest.

    There are cases of born blind people claiming they could see in their NDE and people with autism and other handicaps saying they were healthy when they separated from their body.

  35. Ron says:

    jim,
    You seem to be searching for the truth and if you are sincerely doing it, you will certainly find it.

    The wars with the Zulu, Bantu, Native Indians, Comanche, Mohawks, Maori (they cannibalized their enemies) were deadly. The non-Christianised enemy had the numerical superiority.
    Most of the wars won by the French in North Africa, The British in the Indian Sub-continent was against all odds.

    Anyways watch this video of how God works. If you are in the States you may be able to interact and ascertain the truth

  36. jim2003sound says:

    Ron,

    Ive have mentioned before that a good example of a miracle is when the missing limb of a amputee is restored, you have given the most frivolous excuses for miracles that I have ever heard. Praying to Mickey Mouse will give the same chance result as praying to God. Ron you appear to be a God of the gaps merchant, now I would never wish ill upon you under any circumstances but in the event that you are unfortunate to experience a serious medical episode I suggest you apply your theory in practice, i.e., forgo science and pray for divine intervention to be cured. No Im sure reality will dawn and you will seek proper medical attention rather than play the lottery.

    You comment thus : “This is why Christian Europe could easily defeat the element-worshipping Maoris and Aboriginals; nature-worshipping Native Indians; tree and animal worshipping Africans; Elephant, Snake, Genitalia worshipping Hindus; Moon and devil-worshipping Muslims (Berbers, Arabs, Malays, Sumatrans, Javanese, Egyptians etc.) t is always been this way in history with a few exceptions.”

    All you achieved with this absurdity is to prove that a mechanised army usually conquers a ill equip indigenous tribe and on occasion practice a bit of genocide while their at it, yes and all in the name of a God. I will say one thing thats in your favour Ron and that is your are certainly consistent, yes you get it wrong every time.

  37. Ron says:

    Jim2003sound,

    If you read WWII history in depth you will realize that D-day itself was a miracle and a success considering that the Third Reich had the intelligence and knew the day and place but Hitler did not believe it.
    Miracles are not everyday events. There are many stories of angelic encounters in the concentration camps.

    God has given us humans free will and he does not police us (and so Auschwitz, Treblinka, Buchenwald, Rwanda, Serbia, Kampuchea incidents etc. can happen), but He will judge us and do his justice which may play out many times in this world but certainly in the afterlife.

    Prayers to Jesus with faith are always answered though it may not be as what the person who prays desires. God acts in his own time. God is not a genie and you cannot manipulate Him through prayers without faith.

    History has shown that the pagans and pagan armies praying to false gods were always losing to Christian Armies despite numerical superiority in men, arms and ammunition and the advantage of terrain knowledge.

    This is why Christian Europe could easily defeat the element-worshipping Maoris and Aboriginals; nature-worshipping Native Indians; tree and animal worshipping Africans; Elephant, Snake, Genitalia worshipping Hindus; Moon and devil-worshipping Muslims (Berbers, Arabs, Malays, Sumatrans, Javanese, Egyptians etc.)
    It is always been this way in history with a few exceptions.

    The Devil-worshipping cults (Islam) has defeated Pagans (Hindus, Buddhists, Africans, Balinese, Secularists, Atheists) etc.

    The Judeo-Christian forces have always defeated both the Devil-worshipping cults (Islam) and also the Pagans thus they (Christian West) colonized whole of Asia, Africa, Far-East, Oceania, Americas (North and South).

    We now see that as the erstwhile Christian West moving towards Atheism and Secularism and consequently they are facing defeats by devil-worshipping Islamists.

  38. jim2003sound says:

    Ron,
    In response to your video link, Angles saved victims from car crash.

    Without inquiring too deeply into this one in several million ‘supernatural’ event we have to ask what relevance does it have for the larger population of believers since you have more chance of winning the lottery in having your life saved through the intervention of angles. Consider the millions of Jews in concentration camps, how many of those victims were saved, answer, zero. Lets not even mention those in similar circumstances in America alone without venturing worldwide.

    Prayer has a proven success rate no greater than chance says little for the expression Pray and you will be saved, so a hit in the from of a verified account by survivors is a small consolation for the rest of us and hardly with surrendering your reason to it.

  39. Face_The_Truth says:

    This is HOW Christianism started:

    ‘GENESIS AND CHARACTER OF CHRISTIANITY

    Some historians in the West have serious doubts about the very existence of a man called “Jesus Christ”.

    And, almost all historians agree that if he existed at all, nothing can be known about his person or teaching because all contemporary sources, Christian and non-Christian, are either silent or unreliable regarding the subject.

    Thus, all we have is the “Jesus of the Gospels” which are now regarded as theological statements rather than a record of historical events.

    And “Jesus of the Gospels” is a questionable character!

    He makes tall claims about himself, and curses all those who do not accept those claims.

    He denounces his own people as sons of the Devil and killers of prophets.

    In due course, Christian theology came to proclaim that Jesus was the only-begotten son of the only true God the Father; that he had been sent down in order to wash with his own blood the sins of mankind by mounting the cross; that he had risen from the dead on the third day and appeared to his apostles in flesh and bones; that he was the same as his God the Father whose divinity he shared in full; that those who accepted him as the only saviour had all their sins washed by his blood; that he had entered his apostles as the holy ghost and entrusted them with the mission of saving all mankind from eternal hell-fire; that the Church founded by the apostles and joined by the converts was his body and bride; and that the whole world had been mandated to the Church by the father and the son and the holy ghost.

    What one finds striking about these ridiculous statements is that none of them can stand the test of human reason or experience!

    The Church declares them to be mysteries beyond the reach of human understanding.

    The apostles had tried to sell these “mysteries” to the Jews in Jerusalem.

    The only response they met was dismissal with contempt from the Jews.

    Next, the apostles tried these “mysteries” on Jewish communities settled in Syria, Asia Minor, and Greece.

