Spirituality -A garden of wisdom. Jiddu Krishnamurti

Islamis_Allah_Tashit · Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2005 4:20 pm Post subject:

Maybe being lonely is being taken a little too literally. I'm not sure this is going so far as to say that we are not individuals. There is "alone", and then there is "lonely". One is the state, the other is the unnecessary judgement of that state.

I think what these mystics mean is "alone", and what I think this means could be described by saying that you yourself are your happiness. Other people are not your happiness. To go further, it means that your happiness is no longer tied to their approval. This, of course, is in a deeper core sense and it's not saying to laugh as you give your boss the finger. That would be called masochism

. It simply means that their approval no longer controls your core inner happiness, and when it did, THEY actually owned your happiness, THEY were deciding whether you were going to be happy or not based on whether they give you their approval or disapproval instead of YOU deciding that. And, strangely enough, this dependency works both ways. Consider the following phrase. "You better behave as I see fit or I will punish myself by giving myself a bad feeling". You might laugh, but that is what 99.9% of us probably do if you think about it.

Anyway, that, in my opinion, is what these mystics are talking about when they speak about aloneness. The notion that someone else's behavior dictates your happiness is now gone. For someone else can never be your true, unconditional, uninterrupted happiness. Only YOU can be that. One can extend this to God if one wishes, but the strict logic of these mystics does not require that and really has little to do with God when they speak of "aloneness". Some might say that God is found in this aloneness, but that's about as far as they will go.

The Cat · Joined: 23 Apr 2005 Posts: 4357

Yes, I_A_T. When one feels ''lonely'' he feels ''isolated'', which we never are. Life is simply impossible without inter-reactions, connections, without being in relation. In relation with the sun, the air, the ground, some people, a clock, our work, studies, whatever.
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Islamis_Allah_Tashit · Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2005 5:24 pm Post subject:

The Cat · Joined: 23 Apr 2005 Posts: 4357

Because life IS inter-reactions. My brain inter-react with my heart who does inter-react with my muscles and my breathing. I am a transforming machinery. When I walk, I am inter-reacting with the ground, when I sit with the chair and so forth. To survive I must eat something ALIFE, is it a carrot. ife is thus constantly inter-reacting with itself, like exchanging electrons. The simple act of eating or breathing is inter-reactive.

Being alive is being in realtions. It's lively...My dead body will still be in relations. It might feed a flower, whatever. So, to feel ''lonely'' is only a mind's projection, something psychological. Dear I_A_T, were all on different wavelenghs, I think, but on the same ocean... The ocean of inter-reactions.
Bye.
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Authority has the same etymological root as authenticity.

Islamis_Allah_Tashit · Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2005 8:15 pm Post subject:

The Cat · Joined: 23 Apr 2005 Posts: 4357

--I want to walk through this life instead of being dragged throught it. (Alanis Morisette).

--Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans. (John Lennon).
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Authority has the same etymological root as authenticity.

Islamis_Allah_Tashit · Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 7:44 pm Post subject:

I did enjoy. Thanks.

--I want to walk through life instead of being dragged throught it. (Alanis Morisette).

Sorry, but I don't like her in particular. She is simply dripping with self importance and self absorption. You can tell by what she says, and by what her songs say and even how she sings them.

--Life is what happens to you while your busy making other plans (John Lennon).

In your opinion, what does this mean?
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The Cat · Joined: 23 Apr 2005 Posts: 4357

About Alinis, everyone is entitled to his/her own opinion.

On Lennon, the preceding sentence of ''Beautiful Boy'', written for baby Sean is: ''Before you cross the street, take my hand, life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans.'' John is my favorite all-time artist. remember how I cried all night long, listening to his music, when I learned he has been shot, the 8 dec.1980 around 10.30pm. A whole generation lost its driver...
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Authority has the same etymological root as authenticity.

plata moya · Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 10:36 pm Post subject:

This is what I think of you guys chatting!
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And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive? ... Now kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man, keep alive for yourselves.

The Cat · Joined: 23 Apr 2005 Posts: 4357

Spirituality is not welcome by the establishment, and the 'religious' manifactured souls. It's freeing ain't welcome. What happened to the Sufis in Islam is nothing exceptional.
So beware while keeping your cool...

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Authority has the same etymological root as authenticity.

Islamis_Allah_Tashit · Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:32 pm Post subject:

The Cat · Joined: 23 Apr 2005 Posts: 4357

It's just as deep as you can dive in...
Bye-bye.
_________________
Authority has the same etymological root as authenticity.

Islamis_Allah_Tashit · Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2005 5:43 pm Post subject:

Well, here's what I think it means. It means that we are never living but instead always making plans for the future and therefore missing the present moment. Life happens right in front of us while we are busy making plans for an afterlife and therefore we miss life. Consider someone who goes on vacation. They make all these plans about how their vacation is supposed to be, how they will get there, where they will stay.....and while they are on the actual vacation, they are making plans for how they are going to get home....Not to be taken completely literally, it's more about what is on people's mind. So they miss their vacation, but boy, you should see the photos that they can show you of it, even though they were never mentally there. They were more interested in the photos they can gather for future use. Essentially, it means that our minds are always either in the past or future but rarely in the present moment. Therefore, life happens or passes us by while we are thinking about other things or making other plans.
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Islamis_Allah_Tashit · Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2005 6:21 pm Post subject:

The great mystics and masters in the East will say, "Who are YOU?" Many think the most important question in the world is: "Who is Jesus Christ?" Wrong!

Many think it is: "Does God exist?" Wrong! Many think it is: "Is there a life after death?" Wrong! Nobody seems to be grappling with the problem of: Is there a life BEFORE death? Yet my experience is that it's precisely the ones who don't know what to do with THIS life who are all hot and bothered about what they are going to do with ANOTHER life.

--A. Demello
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The Cat · Joined: 23 Apr 2005 Posts: 4357

The Four Steps To Wisdom.
Anthony de Mello, SJ.
(Shorten version here).
You can't get rid of boll weevils on your farm if you're not aware of their existence. The first thing you need is awareness of your negative feelings.

The second step is to understand that the feeling is not in you, not in reality. (...) As one man said, ''I got a pretty good education. It took me years to get over it.'' That's what spirituality is all about, you know: unlearning. Unlearning all the rubbish they taught you. Negative feelings are not in you, not in reality. So stop trying to change reality. (...)

Let's suppose that rain washes out a picnic. Who is feeling negative? The rain? Or YOU? (...) The mystics keep trying to tell us that reality is alright. Reality is not problematic. problems exist only in the human mind. (...) Take away human beings from this planet and life would go on, nature would go on in all its loveliness and violence. Where would the problem be? No problem. You created the problem. You are the problem. You identified with ''me'' and that is the problem. The feeling is in you, not in reality.

The third step: Never identify with that feeling. It has nothing to do with the ''I''. (...) your depressions and your thrills have nothing to do with happiness. Those are the swing of the pendulum. (...) What you need is to be free. What you need is to love. That's it; that,s your nature. But what you are telling me is that you want to be desired. You want to be applauded, to be attractive, to have all the little monkeys running after you. You're wasting your life. WAKE UP! You don't need this. You can be blissfully happy without it. (...)

You don't have to do anything to acquire happiness. The great Meister Eckhart said it very beautifully, ''God is not attained by a process of addition to anything in the soul, but by a process of substraction.'' You don't do anything to be free, you drop something. (...)

The forth step: How do you change things? How do you change yourself? (...) The person asleep always think he'll feel better if somebody else changes. You're suffering because you're asleep. (...) You are the one who needs to change.
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Authority has the same etymological root as authenticity.