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parvez_mushtaq
Joined: 04 Jul 2008
Posts: 265
Location: india
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 Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 6:13 am Post subject: |
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| Mersk wrote: |
Quote :: [Islam is practical religion]
Since Allah is the only God, does it mean no one can decree that Muslims be right hand possessed by non-Muslims? Does not seem practical that daughters of Islam cannot be right hand possessed!! |
first understand that the word "ALLAH" denotes the GOD ,THE ULTIMATE ORIGINATOR,and muslims never had a different GOD but the same GOD of all religions
and quran testifies that
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YUSUFALI: Revile not ye those whom they call upon besides Allah, lest they out of spite revile Allah in their ignorance. ...... |
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parvez_mushtaq
Joined: 04 Jul 2008
Posts: 265
Location: india
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| Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 6:18 am Post subject: |
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| Mersk wrote: |
| parvez_mushtaq wrote: |
| Mersk wrote: |
| Am I half-expecting a non-Christian to tell Muslims what religion was Jesus practicing from the completed Injeel Allah gave him?! |
i want to all non-muslims that Islam is the perfected version of all the religions of this planet |
And what perfection might that be. The question is what religion was Jesus practicing that Islam object, and how different is it from today's ex-Muslim Christians. Is Islamic Isa now enjoying virgins courtesy of HAM's promise to all Muslim mothers?? |
STUDY (don't read)bible ,STUDY(don't read) quran , then you can judge yourself
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006.108
YUSUFALI: Revile not ye those whom they call upon besides Allah, lest they out of spite revile Allah in their ignorance. ...... |
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parvez_mushtaq
Joined: 04 Jul 2008
Posts: 265
Location: india
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| Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 6:53 am Post subject: |
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[quote="chingachgook"]
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surah 5 verse 18.
And (both) the Jews and the Christians say: "We are the children of Allâh and His loved ones." Say: "Why then does He punish you for your sins?" Nay, you are but human beings, of those He has created, He forgives whom He wills and He punishes whom He wills. And to Allâh belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth and all that is between them, and to Him is the return (of all). |
Says who? |
jesus says jews are the children of god and Christians call themselves (lol) as the children of god(but jesus called them DOGS ,YET THEY CALL THEMSELVES CHILDREN OF GOD , ITS LIKE MIRROR IMAGE ,THEY CALL JESUS GOD ,HE CALLS THEM DOGS, GOD :::DOG !!!! lol )
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| No, to me the reality is that Islam is a cruel, barbaric, 7th Century religion mage-up by the worst criminal of all time for his own pursuit of lust, ego, fame and power |
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you have the right to think what you want
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| WHY IS ISLAM PRACTICAL? Just tell me why other religions/beliefs are not practical? |
for example , the prophet will never call the people of other faiths "DOGS"
or pl make your female to sacrifice a dove to get cleaned after mensus
or never divorce
or take of your eye or cut you hand
how many examples you want to say me to prove christianity is not a practical religion
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| Is it practical for a poor muslim to go and worship the black meteorite stone in Mecca without incurring debts? |
the condition you should have money
moreover there are lots of sponsors for poor people to make hajj ,so even lots of poor people perform hajj
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| Is it practical to pray 5 times a day for the duration of your life? Is it practical for a poor labourer to fast from dawn to dusk? |
millions of muslims prove this is practical sir
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| Is it practical for women to be veiled? |
its a honor for women and all religions gave this honor to women
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| Is it practical that god's words should only written in classical Arabic where 99% of the ummah do not know how to read let alone understand it? |
even i was a parrot but now i can understand quran (ALHAMDULLIAH)
when there is a will there is way dear
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YUSUFALI: Revile not ye those whom they call upon besides Allah, lest they out of spite revile Allah in their ignorance. ...... |
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parvez_mushtaq
Joined: 04 Jul 2008
Posts: 265
Location: india
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| Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 7:02 am Post subject: Re: God Has Children ! |
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| Trojan Horse wrote: |
| parvez_mushtaq wrote: |
wow lots of sons for GOD and not even single daughter !
i don't know what enmity does GOD of bible has with women if the "son" in bible refers to godly person , |
Hypocrite read what your koran says you should do to your women, befoe you point fingers. What does allah have against women that she is treated like property of man?
[4.34] Men are the maintainers of women because Allah has made some of them to excel others and because they spend out of their property; the good women are therefore obedient, guarding the unseen as Allah has guarded; and (as to) those on whose part you fear desertion, admonish them, and leave them alone in the sleeping-places and beat them; then if they obey you, do not seek a way against them; surely Allah is High, Great.
