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Unknown 378
Joined: 31 Dec 1969
Posts: 9
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 Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 11:08 pm Post subject: Is Mark 7 missing from the catholic bible??? |
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| Quote: | Mark 7
Clean and Unclean
1The Pharisees and some of the teachers of the law who had come from Jerusalem gathered around Jesus and 2saw some of his disciples eating food with hands that were "unclean," that is, unwashed. 3(The Pharisees and all the Jews do not eat unless they give their hands a ceremonial washing, holding to the tradition of the elders. 4When they come from the marketplace they do not eat unless they wash. And they observe many other traditions, such as the washing of cups, pitchers and kettles.[1] )
5So the Pharisees and teachers of the law asked Jesus, "Why don't your disciples live according to the tradition of the elders instead of eating their food with 'unclean' hands?"
6He replied, "Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you hypocrites; as it is written:
" 'These people honor me with their lips,
but their hearts are far from me.
7They worship me in vain;
their teachings are but rules taught by men.'[2] 8You have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to the traditions of men."
9And he said to them: "You have a fine way of setting aside the commands of God in order to observe[3] your own traditions! 10For Moses said, 'Honor your father and your mother,'[4] and, 'Anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death.'[5] 11But you say that if a man says to his father or mother: 'Whatever help you might otherwise have received from me is Corban' (that is, a gift devoted to God), 12then you no longer let him do anything for his father or mother. 13Thus you nullify the word of God by your tradition that you have handed down. And you do many things like that."
Footnotes
7:4 Some early manuscripts pitchers, kettles and dining couches
7:7 Isaiah 29:13
7:9 Some manuscripts set up
7:10 Exodus 20:12; Deut. 5:16
7:10 Exodus 21:17; Lev. 20:9 |
I know their bibles have this chapter, do they just skip over it? Oh I know, maybe there is something in the wine....I mean blood(lol). Can someone give me some info as to why a catholic mass is filled with unbiblical traditions despite Jesus' preaching against it?
catholics please try your best to explain why the church teaches:
-holy water
-the rosary
-transubstantiation....believing bread and wine literally become body and blood
-church being built on peter, the first pope
-images to pray before
-purgatory
-praying to dead saints....THEYRE DEAD!!!!!
-reconciliation
-why mass and sacrements are necessary to be saved
-why only catholics will be saved
-penance
-prayer to, and worship of mary
-lent
-holy days
-monks and nuns
-immaculate conception of mary
-perpetual virginity of mary
-the assumption of mary
That is all I can think of at the moment. |
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EigenVektor
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 58
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| Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2003 3:27 am Post subject: |
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many catholic traditions come from roman traditions.
You might find some answers at www.catholic.org |
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Unknown 378
Joined: 31 Dec 1969
Posts: 9
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| Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2003 8:52 am Post subject: |
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| I know where they come from....the point is Jesus taught against man made traditions. I want to know if any catholics can justify any of the teachings I listed using the bible. |
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TruthSpeaker
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 203
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| Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2003 9:43 am Post subject: |
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| ckboi333 wrote: | | I know where they come from....the point is Jesus taught against man made traditions. I want to know if any catholics can justify any of the teachings I listed using the bible. |
Here we go again! This is why true believers are akin to the mullahs.
Oh great one,
1. Jesus was fictional.
2. All traditions are man made. Jesus is man made.
Catholics can justify their teachings the same way you can justify yours. Nonsense versus nonsense and which nonsense is better? The first one or the second one?
_________________
- The only religion, is the religion of truth. Without truth there can be no reason. |
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Unknown 355
Joined: 31 Dec 1969
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2003 7:13 pm Post subject: |
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| TruthSpeaker wrote: | | 1. Jesus was fictional. |
'TruthSpeaker',
Would you care to elaborate on how you have come to this conclusion?
Thanks
Scott |
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TruthSpeaker
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 203
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Unknown 355
Joined: 31 Dec 1969
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 11:52 am Post subject: |
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So did you come to the conclusion or did the texts you listed do so for you? I do not understand.
Scott |
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TruthSpeaker
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 203
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| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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How much time and effort did I spend in disproving the existence of
1) Santa Clause
2) The Great Pumpkin
3) The Easter Bunny
4) The Boogey man
5) The Mummy
6) The superman
etc.
It is upto the people who claim that someone or something exists to prove their existence.
I give you the links so you can read the blarney that christians normally sprinkle. I have no interest in trying to convince you or anyone else that a green six foot martian rabbit does not live in your closet, and neither do I have any interest in trying to convince you that Jesus does not exist. The information exists and if you have been duped into thinking that Jesus is real then you need more help than what I can provide here.
You are most welcome to testify to jesus or the 6 foot rabbit to your hearts content.
For me the following is as obvious as obvious can be that the bible is fiction and not fact:
| Quote: | From the beginning to the end of this Christ's earthly career he is represented by his alleged biographers as a supernatural being endowed with superhuman powers. He is conceived without a natural father: "Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When, as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost" (Matt. i, 1 .
His ministry is a succession of miracles. With a few loaves and fishes he feeds a multitude: "And when he had taken the five loaves and the two fishes, he looked up to heaven, and blessed and brake the loaves, and gave them to his disciples to set before them; and the two fishes divided he among them all. And they did all eat, and were filled. And they took up twelve baskets full of the fragments and of the fishes. And they that did eat of the loaves were about five thousand men" (Mark vi, 41-44).