    They had some small success, but most of the time met with considerable resistance.

    Finally, the apostles took this “merchandise” to the metropolitan mart at Rome where their business found some firm footing for the first time!

    It was in Rome that the methods of Christian missionary salesmanship were matured over a period of time.

    The structure of the Roman empire provided a model for the structure of the Church.

    The Christian missionaries got busy building a state within the state!

    In the next two centuries, the Church became a rich and powerful organization with members in many leading families of Rome.

    It found many adherents among politicians who wielded power, among military commanders who were superstitious or in need of political support, and among merchants who had money, but no brains for philosophical questions.

    The mother of Emperor Severus (222-235 AD) became a Christian.

    So did Emperor Philip the Arabian (244-249 AD).

    Helena, the mother of Emperor Constantine, was also a Christian convert.

    Now the Church extended the “Divine Right” to rule as a despot to anyone who was prepared to declare Christianity as the sole state religion and suppress all Pagan religions.

    Emperor Constantine who wanted to secure a dynastic succession for his family — a practice unknown to Roman politics so far — saw his opportunity in this new doctrine, and proclaimed in favour of the Church.

    The common people in Rome resisted this royal renegade.

    So, Constantine removed his capital from Rome to Byzantium which was renamed Constantinople!

    The precedent set by Emperor Constantine in consolidating a dynastic despotism with the help of the Church was copied by many crowned heads all over Europe in subsequent centuries.

    The king in Pagan societies was only the first among equals.

    The Church enabled him to become an unbridled autocrat who derived his authority not from the community over which he ruled, but from God the Father.

    The conflicts which developed between these autocrats and the powerful Church with a Pope at its head, came much later, after the common people all over Europe had been enslaved and deprived of their traditional institutions which safeguarded their fundamental freedoms.

    For quite some time, the Church cooperated with the kings to convert the common people everywhere into hewers of wood and drawers of water!

    This was just one part of the Christian history.

    Another was a large-scale destruction of ancient religions all over Europe, Asia Minor, and North Africa where the Church spread its tentacles with the help of despotic rulers.

    All Pagan schools were closed, all Pagan temples were demolished or converted into churches, and all Pagan images were publicly defiled and destroyed.

    Pagan books were burnt and Pagan priests were killed, mostly by Christian monks who led Christian mobs after lecturing them into fevered frenzy!

    That is how Christianity triumphed over Pagan religions and societies — not by the power of its moral or spiritual superiority or the logic of its doctrines, but by the power of the sword wielded by despicable Christian despots.’

    This is HOW Islam started:

    ‘GENESIS AND CHARACTER OF ISLAM

    Muhammad followed in the footsteps of Jesus in making the same sort of claims for himself, cursing his own people in the choicest language of “Mono-Theism”, and threatening them with slaughter.

    Muhammad, however, did not have to struggle against a centralized state when he found that his prophethood had no attraction for the Pagan people of Mecca.

    Muhammad migrated to Yathrib — was later renamed “Medina” from Madinat al’Nabi — which was more receptive to “Mono-Theism” because of a large presence of Jews in that town (i.e., Yathrib), and emerged as a powerful potentate.

    Muhammad, however, ended by exiling or brutally killing en masse the Jewish “Mono-Theist” populations of Yathrib which resisted him as soon as he came out in his true colors!

    Meanwhile, Muhammad had amassed much wealth by plundering merchant caravans and scattered Pagan Arab settlements.

    Muhammad created the nucleus of a standing army out of the toughs and desperados who flocked to him in increasing numbers for committing crimes and sharing the loot.

    In short, Muhammad built the apparatus of a military state in “Medina” and used it for imposing his closed creed on the tribal settlements of Pagan Arabia by means of armed force.

    The doctrines of Islam were tailored to the needs of this galloping tyranny, and sold with the help of the sword.

    And the sword was stamped with the name of an almighty “Allah” in whose service the ancient religion and culture of Arabia were destroyed root and branch.’

  40. Ron says:

    Watch this miracle and know that Jesus is real and Jesus is God

  41. Ron says:

    This Atheist died and then….

  42. Face_The_Truth says:

    =====================================================================
    I see the Bible as a gold mine. In the best mines, there is more dirt than gold. The challenge is to know the difference. It is a mistake to throw away the god for the presence of the dirt just as it is a mistake to hold unto every word of the Bible as the word of God.
    =====================================================================

    The above sentences are imbecilic at the core and written by a pure imbecile at best, to say the least here.

    History disproves any divinity of the dead son of a local Jewish whore 2000 years ago!

    There are many people on earth who have found only garbage, not gold or platinum or diamond in the “Super Holy” Jewish-Christian Bible.

    Historically, Judaism & Christianism endorsed human slavery and proudly practiced human slave-trades along with followers of Islam.

    I do not have time right now; otherwise, I could have gone in further details here.

    =====================================================================

    William Benjamin Smith, “Ecce Deus: Studies of Primitive Christianity”, London, 1912

    l. Gordon Rylands, “Did Jesus Ever Live?”, Watts & Co., London, 1929

    William James Durant, “The Story of Civilization, Part III, Caesar and Christ”, Fourth Printing, New York, 1944

    Paul Johnson, “A History of Christianity”, Penguin Books, London, 1978

    Michael Thomas Walter Arnheim, “Is Christianity True?”, London, 1984

    George Albert Wells, “Did Jesus Exist?”, Second Edition, London, 1986

    Daniel Edwin Barker, “Losing Faith in Faith: From Preacher to Atheist”, Fourth Printing, Freedom From Religion Foundation, Inc., USA, 2003

    =====================================================================

    LINK

    http://www.kyroot.com/

    LINK

    https://infidels.org/library/modern/paul_carlson/nt_contradictions.html

    LINK

    http://infidels.org/library/modern/keith_parsons/whynotchristian.html

    LINK

    http://markhumphrys.com/christianity.killings.html

    LINK

    http://ideonexus.com/2012/02/12/101-reasons-why-evolution-is-true/

    LINK

    http://www.drabruzzi.com/ZINDLER-JESUS.PDF

    LINK

    https://orphicplatonism.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/jesus-christ-an-artifice-for-aggression-by-sita-ram-goel.pdf

    LINK

    http://www.jesusneverexisted.com/

    LINK

    http://www.i4m.com/think/bible/historical_jesus.htm

    LINK

    https://www.atheists.org/activism/resources/did-jesus-exist/

    LINK

    https://www.onfaith.co/onfaith/author/paula-kirby

    =====================================================================

  43. Ali Sina says:

    Jim,

    Good points. After leaving Islam I read the Bible and because of these and many other teachings I decided this book is not from God and since I did not find truth in any religion, including Buddhism and Hinduism by default I became an agnostic while in reality I denied the very existence of God.