[2.223] Your wives are a tilth for you, so go into your tilth when you like, and do good beforehand for yourselves, and be careful (of your duty) to Allah, and know that you will meet Him, and give good news to the believers.
tilth /tɪlθ/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [tilth] Show IPA Pronunciation ,
–noun 1. the act or operation of tilling land; tillage.
2. the state of being tilled or under cultivation.
3. the physical condition of soil in relation to plant growth.
4. land that is tilled or cultivated.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/tilth
Who cares how the women feel. Plow her whenever you feel like it. Your lustful feeling are made far superior than your women because they are mere tilth.
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| islam is a practical religion |
 Practical indeed only if you are a muslim male. Women are your property. Force them cover up so that you may not be alluded to sin. Even in paradise you have sexual rewards (which ever way you dare to swing) while righteous women are left high and dry.
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sir i tell you Islam is the only religion on this planet which gave women her due status
quran never called women as a kids manufacturing machine as bible says
quran never called women to shut there voices and obey men
quran never said the pregnancy is the result of sin they committed
quran never said women will get nothing if the father has son in inheritance
quran never said the virginity of women should be proved by her parents if her husband doubts her being loyal to her
you people seems to forget or deliberately leave this things sir
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YUSUFALI: Revile not ye those whom they call upon besides Allah, lest they out of spite revile Allah in their ignorance. ...... |
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parvez_mushtaq
Joined: 04 Jul 2008
Posts: 265
Location: india
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| Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 7:28 am Post subject: |
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"Haik Monsieur"]_______________
[color=black]Well, the question was what kind of a Muslim are you and you answer there is only one kind of Muslim? How come it is so?
You affirm there is diversity within you but in the matter of faith you guys are one. That doesn’t release you from the hook at all. Let me explain:
If you are a Shia and not a Sunni, you believe in a god who would suffice with three times prayers. But your Sunni brother believes in a god who will only be happy with five times prayers. We see two gods here. Don’t you?
I just gave you one of the many models revealing you guys differ each other. These differences make you people different kinds too. You can be a kind of Muslim who believes god will not tolerate anyone who doesn’t pray to him directly, while your Sufi Muslim brother will put his trust in a more tolerant, flexible god. No matter whether there is a concept of monotheism that is common among you, that alone will not let you guys off the hook of being different kinds.
And that was all what Mughal asking you. And you can’t run away from the question heralding you guys have an Allah and Muhammad in common. You folks believe in a god but differ on his features.
If you differ in believing in your god’s features, that makes you different kinds too. It is not hard and unfathomable as you think or want it to be.
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you are giving wrong information haik
All the Muslims agree that Allah is One, Muhammad (PBUH) is His
last Prophet, the Quran is His last Book for mankind, and that one day
Allah will resurrect all human beings, and they will be questioned
about their beliefs and actions.
The Shia acknowledge FIVE daily PRAYERS. However,they think THEY ARE ALLOWED to pray them in THREE distinct TIMES, not five; the five prayers are: Fajr (Morning), Zuhr (Noon), `Asr (Afternoon), Maghrib (Sunset), and Isha (Night).
The Fajr (morning) is prayed at the same time as the Sunnis do; only thing they think, they are ALLOWED to combain zuhr with asr and magrib with isha
(NOTE: The prayers in ALL cases are DISTINCT (separate), it's NOT that
they (the Shia) pray eight Raka't (for Zuhr and `Asr) straight, or seven
Raka't (for Maghrib and Isha) straight, as part of ONE prayer. It is the
SAME regular form of prayer, but combined into one TIME, NOT one PRAYER.)
more over haik
islam has a broader view
it accommodates all religions
as in verse
surah 2 verse 62. Verily! Those who believe and those who are Jews and Christians, and Sabians, whoever believes in Allâh and the Last Day and do righteous good deeds shall have their reward with their Lord, on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve .
so the main criteria is "BELIEVE IN ONE GOD "
| Quote: |
| So, what kind of a Muslim are you? Are you the kind which believes "five times prayers good, three time prayers bad?" |
so i am a muslim who belive in ONE GOD , haik
| Quote: |
| PS: Sorry for this tardy response, still if you don’t change your posting style, I am sorry but no further response is guaranteed. I am for serious discussions and want my contester too in serious mode and mood. |
i apologize if you felt bad haik
i will try to change my style
but i felt bad on the day when you said i am quitting the debate
its ok you had your reasons haik
but i like you haik there fore i took the liberty of being friendly if it hurt you anyway, i apologize
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006.108
YUSUFALI: Revile not ye those whom they call upon besides Allah, lest they out of spite revile Allah in their ignorance. ...... |
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parvez_mushtaq
Joined: 04 Jul 2008
Posts: 265
Location: india
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| Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 7:47 am Post subject: |
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| simony wrote: |
How Truly written !