He walks for miles upon the waters of the sea: "And straightway Jesus constrained his disciples to get into a ship, and to go before him unto the other side, while he sent the multitudes away. And when he had sent the multitudes away, he went up into a mountain apart to pray; and when the evening was come, he was there alone. But the ship was now in the midst of the sea, tossed with waves; for the wind was contrary. And in the fourth watch of the night Jesus went unto them, walking on the sea" (Matt. xiv, 22-25).
He bids a raging tempest cease and it obeys him: "And there arose a great storm of wind, and the waves beat into the ship, so that it was now full.... And he arose, and rebuked the wind, and said unto the sea, Peace, be still. And the wind ceased, and there was a great calm" (Mark. iv, 37 39).
He withers with a curse the barren fig tree: "And when he saw a fig tree in the way, he came to it, and found nothing thereon, but leaves only, and said unto it, Let no fruit grow on thee, henceforth, forever. And presently the fig tree withered away" (Matt. xxi, 19).
He casts out devils: "And in the synagogue there was a man, which had a spirit of an unclean devil.... And Jesus rebuked him, saying, Hold thy peace, and come out of him. And when the devil had thrown him in the midst, he came out of him and hurt him not" (Luke iv, 33, 35).
He cures the incurable: "And as he entered into a certain village, there met him ten men that were lepers, which stood afar off; and when he saw them, he said unto them, Go show yourselves unto the priests. And it came to pass, that, as they went, they were cleansed" (Luke xvii, I2-I4).
He restores to life a widow's only son: "And when he came nigh to the gate of the city, behold, there was a dead man carried out, the only son of his mother, and she was a widow; and much people of the city were with her. And when the Lord saw her, he had compassion on her, and said unto her, Weep not; And he came and touched the bier; and they that bore him stood still. And he said, Young man, I say unto thee, Arise. And he that was dead sat up, and began to speak. And he delivered him to his mother" (Luke vii, 12-15). |
_________________
- The only religion, is the religion of truth. Without truth there can be no reason. |
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Unknown 378
Joined: 31 Dec 1969
Posts: 9
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| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 3:00 pm Post subject: |
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| TruthSpeaker. May I know what your theological beliefs are, so I know from what grounds you are debating? |
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TruthSpeaker
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 203
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| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 3:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | TruthSpeaker. May I know what your theological beliefs are, so I know from what grounds you are debating? |
Dear ckboi333, I am not debating.
This is what I got for theology from a dictionary:
1 : the study of religious faith, practice, and experience; especially : the study of God and of God's relation to the world
2 a : a theological theory or system <Thomist theology> <a theology of atonement> b : a distinctive body of theological opinion <Catholic theology>
3 : a usually 4-year course of specialized religious training in a Roman Catholic major seminary
Under these three definition, I do not have any theological beliefs. If I may ask you a similar question so I may know what you are debating:
Which color ghost do you think is more spiritual: red or green?
_________________
- The only religion, is the religion of truth. Without truth there can be no reason. |
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Unknown 378
Joined: 31 Dec 1969
Posts: 9
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| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 4:35 pm Post subject: |
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TruthSpeaker, I am a protestant Christian...used to be athiest. I gather that you are an atheist.
| Quote: | | Dear ckboi333, I am not debating. |
I request that you please do debate. Your comments are well pointed, and you seem extremely logical(there are many in this forum who are not). I am requesting that you debate for the challenge, and to realize the weaknesses of both of our arguments. My question to atheists, is how you propose life was created from non-living matter. Most arguments i have encountered rely on a faith of time. I am interested to read your point of view.
| Quote: | | Which color ghost do you think is more spiritual: red or green? |
I fail to see how a difference in the reflection of light would affect spirituality. Maybe If you tell me what attributions you would have associated with me based on my answer, I can help you better understand how I think. |
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TruthSpeaker
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 203
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| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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| ckboi333 wrote: | TruthSpeaker, I am a protestant Christian...used to be athiest. I gather that you are an atheist.
| Quote: | | Dear ckboi333, I am not debating. |
I request that you please do debate. Your comments are well pointed, and you seem extremely logical(there are many in this forum who are not). I am requesting that you debate for the challenge, and to realize the weaknesses of both of our arguments. My question to atheists, is how you propose life was created from non-living matter. Most arguments i have encountered rely on a faith of time. I am interested to read your point of view.
| Quote: | | Which color ghost do you think is more spiritual: red or green? |
I fail to see how a difference in the reflection of light would affect spirituality. Maybe If you tell me what attributions you would have associated with me based on my answer, I can help you better understand how I think. |
Dear ckboi333:
For all I know the universe was created by the tooth fairy. Now if you beleive in the tooth fairy then it would be nice of you to tell us what, who and how a tooth fairy operates.
You used to be an atheist, and now you beleive in the Christian god. Good for you.
Frankly I do not have the time to engage in a debate. All the knowledge I could impart on the subject is already written and said in books, articles, etc. I do not have anything original to contribute on it. Let it suffice to say that I consider your concern about the inner workings of god about as useful as you find the nature of refraction has for spirituality.
_________________
- The only religion, is the religion of truth. Without truth there can be no reason. |
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