    When I came across the stories of NDE and did my utter best to explain them away as subjective and failed I had no choice but to accept that God is real. The fact that many ND experiencers come back with verifiable accounts of what they saw when they were supposedly dead makes it impossible to deny these people had an actual out of body experience and remain intellectually honest. They claim to have seen a non-judgmental loving God and Jesus, not an angry deity as depicted in the Old Testament.

    So how could I reconcile the fact that God exists with the filth in the Bible? The only way to make sense of it is to admit that the Bible is not the word of God. This I knew already. I had read a book called Who Wrote the Bible by Richard E. Friedman who makes a very compelling argument that the Old Testament was written centuries after the alleged Moses. In fact when I read the book of Leviticus I felt this book is written by the Rabbis so they can be taken good care of. The Old Testament is not the word of God. It is a collection of diverse religious teachings. The Book of Job for example is obviously a translation of a long poem about a man who lost everything and his conversation with his friends. At the end of the book God appears and rebukes everyone while giving his version of the events. If anyone wants to find an excuse not to believe in God, I recommend the book of Job. In this story God brags to Satan about his obedient servant faithfulness and Satan dismisses it saying it is easy for one who has everything to love you. Take away his wealth and children and he will curse you and God authorizes Satan to take away the wealth and kill the children of Job and send infirmities to him to test his faith.
    This story must have impressed the ancient folk. It hardly makes rational people of this day and age believe in such wanton god.
    As for the New Testament, it is also a collection of many stories and letters of the apostles. I have no doubt of the sincerity and devotion of Paul, Peter and other early believers. But we have to understand that these men do not speak for God. They tell the believers their own understanding of Christ.
    The message of Jesus is in the Gospels. I asked you to find one filth in the teachings of Christ. Even then we must not assume that the Gospels are the word of God or infallible. These books were written by men who gave the account of the coming of Christ to earth in the best way they understood it. It is not unlikely that they incorporated some myths and legends into their story. A good part of the doctrine of Christianity is based on fables. I hope God give me the knowledge to write a book on this subject. Yes, I believe in miracles but I do not believe in absurdity. The belief in God must be rational or it is not true.
    I see the Bible as a gold mine. In the best mines, there is more dirt than gold. The challenge is to know the difference. It is a mistake to throw away the god for the presence of the dirt just as it is a mistake to hold unto every word of the Bible as the word of God.
    Words are containers of ideas. As believers, we must look at the message of Jesus, without getting trapped in words of his disciples.
    I read the Bible now and I can find the gold while ignoring the dirt.

  44. Ron says:

    When you look at groups of people in remote regions and the customs they followed before Christianity touched them you will be surprised to know the evil which was being practiced ignorantly, purposefully or religiously (influenced by paganism).

    Where do you think they learnt this in-human practices if man was born with innate goodness?

    1) The Eskimos (Inuit) would leave their old (parents) and the sick on ice-floats to die by the elements or eaten by wild-life. (
    2) Korowai, Mbuti, Pygmies are human tribes which still do cannibalism. The original inhabitants of Fiji, Solomon Islands, New Guinea and many parts of Africa were rampantly doing Hunting and then Cannibalism. i.e. Hunting other humans for food. It was OK for them as humans were a staple diet.
    3) Eating a dead person is OK among many cults like the Hindu Aghoris which is still practiced today.
    4) Sati- live burnings of widows in India
    5) Thugging – Highway robbery and mass killing as a profession in India
    6) Devadasi -Child prostitution in India

    This is apart from Child sacrifices which were going on all over the world (Europe, China, Americas, Asia, Africa, Australia) in the pre-Christian era and still goes on now in some Native Indian cultures, Mayans, Aztecs, places in India, Africa etc.
    This means man is not innately good. Its only through Christ you are moving towards perfection in goodness.
    The Bible records history and human events of murder, incest. It records the statements made by historical figures, prophets and incidents. It Cain murders Abel, it does not mean you have to murder someone.

    You need to follow Jesus because Jesus said that He is the Way, The Truth and Life.

    You will never find anything wrong in Jesus teachings. In fact, his teachings are of the highest moral standards across all human cultures and across all ages.

  45. Jim Hawkins says:

    In response to Ron’s request for example of filth in the bible, here’s the top 10 …………………………..