" 'Look, you scoffers,
wonder and perish,
for I am going to do something in your days
that you would never believe,
even if someone told you." Acts;13;40 |
told by whom and when and to whom
neither i am a making a mockery of you faith nor i am wondering but the truth is religion is not what you think
if you say you are enlighten in your dream , then what you say about few Christians claiming to be a prophets in these days
and more over lots of Hindus think they are GOD eg. osha
and if you are aware of sri sri ravi sankar ,he claims he got entire bagawad geeta in to his mind during sleep and he says he never read a word of it but some how he knows by heart
can we take ravi sankar as god .
sir pl study your religion and never use it for fame and money
this is for all people
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YUSUFALI: Revile not ye those whom they call upon besides Allah, lest they out of spite revile Allah in their ignorance. ...... |
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parvez_mushtaq
Joined: 04 Jul 2008
Posts: 265
Location: india
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| Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 7:50 am Post subject: |
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| simony wrote: |
How Truly written !
" 'Look, you scoffers,
wonder and perish,
for I am going to do something in your days
that you would never believe,
even if someone told you." Acts;13;40 |
told by whom and when and to whom
neither i am a making a mockery of you faith nor i am wondering but the truth is religion is not what you think
if you say you are enlighten in your dream , then what you say about few Christians claiming to be a prophets in these days
and more over lots of Hindus think they are GOD eg. osha
and if you are aware of sri sri ravi sankar ,he claims he got entire bagawad geeta in to his mind during sleep and he says he never read a word of it but some how he knows by heart
can we take ravi sankar as god .
sir pl study your religion and never use it for fame and money
this is for all people
moreover it is acts 13 - 41 and not acts 13-40 pl check
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006.108
YUSUFALI: Revile not ye those whom they call upon besides Allah, lest they out of spite revile Allah in their ignorance. ...... |
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parvez_mushtaq
Joined: 04 Jul 2008
Posts: 265
Location: india
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| Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 8:42 am Post subject: |
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[quote="Mughal"]
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Dear parvez mushtaq, I can tell you there are various sects who claim to be muslims eg sunni, shia. They each have their own sets of hadith collections. Do you believe in hadith or just in the quran alone? If you are quran only kind of muslim then that means hadith books and fiqh books regardless of sunnies or shias don't mean a thing to you.
If you are a wahabi or salafi type of muslim then brailvies and shias would seem polytheists to you and you would be deemed by them a heretic committing kufr by showing disrespect for imaams and saints of the ummah by being a ghair muqallid=nonconformist.
So you can now see how difficult it is for anyone to understand exactly where one stands if one says one is just a muslim. If one thereby becomes individual then he is not part of ummah and so interpretation of any such individual is just viod, for only ummatic islam is valid islam |
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again people ,customs ,opinions ,traditions .....
islam is not what you think
all muslims come under one umbrella when they GOD is one and remaing let god to decide on the day of resurrection and GOD has promised this , not only to muslims but to all the people of other faiths as in
surah 5 verse 69.
Surely, those who believe (in the Oneness of Allâh, in His Messenger Muhammad SAW and all that was revealed to him from Allâh), those who are the Jews and the Sabians and the Christians, - whosoever believed in Allâh and the Last Day, and worked righteousness, on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.
so lets not worry about the sects on traditions
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| To make such claim, you must put forth the related evidence but put forth nothing. According to the quran muhammad told jews and christians to follow their own scriptures they had at the time. The question is why would he if they were changed? |
the above reference is one among them further are as follows
49:13 O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female and made you into nations and tribes that ye may know each other (not that ye may despise each other). Verily the most honored of you in the sight of Allah is (he who is) the most righteous of you. And Allah has full knowledge and is well acquainted (with all things).
another
surah 2 verse 213.
Mankind were one community and Allâh sent Prophets with glad tidings and warnings, and with them He sent the Scripture in truth to judge between people in matters wherein they differed. And only those to whom (the Scripture) was given differed concerning it after clear proofs had come unto them through hatred, one to another. Then Allâh by His Leave guided those who believed to the truth of that wherein they differed. And Allâh guides whom He wills to a Straight Path
and lots of verses of this sort but read this verse carefully
surah 2 verse 285.