    No. 1:St Paul’s advice about whether women are allowed to teach men in church:
    “I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent.” (1 Timothy 2:12)
    No. 2: In this verse, Samuel, one of the early leaders of Israel, orders genocide against a neighbouring people:
    “This is what the Lord Almighty says… ‘Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’” (1 Samuel 15:3)
    No. 3: A command of Moses:
    “Do not allow a sorceress to live.” (Exodus 22:18)
    No. 4: The ending of Psalm 137, a psalm which was made into a disco calypso hit by Boney M, is often omitted from readings in church:
    “Happy is he who repays you for what you have done to us – he who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks.” (Psalm 137:9)
    No. 5: Another blood-curdling tale from the Book of Judges, where an Israelite man is trapped in a house by a hostile crowd, and sends out his concubine to placate them:
    “So the man took his concubine and sent her outside to them, and they raped her and abused her throughout the night, and at dawn they let her go. At daybreak the woman went back to the house where her master was staying, fell down at the door and lay there until daylight. When her master got up in the morning and opened the door of the house and stepped out to continue on his way, there lay his concubine, fallen in the doorway of the house, with her hands on the threshold. He said to her, ‘Get up; let’s go.’ But there was no answer. Then the man put her on his donkey and set out for home.” (Judges 19:25-28)
    No. 6: St Paul condemns homosexuality in the opening chapter of the Book of Romans:
    “In the same way also the men, giving up natural intercourse with women, were consumed with passion for one another. Men committed shameless acts with men and received in their own persons the due penalty for their error.” (Romans 1:27)
    No. 7: In this story from the Book of Judges, an Israelite leader, Jephthah, makes a rash vow to God, which has to be carried out:
    “And Jephthah made a vow to the Lord, and said, ‘If you will give the Ammonites into my hand, then whoever comes out of the doors of my house to meet me, when I return victorious from the Ammonites, shall be the Lord’s, to be offered up by me as a burnt-offering.’ Then Jephthah came to his home at Mizpah; and there was his daughter coming out to meet him with timbrels and with dancing. She was his only child; he had no son or daughter except her. When he saw her, he tore his clothes, and said, ‘Alas, my daughter! You have brought me very low; you have become the cause of great trouble to me. For I have opened my mouth to the Lord, and I cannot take back my vow.’” (Judges 11:30-1, 34-5)
    No. 8: The Lord is speaking to Abraham in this story where God commands him to sacrifice his son:
    ‘Take your son, your only son Isaac, whom you love, and go to the land of Moriah, and offer him there as a burnt-offering on one of the mountains that I shall show you.’ (Genesis 22:2)
    No. 9: “Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord.” (Ephesians 5:22)
    No. 10: “Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to the good and gentle but also to the cruel.” (1 Peter 2:18)

  46. Ali Sina says:

    Jim,

    Actually, most killings were not done by atheists but by Devil worshipping Muslims. It is estimated that during these 1400 years Muslims massacred some 280 million non-Muslims. The number of people they killed among each other is probably more.

    Christians also did some killings although that number pales in comparison. As I discussed in my book Understanding Muhammad and Muslims, the Catholic church was heavily influenced by Islam. The crusades were a response to jihad and the inquisition was a copycat of mihnah, which means the same and was launched by Caliph al Ma’moun, an “Islamic reformist” who advocated for rationalism. No kidding!

    The difference is that while we can find hundreds of direct instructions in the Quran to murder the unbelievers, be harsh with them, not to take them as friends and allies, crucify them, shun them, abuse them as second-class citizens, banish them, etc., there is not a single such instruction in the teachings of Christ. While Muhammad cursed his detractors, Jesus forgave his killers on the cross.

    There are good and bad people born in all religions. But when Christians decide to follow Jesus they start orphanages, help the needy and become Mother Theresa. When Muslims decide to follow Muhammad, they start killing others and become Bin Laden. Muslims pay more to “charities” But Islamic charities are not charity at all. They are to recruit more jihadis. The families of terrorists are compensated to encourage more terrorists to join the cause. The difference is in the teachings. It is intellectually dishonest to lump all religions together and pass the same verdict. We do not lump together political views as diverse as democracy and fascism. Why would we lump together religions as diverse as Islam and Christianity? The people in these two faiths don’t even believe in the same God.

    I challenge you to show me one “filth” in the teachings of Christ. Show me where did he encourage his followers to hate others, to kill or to abuse his detractors. Did he not urge them to forgive their enemies, to turn the other cheek, to love all mankind?

    Christ did not advocate abandoning justice. The courts have their place and Christians must strive to stop injustice and abuse. Yet we know that is not enough. Human justice will forever be imperfect. There are cases where justice cannot be applied. How can we bring justice to the people in North Korea where dissidents are jailed for three generations? Children are born in prison for alleged crimes perpetrated by their parents, who grow up and marry in prisons and their children remain in prison for life. They are slaves of the state and provide free labor for the dictator. And if we go to liberate the people we may end up killing millions. In Islamic countries such as in Iran, countless people spend decades in prisons for crimes of faith or for political inconformity.

    The fact that we know there is a divine justice does not exonerate us to seek justice in the world. In fact, that is a commandment.

    Yes, love and compassion is innate, in humans and in animals. We are souls and all souls are breath of God. We all possess the essence of God in us, which is love. The point of coming to this world is to put to work that love and make it grow.

  47. Jim Hawkins says:

    Ron,

    Your comments ” Stalin, Mao, Enver Hoxha who were all atheists killed over 100 million people between them ” Ironically I see a commonality between these psychopaths and Jesus and that is they attract the same type of sycophants, slavish, unquestioning, followers waiting for a crumb to fall off the table. You are probably right when you say the atheists may have killed more than the religious wars fought in the name of the Gods in their race to to score highest in mans inhumanity to man.

    Now,I can almost hear you say from the religious perspective “Oh well thats people misinterpreting the bible/koran, etc” No its not, all the filth is there in black and white in those publications. To the credit of christians that have applied their innate human morals and steered away from the divine ones by invoking the misinterpretation clause.

    Ron, I share your frustration that major perpetrators seem to benefit from immunity, unfortunately I am not consoled by celestial justice, I want it now and take my comfort from the emerging activities of the International courts, my only concern is that good people like yourself may decline support for these institutions on the bases that there is no need to fret because they will meet their divine justice so why don’t we all just sit back and relax.

    Undoubtedly the religious have contributed greatly to the alleviate poverty and hunger, but lets not forget the other side of that coin, i.e., the UN, the World Heath Organisation, America and the contribution of other countries and non religious organisation.

    Im confounded by your indifference to the human decency and morality that we all process through thousands of years of evolution. You are determined to remove what is innate in us humans and gift it to the invisible, even some animal species have the ability to show compassion and mourn their dead.It is this great injustice that I object to most and what prompts me to challenge this degeneration of human worth wherever I encounter it.

  48. Ron says:

    Stalin, Mao, Enver Hoxha who were all atheists killed over 100 million people between them and were praised as great statesmen by their countrymen and even by relatives of the victims because their crimes were never exposed during their period of power.

    Our worldly system could not give justice to their victims, but we know there is and there should be another ultimate justice system which will give judgement and justice in afterlife.
    If it is not there then God is not there and the ends justifies the means. Then it is survival of the fittest. We will have alpha males amongst us. Few strong and brutal people having many wives and the meek having none. It justifies the law of the jungle but because we are all made in the image of God we all have the potential to have compassion, love, empathy etc. and are sharing and caring.
    At the same time, we are tempted by the evil one and as such humans tend to be dishonest, uncaring, selfish, sinful and do crimes.

    It is only when you have Christ in you and follow his teachings then you will be loving and compassionate to a degree that it may hurt you but you will be generous and compassionate and loving specially towards the sick, poor, dying, destitute, orphans and widows etc.

    When you note that
    1) Majority of NDA cases have reported encounter with Jesus in Heaven (Many of them were non-Christians)
    2) Most charity in the world is done by Christians (Majority of charity receivers are
    non-Christians)
    3) Most first adoptions (first child adoption) is done by Christians. (Muslims do the least adoptions)
    4) Most second adoptions (second Child adoption) is done overwhelmingly the Christians.
    5) Eighty percent of fostering of children is done by Christians.
    6) Ninety percent of leprosy homes in the world even in non-Christian countries is run by Christians (though the inmates/patients are non-Christian)
    7) Ninety percent of the AIDS homes all over the world are run by Christians. (though the inmates/patients are non-Christian)
    8) Seventy percent of the orphanages in the world are run by Christians.
    9) Seventy percent of the free hospitals in the world are run by Christians.
    10) This is what Jesus taught. To forgive, love, have compassion, feed the hungry, clothe the naked, take care of the sick, downtrodden and widows, orphans, poor, destitute.
    11) Whatever you do to the least of my brethren that you do unto me.

    then you know that Jesus is the way, the truth and life.

  49. Ali Sina says:

    Jim,

    It is not cynical. It is an observable and measurable fact. There are exceptions to every rule but the rule is that dishonesty pays off in this world. People who do not believe in afterlife are not automatically dishonest but there is nothing logical from evolutionary and survival point of view to make them honest. Tell me one rational reason why someone should not steal when no one would ever find out and the person from whom he steals has lots of money. Thieves always justify their dishonesty.

    Or forget dishonesty. Let us talk about violence. People who engage in terrorism, like Muslims, or this Bernie supporter who went into a sporting fund raising event to shoot Republicans, always justify their crime. They see themselves as victims and justify violence against those “evil” people who have victimized them. How can you argue with them that they are wrong? They are convinced that they are righteous people and those who disagree with them must be eliminated for the good of humanity.

    Society is made of individuals and individuals who have no conscience make a hellish world. Conscience is a spiritual quality. Do to others as you would like them do to you is a great teaching. For me, and I believe also for you, it comes natural. However, even good people can be persuaded that they are victimized and should take their revenge. Millions of ordinary Germans committed or condoned the most horrendous crimes against Jews, Gypsies and homosexuals because they were led to believe they are their enemy. Al Jazeera took an online poll where 61,000 Arab speaking Muslims voted., Over 81% of them agreed with ISIS, i.e. terrorizing the non-Muslims, beheading them and violating their basic human rights. The majority of Muslims hate non-Muslims. Don’t believe in their deception and false smiles. They hate you because you are not a Muslim and deeply rejoice in your calamity. Why? They are human just like us. What makes them so demonic? It is their indoctrination that inculcates in them the sense of victimhood.

    So, you cannot rely on conscience alone. Muslims will behead you, rape your wife and stand in prayer the next moment praising their god with no pang of conscience. They tank him for empowering them to kill you.

    The liberals claim they are for tolerance, freedom and equality. They most likely are so convinced of their own righteousness that they gladly lynch anyone who has an opinion contrary to theirs. Look what is happening in America and particularly in university campuses where liberals rule. They form antifascist groups to do exactly what fascists do and they do not see the irony.

    Without real divine guidance, the world will be a hell. I am not talking about religion. Jesus was not religious. He came to get rid of all religions so we can have a relationship with our heavenly father. We need that relationship.

    I sometimes think, would I have murdered my ex-partner who stole everything and left me holding the bag with debts to pay that I could not if I could get away with it. Probably I would and since at that time I believed that this world is all that there is, I would have felt justified. After all it was justice and I was doing a favor to this man’s future victims. Many murders happened because people justify them and sometimes they are right. The point is that you always think you are right even when you are not and you can never know the difference.

    Only when we realize this world is only a playing ground and the reality is elsewhere, only when we understand that the purpose of life is not to become the wealthiest person in the cemetery but to love, we will become forgiving, caring people.

  50. Jim Hawkins says:

    Ali,
    Your statement ” In this world, it pays to be dishonest. Crooked people get ahead while honest people often have difficulty to provide for themselves and their family.” Thats a very cynical and disingenuous view of your fellow human and ignores the inherent decency thats within is us all, Im excluding psychopaths here. Are we to assume that those that get on are to be treated with distain. Ali ,your faith causes you to desert your own humanity in your quest to become godlike, what a cheerless prospect to look forward to a world without humour.

    I wish you well as you climb the spiritual afterlife ladder and hope you achieve that most cherished position of vice God in that heavenly organisation of your making.

  51. Ron says:

    This Atheist Doctors story is compelling evidence NDE, Jesus

  52. Face_The_Truth says:

    Here are my 2 cents!

    Ali Muhammad Amir Abd’Allah Umar Salehi ibn Sina both twists and confounds “Science” and “non-Science”.

    “Science” requires measurement; that means, if something cannot be measured, that something is not science.