. The Messenger (Muhammad SAW) believes in what has been sent down to him from his Lord, and (so do) the believers. Each one believes in Allâh, His Angels, His Books, and His Messengers. They say, "We make no distinction between one another of His Messengers" - and they say, "We hear, and we obey. (We seek) Your Forgiveness, our Lord, and to You is the return (of all)."
so claim of quran is all religions are from the GOD and a belieaver should belive in this then only he is a muslim
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You see dear parvez, religion is a matter of faith for believers, it is therefore not based on logic but alleged revelations. Since revelations being such are not supposed to be though of in logical terms therefore your try for aplying logic in cases of faith is fatal. It is as if you are shooting yourself in the foot.
You cannot know just by logic alone whether there is a god or not nor how many of them there are. So if you believe the quran merely as a matter of faith then you must believe in any other alleged divine scripture on the very same basis. If you do not then your test cannot be a fair test. If you question one religion then you must do the same to any other just so that you are fair in testing them equally.
Just on your own you cannot tell whether god has a wife or not or any other relatives or not. I can agree that some scriptures may contain more faults than others but faults are in all of them.
Logic and faith do not add up dear parvez but if you must apply logic then you must do the same to them all. |
sorry to disappoint you dear
islam is a faith with logic as per islam all scriptures are sent by GOD the ORIGINAL ORIGINATOR
as he has laid a law for every thing in his creation , he has given laws for humans also
for example , there is lots of common things is all religions
no religion justies theft or aldultery or cruelty
and apart from this one more important thing is common in all religions
NAMELY MONOTHESIM
for example in hinduism
rig veda 1.164.46
thruth is one ,wise call it with various names
He is the sole sovereign
Of the universe.
- Rig Veda 6/36/4
Verily He is one
Single, indivisible, supreme reality.
- Atharva Veda 13/4/20
There is only One
Who ought to be adored
By the people.
- Atharva Veda 2/2/1
"He is One only without a second."
[Chandogya Upanishad 6:2:1]1
even Zoroastrians worship fire but they say they are not worshiping fire but the spirit behind the fire which is ONE AND ONLY GOD
so GOD is one in all religions
know read this verse from quran
surah 2 verse 213.
Mankind were one community and Allâh sent Prophets with glad tidings and warnings, and with them He sent the Scripture in truth to judge between people in matters wherein they differed. And only those to whom (the Scripture) was given differed concerning it after clear proofs had come unto them through hatred, one to another. Then Allâh by His Leave guided those who believed to the truth of that wherein they differed. And Allâh guides whom He wills to a Straight Path
and this religions differs from place to place and of different places differing miles of distances
so islam never denies any religion
but says they are changed
and that is true
cos one time you cant say GOD is one and another time you say he
has sons or daughters
SO WITH ALL LOGIC THERE IS GOD AND HE IS ONE
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006.108
YUSUFALI: Revile not ye those whom they call upon besides Allah, lest they out of spite revile Allah in their ignorance. ...... |
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time to wake up
Joined: 02 Feb 2007
Posts: 265
Location: Southern England
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| Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 1:09 pm Post subject: |
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Parvez,
if you believe that all religions are from God, and find that the koran supports this, then why has Islam, historically felt the need to conquer and subjugate zoroastrians, Jews, Hindus and Christians in their millions with the choice of convert or die.
Why such a consistent attempt to spread Islam by the sword, and why divide the world between the two spheres of the house of Islam and the House of war
If we are all brother religions, why is apostasy such a crime, that it is punishable by death, even today?
No dear,
Islam is the most violent faith which exceeds all others in barbarity, it is a control system that does not tolerate any rivals. All aspects of dhimmi status, and sharia law have one purpose only and that is to consume indigenous cultures and absorb them one injustice at a time. It is the tool for Arab expansionism, and where you claim unity with previous prophets of the jewish scriptures, Mohammad's actions goes against them all, they were called to preach justice and fidelity, Mohammed preached what Mohammed wanted.
You even claim Jesus is a prophet in Islam, yet you never consider a single word he said on justice, compassion and mercy - this is why in Islam there is no forgiveness and only revenge.