    If someone says, s/he hears voices in her/his head that tells her/him to do or carry out certain activities, my professional clinical response to her/him would be “I hear no such voices in my head.”

    So-called “Near-Death Experience” is utterly a subjective matter — if at all — where 99.99% of world’s humans do not “Experience” it.

    If I say, every day in a month almighty God — whatever That is doesn’t matter — appears outside my apartment window and illuminates my entire room and I see (i.e., “I Experience”) the almighty God in the form of very bright illumination of my room, skeptic people will most likely first tell me to get my head examined by a Board-certified psychiatrist.

    But, if I counter those people by saying that my God is the Sun that sustains all life forms on earth, then those skeptic people might feel I was just using an allegory by using the word “God” or “Savitā” or “Aditya” to describe an utterly everyday natural phenomenon that happens almost automatically and that actually has nothing to do with Middle Eastern concepts of “Jehovah”, “God the Father”, “Son of God” (i.e., the dead son of a local Jewish whore!), or one and only “Allah” of Muhammad the Arabian bastard.

    The very basic problem with Ali Muhammad Amir Abd’Allah Umar Salehi ibn Sina is he is a Muslim by birth; but, he has consciously rejected his birth-religion and that particular action of his (i.e., rejection of one’s birth-religion) torments him from inside and, as a result, he seeks “Super-Natural Explanations” to uplift his internal darkness in his sub-conscious mind.

    For not more than 20 seconds there could be sufficient oxygenated-blood inside an immediately decapitated human head from the rest of her body to retain consciousness and, that means, if able to speak only an immediately decapitated human head can properly tell Ali Muhammad Amir Abd’Allah Umar Salehi ibn Sina whether Ali Muhammad Amir Abd’Allah Umar Salehi ibn Sina is right or wrong in the quest for “Life after death”.

    Although common-sense is not so common now-a-days, my readers might like to use their basic common-sense when analyzing so-called Middle Eastern “Mono-Theism” where the one and only “Creator of the Universe” impregnates a local Jewish whore in order to send Her/His “Divine Messages” to billions of world’s humans by “Promising” them “Eternal Life In Heaven After Death On Earth” for following certain primitive commands!

    My common-sense tells me that, if there is a one and only “Creator of the Universe”, S/He would do no such thing.

  53. JustGuest says:

    I got a little story, about a kids who argue with his father.

    1. Son: “Father, Why you don’t let me enter your house? Why I must forgive my sister? She is an evil to me. She makes me sad.”
    Father: “My Son, my house are not e place to fight. Remove your anger because I also want your sister to enter my house. Be in peace with her because I also love her like I love you. Both of you are my kids.”

    Mat 6:14  For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: 
    Mat 6:15  But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses. 

    The Parable of the Unforgiving Servant

    Mat 18:21  Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times? 
    Mat 18:22  Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven. 
    Mat 18:23  Therefore is the kingdom of heaven likened unto a certain king, which would take account of his servants. 
    Mat 18:24  And when he had begun to reckon, one was brought unto him, which owed him ten thousand talents. 
    Mat 18:25  But forasmuch as he had not to pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, and his wife, and children, and all that he had, and payment to be made. 
    Mat 18:26  The servant therefore fell down, and worshipped him, saying, Lord, have patience with me, and I will pay thee all. 
    Mat 18:27  Then the lord of that servant was moved with compassion, and loosed him, and forgave him the debt. 
    Mat 18:28  But the same servant went out, and found one of his fellowservants, which owed him an hundred pence: and he laid hands on him, and took him by the throat, saying, Pay me that thou owest. 
    Mat 18:29  And his fellowservant fell down at his feet, and besought him, saying, Have patience with me, and I will pay thee all. 
    Mat 18:30  And he would not: but went and cast him into prison, till he should pay the debt. 
    Mat 18:31  So when his fellowservants saw what was done, they were very sorry, and came and told unto their lord all that was done. 
    Mat 18:32  Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me: 
    Mat 18:33  Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee? 
    Mat 18:34  And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him. 
    Mat 18:35  So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses.

    2. Son: “Father, why some people can not bear to enter your house?”
    Father: “Son, They have been tricked by devil to run away from me and this house and I cant open the door because they are not knocking this door. They knocking the devil door. That’s why I will use you and your sister to call them, to remind them about the wrong door they chosen, but dont force them. I want them to enter my house with their own heart.”

    Mat 11:28  Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 
    Mat 11:29  Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. 
    Mat 11:30  For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light. 

    3. Son: “Father, I dont believe about your house?”
    Father:”Son, you are stubborn kids. You dont believe even when your sister tell you which house are my house. You dont believe until you meet me myself. When I walk out from the door, not for taking all of you into my house because I already call all my kids into my house. I go out to destroy the other house, to proclaimed the world into mine, that I am the only and the real ruler. The time will come when I go out not for save what left behind but to punish them because they are stubborn kids who dont believe me and my messenger.”

    The Parable of the Tenants
    Mat 21:33  Hear another parable: There was a certain householder, which planted a vineyard, and hedged it round about, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country: 
    Mat 21:34  And when the time of the fruit drew near, he sent his servants to the husbandmen, that they might receive the fruits of it. 
    Mat 21:35  And the husbandmen took his servants, and beat one, and killed another, and stoned another. 
    Mat 21:36  Again, he sent other servants more than the first: and they did unto them likewise. 
    Mat 21:37  But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son. 
    Mat 21:38  But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance. 
    Mat 21:39  And they caught him, and cast him out of the vineyard, and slew him. 
    Mat 21:40  When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen? 
    Mat 21:41  They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.

    Sorry my english..not my everyday language

  54. Guest says:

    I got a little story, about a kids who argue with his father.

    1. Son: “Father, Why you don’t let me enter your house? Why I must forgive my sister? She is an evil to me. She makes me sad.”
    Father: “My Son, my house are not e place to fight. Remove your anger because I also want your sister to enter my house. Be in peace with her because I also love her like I love you. Both of you are my kids.”

    Mat 6:14  For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: 
    Mat 6:15  But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses. 

    The Parable of the Unforgiving Servant

    Mat 18:21  Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times? 
    Mat 18:22  Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven. 
    Mat 18:23  Therefore is the kingdom of heaven likened unto a certain king, which would take account of his servants. 
    Mat 18:24  And when he had begun to reckon, one was brought unto him, which owed him ten thousand talents. 
    Mat 18:25  But forasmuch as he had not to pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, and his wife, and children, and all that he had, and payment to be made. 
    Mat 18:26  The servant therefore fell down, and worshipped him, saying, Lord, have patience with me, and I will pay thee all. 
    Mat 18:27  Then the lord of that servant was moved with compassion, and loosed him, and forgave him the debt. 
    Mat 18:28  But the same servant went out, and found one of his fellowservants, which owed him an hundred pence: and he laid hands on him, and took him by the throat, saying, Pay me that thou owest. 
    Mat 18:29  And his fellowservant fell down at his feet, and besought him, saying, Have patience with me, and I will pay thee all. 
    Mat 18:30  And he would not: but went and cast him into prison, till he should pay the debt. 
    Mat 18:31  So when his fellowservants saw what was done, they were very sorry, and came and told unto their lord all that was done. 
    Mat 18:32  Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me: 
    Mat 18:33  Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee? 
    Mat 18:34  And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him. 
    Mat 18:35  So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses.

    2. Son: “Father, why some people can not bear to enter your house?”
    Father: “Son, They have been tricked by devil to run away from me and this house and I cant open the door because they are not knocking this door. They knocking the devil door. That’s why I will use you and your sister to call them, to remind them about the wrong door they chosen, but dont force them. I want them to enter my house with their own heart.”

    Mat 11:28  Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 
    Mat 11:29  Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. 
    Mat 11:30  For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light. 

    3. Son: “Father, I dont believe about your house?”
    Father:”Son, you are stubborn kids. You dont believe even when your sister tell you which house are my house. You dont believe until you meet me myself. When I walk out from the door, not for taking all of you into my house because I already call all my kids into my house. I go out to destroy the other house, to proclaimed the world into mine, that I am the only and the real ruler. The time will come when I go out not for save what left behind but to punish them because they are stubborn kids who dont believe me and my messenger.”

    The Parable of the Tenants
    Mat 21:33  Hear another parable: There was a certain householder, which planted a vineyard, and hedged it round about, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country: 
    Mat 21:34  And when the time of the fruit drew near, he sent his servants to the husbandmen, that they might receive the fruits of it. 
    Mat 21:35  And the husbandmen took his servants, and beat one, and killed another, and stoned another. 
    Mat 21:36  Again, he sent other servants more than the first: and they did unto them likewise. 
    Mat 21:37  But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son. 
    Mat 21:38  But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance. 
    Mat 21:39  And they caught him, and cast him out of the vineyard, and slew him. 
    Mat 21:40  When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen? 
    Mat 21:41  They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.

    Sorry my english..not my everyday language.

  55. nderf.org is a good place to start reading NDEs.

  56. I agree with you Jim on one thing, that Ron’s analogy of two twins is not a good one here. The analogy is okay if he intends it in some other way rather than as an argument for convincing skeptics.

    But, the problem is that we can confidently bloat about life after delivery because we all are living in a post-delivery world. The arguments for life after death (I prefer to use the term “consciousness after death”) has to come from a more rationalist POV.

    The evidence is indeed the vast body of data called NDEs. The best way to be convinced is to read some random 30-100 of those maybe. Then try to dig deeper into the cases that are claimed to be verified or veridical.

  57. Besides, apart from those “verified” cases, the main body of evidence is this:

    Tens of thousands of people, from all parts of the world, all kinds of cultures, religions etc etc, report hovering over their bodies and witnessing what was going on from a third person POV, and surprise, with such enormous clarity that their earthly lives felt like a dream. This is the key that distinguishes NDEs from the average hallucinations – in NDEs you have innumerable cases where there was little to no element of fear involved and their experience was EXTRA real. Almost all these experiencers claim that these events happened DURING when they were physically lying down flat out (normally with little to no brain function) and this is why a rational mind should think whether the skeptics who say “these are all post-recovery experiences” are really correct? The testimonies of NDE ers clearly suggest otherwise. The “dying brain theory” is even more absurd as the brain cannot really make up such detailed experiences with ultra clarity in those 30 seconds when a person is shifting from his normal state to the outwardly unconscious state.

  58. Jim Hawkins, NDEs do provide verifiable evidence. I can give you two good examples –

    1) Check Pam Reynolds’ case – She was undergoing a surgery for a brain lesion and her entire blood had been drained out of her brain. Yet, she claims to have floated out of her body, seeing what was happening with extra clarity compared to real life, and here is the key part – once she was out of her surgery, she described what happened during the surgery with such an accuracy that astonished her own surgeon. You can see her surgeon’s testimony too.

    2) There is one verified case of “consciousness separating from brain when the person was being resusciated” published in a medical journal Resuscitation Journal. The case was part of a large study of cardiac arrest NDEs, lead by Sam Parnia – called AWARE. As you read through the paper, please analyse the data critically without borrowing their conclusions. The data clearly shows that one person (whose case is of interest here) provided astonishingly accurate details of what happened when he was “physically” definitely unconscious.

    You can download the paper for free here: http://www.horizonresearch.org/Uploads/Journal_Resuscitation__2_.pdf

    The paper can be downloaded from the journal here as well but its paid: http://www.resuscitationjournal.com/article/S0300-9572(14)00739-4/abstract

    Now, if you dig down deep at a scholarly level, you can find about 300 such verifiable cases that have been documented, but that will require a search beyond the internet.