Jesus said, by their fruit you will know them, and by that measure I know that such fruit that Islam bears is poisonous for humans. Sorry to be so blunt but your words are hollow. |
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chingachgook
Joined: 16 Feb 2004
Posts: 3101
Location: Land of Twilight Zone
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| Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 2:40 pm Post subject: |
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| pervert_mustaq wrote: |
this is the problem that Christians have when they are question about biblical laws
they weasel out by attributing political,individual actions to islam and say this is what Islam is all about |
What is political about a Church? Why bomb them? Shouting "Allahooooo fcukbarrrr" is not individual action. Individual action ? My foot!!! Mobs from an Islamic religious sect are not individual. It is written all over the pages of the filthy KKKoran that kuffars are filths, their countryies are game ground, their women can be taken as slaves .....
| Quote: |
i tell you one thing from the bottom of my heart
the most structured and the best book is quran
just prove me how bible is batter than quran and i will become a christian today |
See what we kuffars mean? Your mind is not working logically. Books written by kuffars are laid out in Chapters, topics, sub-topics pages etc. Tell me why you say the filthy KKKoran is most structured?
In any case you may have "the best book" but look what your book has done to you all? The moment you step out from the Friday prayers you burn churches, go on rampage, bomb and burn rival mosques.... Tell me what good are all these? On the other hand, christianity, according to you, is not practical but look at what christians and others are doing to assist and feed your hungry people? You see the best book, the best religion, the best laws doesn't count when its fruits are bad. A bad tree will never produce good fruits. Islam is a bad tree. Period.
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When Muslims DON'T follow Islam they are holy. When Christians DON'T follow Christ's they are not holy (chingachgook)
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Cassandra
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 4495
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| Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 2:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Any 'book' written by a mass-murdering pedophile is not worth reading. |
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Mersk
Joined: 16 Jul 2004
Posts: 5764
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| Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:39 am Post subject: |
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| parvez_mushtaq wrote: |
| Mersk wrote: |
Quote :: [Islam is practical religion]
Since Allah is the only God, does it mean no one can decree that Muslims be right hand possessed by non-Muslims? Does not seem practical that daughters of Islam cannot be right hand possessed!! |
first understand that the word "ALLAH" denotes the GOD ,THE ULTIMATE ORIGINATOR,and muslims never had a different GOD but the same GOD of all religions
and quran testifies that |
You are not utilizing that Islamic mind of yours, or rather. Who cares what Muslims think about any other Gods, right?!
If the world were to go on to rape Muslim mothers because their Gods tell them to, why do you object and why must HAM insisted that only the one true God Allah can tell his Muslims to 'right hand posses'!
The gist of the question is why are their Gods anymore inferior than your Allah.
Wait .. there is not God except Allah and only Muslims like HAM can rape. Is that what Islam is telling the world.
Wouldn't it be better to have other Gods other than Allah when all the other Gods put together give one more leeways to do what they will with Muslims.
Now ..
You go study what was the God Jesus subscribed to and did any Gods in HAM's time told their followers to rape Muslims.
Do you know of any God at any time throughout man's history to have done so. Do you know and reason why wouldn't the people in HAM's time considered him a filthy Islamic RADICAL.
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MAM = Muslims acting as Muslim Affairs Ministers for Modk. HAM = Last Profit of Islam. |
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humanityFirst
Joined: 08 Apr 2007
Posts: 74
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| Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 8:10 am Post subject: Parvez - please don't flood this thread with spam |
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Parvez
I had no plans of actually responding to any messages, but seeing some of your sorry messages, i couldn't resist.
Could you please not flood this thread with loads of spam and useless copy and paste arguments that do nothing besides twisting words, meanings and mislead.
If you have something to say, please come up with something that is well thought through and concisely stated using clear reasoning not circular logic.
And maybe read some of the articles/wikiislam first before making your arguments. We would appreciate that.
By the way, it looks silly of you to be running around in circles and avoiding the question some people asked you about your sect.
for example, if you are sunni or shia just say it. if you believe both groups follow islam incorrectly say that too. there can be no other possibility here so anything else is dodging the question
humanity |
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humanityFirst
Joined: 08 Apr 2007
Posts: 74
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| Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 8:22 am Post subject: |
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Simony,
I am not Christian but I congratulate you. As a former Muslim who went into the depths of the religion to understand and analyze it, I can say that Islam is an unbelievable trick on those who believe in it. These people have an illusion about what the religion is and they keep reinforcing it to each other.
The worst thing is that they are good people but the fear of hell has made them lose their logic that God has given them and they now justify anything in their minds - even something that is blatantly wrong and violent. Its not their fault but its very sad.
peace
humanity |
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Rat_bytes
Joined: 22 Apr 2008
Posts: 539
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| Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 12:40 pm Post subject: |
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| HF wrote: |
| Its not their fault |
Brainwashing is no excuse for atrocity.
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The world holds two classes of men - intelligent men without religion, and religious men without intelligence. - Abu’l‐Ala al Ma’arri |
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