  59. Ali Sina says:

    Jim, Ron’s analogy is good. Yes we know, the unborn twins do not have such conversations. But it is an analogy that makes the point clear. Just as the fetus spends nine months in the womb to develop physical limbs that they do not need there but are important in this world, we are here to develop spiritual limbs that may not seem useful to some in this world but are essential in the other world. Here, we are better off if we are selfish and step over others to get ahead. It is clear that those who do that are more successful from the worldly standard. Being altruistic is something that only help us grow spiritually.
    The fetus does not need eyes, legs or hands in the womb. The suffering of not having them become obvious only after delivery. Likewise, it is only after we die that it becomes clear to us the purpose of life was not to amass wealth but to become more Godlike.

    Knowing that there is an afterlife is not an intellectual curiosity, like knowing whether there is life on Mars or not. That knowledge has very little effect in our lives. The afterlife reveals the very purpose of our lives. There is nothing more important than that. It also makes the world a better place. When people are more loving they do not hurt each other. But that is just a bonus. The real benefit is reaped after we leave this world.

  60. Jim Hawkins says:

    Ron,

    Can we really call your story of the two unborn babies a analogy, Id say its more of a little story complete with the intellect of the unborn and wouldn’t pass muster for those passed sucking their thumbs, maybe its best if you stick to quoting numbers from that other story book.

  61. Ron says:

    In a mother’s womb were two babies. The analogy will set you searching for God.

    One asked the other: “Do you believe in life after delivery?”
    The other replies, “Why, of course. There must be something after delivery. Maybe we are here to prepare ourselves for what we will be later.”

    “Nonsense,” says the other. “There is no life after delivery. What would that life be?”
    “I don’t know, but there will be more light than here. Maybe we will walk with our legs and eat from our mouths.”

    The other says, “This is absurd! Walking is impossible. And eat with our mouths? Ridiculous. The umbilical cord supplies nutrition. Life after delivery is to be excluded. The umbilical cord is too short. After delivery, it is the end”
    “I think there is something and maybe it’s different than it is here,” “Maybe it is the beginning of some other journey” the other replies.

    “No one has ever come back from there. Delivery is the end of life, and in the after-delivery it is nothing but darkness and anxiety and it takes us nowhere because we cease to exist”
    “Well, I don’t know,” says the other, “but certainly we will see mother and she will take care of us.”

    “Mother??” You believe in mother? Where is she now?”
    “Well, she is all around us. It is in her that we live. Without her there would not be this world.”

    “I don’t see her, so it’s only logical that she doesn’t exist.”
    To which the other replied, “Sometimes when you’re in silence you can hear her, you can perceive her. I believe there is a reality after delivery and we are here to prepare ourselves for that reality or another journey….”

    “There is no scientific evidence to Mummy so Mummy does not exist. Or I would rather say Mummy exists only for those who believe she exists. You are a fool”
    “Ok tell me. If all the knowledge that exists in our world (womb) was 100%. How much knowledge do we have or use”

    The non-believer baby replies “Well we may be using only 10% of knowledge because we don’t know so many things like the biology, or the chemistry and other sciences. We don’t know why we sleep and sometimes why we jerk, Why we dream.?

    “Good, so we can agree that Mummy does not exist in this 10% (known) knowledge of our universe (womb), can it be possible that Mummy exists in the remaining 90% (unknown) knowledge?
    “Yes, it is theoretically possible or rather probable” concedes the non-believer baby.

    Do we have all the knowledge in us that we can say with hundred percent surety that Mummy does not exist? She could exist maybe outside our realm of knowledge and maybe she is the one feeding us through this tubes in an intelligent design to take care of us and prepare us for our next journey.”

    “I know the water around us is decreasing and we are growing up fast and we are now fighting for space and at this rate we just die. And there would ne nothing after this.”

    “I strongly believe that there is life after this and Mummy will take care of us.”
    “You are just a religious nut” said the non-believer baby.

    Could it be possible that you are a die-hard atheist who is not even thinking of the probability of Mummy (God) existing? said the theist baby.

    1 Corinthians 8:6
    Yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist.

  62. Ali Sina says:

    Have you been in the other world? Those who have been there and came back say heaven is not a resort to relax. Souls have tasks to do and there are ranks. Bigger souls have higher ranks. In fact, some souls are so evolved that they go beyond the heaven.
    The goal is not just make it to the heaven but to acquire more spiritual qualities. The spiritual qualities we develop here actually do not help us here a lot. In this world, it pays to be dishonest. Crooked people get ahead while honest people often have difficulty to provide for themselves and their family.
    If we want to work for God, we must be trustworthy. Once we have proven here that we are trustworthy with other people’s money, wife, and belonging, He can trust us with the treasures of heaven. “Whoever can be trusted with little can also be trusted with much, and the person who is dishonest in secular things will also be dishonest in spiritual things.” (Luke 16:10)
    God does not run His universe by fiat. He has a large organization and trusted souls work for him. God’s organization is to spread love. The more spiritual qualities you amass in this world the higher will be your rank in the other world.

  63. Jim Hawkins says:

    Ali, If our purpose on earth is to tackle the difficulties that life throws at us in order to toughen our spiritual condition in preparation for a apparent afterlife where you don’t need what you have struggled to overcome as in your example “To exercise forgiveness, you must face injustice You come here to face injustice in order to learn forgiveness.” Now this begs the question why would we need to exercise forgiveness in a perfect afterlife where forgiveness is redundant because there is no injustice.

    Is there some inequality in your concept in that human diversity produces various levels of attributes, some people are strong some are not, our mental hospitals are full of people who could not bear the trials of life never mind those that died in infancy. Does your concept dismiss this population as having failed the afterlife entry exam.

    Your statement “It is true that I did not have an NDE personally. But I also did not go to the center of the earth to know it is molten magma.” You are basing the knowledge of the presence of molten magma on measurable evidence. NDE unfortunately does not provide the same verifiable evidence and is therefore not compatible. I do not dismiss the claims of NDE witnesses I simple treat the occurrence as a unexplained phenomena worthy of further investigation. Finally on the existence of God I suggest that all Gods are true to those that believe them

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