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TheOtherWhiteMeat
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 1741
Location: Dar Al-Harb
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 Posted: Sat Oct 23, 2004 7:08 am Post subject: |
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True.
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A voice from heaven should be ignored if it is not on the side of justice. ~ Isaac Bashevis Singer
It wasn't you who killed them, it was Allah. ~ 8:17 |
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Phedippedes
Joined: 20 Mar 2004
Posts: 8092
Location: Not on FFI anymore
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| Posted: Sat Oct 23, 2004 10:17 am Post subject: |
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| I agree that any petition should be about censorship vs freedom of speech. It could even reference the Nazis, Communism or the Inquisition. It should not mention *anything* about what 'we' feel about Islam. We would seem biased and 'Islamophobic' first and censorship figters second. |
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USApostate
Joined: 14 Mar 2004
Posts: 19
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Oct 23, 2004 4:19 pm Post subject: |
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Okay people, I'm ready to post almost immediately. But before I do, I'd really like to see if Ali Sina would be willing to write us a testimony (and/or possibly get in touch with other high profile people like Ibn Warraq). So anyone who can get in contact with him please get him to check out this post.
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Islam's goal:
"Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faith, but to become dominant. The Koran . . . should be the highest authority in America, and Islam the only accepted religion on earth."
--Omar M. Ahmad, Co-founder of CAIR |
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muslim4ever
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 115
Location: Egypt
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USApostate
Joined: 14 Mar 2004
Posts: 19
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Oct 23, 2004 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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Muslim4ever:
I find it funny that you're trying to change the subject by pointing out that Craig Winn is "on the run," when in fact the real issue at hand here is freedom of expression, not whether or not Craig Winn's book is correct. Hell, if you're so convinced it is wrong, why complain about it?
Long story short, Islam is NOT above being criticized! Freedom of expression does in fact extend to people who criticize Islam. Deal with it!!!
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Islam's goal:
"Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faith, but to become dominant. The Koran . . . should be the highest authority in America, and Islam the only accepted religion on earth."
--Omar M. Ahmad, Co-founder of CAIR |
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Sir Galahad
Joined: 16 Jun 2004
Posts: 1938
Location: Avalon
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| Posted: Sat Oct 23, 2004 6:00 pm Post subject: Muslims demanding that criticism of Muhammad be illegal!! |
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Dear Muslim4ever,
Click here to read Craig Winn's side of the story:
www.prophetofdoom.net/debate_nadir.html
Unlike Nadir Ahmed, Criag Winn posted the e-mails he and Nadir Ahmed exchanged about the debate. This enables people to make up their own minds about this issue. I find it interesting Nadir Ahmed is not as open about what happened, but merely calls Craig Winn names on the page he linked to.
Summary: Craig Winn accepted Nadir Ahmed's challenge. He wished to engage in a written debate with Nadir Ahmed first and was willing to do a live debate after the written debate had been completed. Nadir Ahmed refused a written debate. Who is the coward? Read the e-mails and judge for yourself.
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Courage is rightly esteemed the first of human qualities, because it is the quality which guarantees all others. _Winston Churchill
Winter is Coming. - Motto of House Stark |
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Leia
Joined: 03 Aug 2004
Posts: 1693
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| Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2004 5:06 am Post subject: |
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Article unavailable as per the author's request.
Restoration is possible upon request.
--administrator |
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TheOtherWhiteMeat
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 1741
Location: Dar Al-Harb
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| Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2004 5:39 am Post subject: |
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It is also important to note that simply "returning fire" and slandering Christianity is strictly forbidden in Islam (S. 6:108 , S. 29:46). |
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| But what I found to be amusing, is that Craig Winn is living on Fantasy Island, if he thinks that the Jesus of the Bible can not be mocked and insulted in the very same brutal fashion. |
Typical. Muslims have two mouths and two truths. One for the kaffir, one for themselves.
_________________
A voice from heaven should be ignored if it is not on the side of justice. ~ Isaac Bashevis Singer
It wasn't you who killed them, it was Allah. ~ 8:17 |
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Never_a_Dhimmi
Joined: 22 Sep 2004
Posts: 30
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| Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2004 9:27 am Post subject: |
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| TheOtherWhiteMeat wrote: |
| No big deal. They could have a zillion signatures and it wouldn't change the law. |
I agree. Just to see if I could get a reaction I sent Mr. Sharaaz Khan Qadri of the Members of Islamic Educational and Cultural Research Center. The following email:
Dear Mr. Qadri,
I came across your petition demanding that Craig Winn's book "Prophet of Doom" be pulled from public availability with some surprise. Assuming that you are advocating this in the United States, are you aware of the 1st amendment of the Constitution? If you haven't ever read it I'm providing it for you here:
Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
Perhaps you didn't realize that in our country we have a guaranteed right to speak freely about religion. As much as you detest this book, Mr. Winn has every right to view his opinion about your prophet. Although Muhammad may be beloved by your community, Most Americans have a contrary view of his actions and message. Do you really think that in a country where a Michael Moore is free to lampoon President Bush with impunity that you'll get any results attempting to stop the distribution of this book? You may also be surprised that in America you can go to any library or bookstore and pick up a copy of Hitler's "Mein Kampf" or Karl Marx's "The Communist Manifesto". Even during the Cold War such literature was freely available. For many Americans the Quran is just such a book, advocating intolerance, violence and world conquest. This freedom to make information freely available is what sets the United States apart from most Muslim countries. If Muhammad is really the messenger of God he needs no legislative help to protect his image and if he's not then no one has the right to prevent scrutiny and criticism of what he did and stood for.
The perception most Americans have of Muslims is that they want to come to our country, not to integrate as Americans but to infiltrate our land, with allegiance only to Islam. Your petition only serves to reinforce this image and serves as a warning that Moslems have hostile intentions toward America.
You should also be aware that if you actually were successful in carrying out your objective to have this book banned that a similar petition to restrict the free distribution of the Quran would also be possible. The Quran is loaded with verses inciting hatred and violence toward Jews Christians, unbelievers, women, and apostates among others. Don’t be surprised if you see such a petition circulating in the near future.
Regards,
xxxxxxxxx
_________________
"We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children"
Native American Proverb |
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TheOtherWhiteMeat
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 1741
Location: Dar Al-Harb
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| Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2004 9:29 am Post subject: |
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Amen.
_________________
A voice from heaven should be ignored if it is not on the side of justice. ~ Isaac Bashevis Singer
It wasn't you who killed them, it was Allah. ~ 8:17 |
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Mughal
Joined: 14 Feb 2004
Posts: 1211
Location: Islamabad,Pakistan Glasgow,Scotland
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| Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2004 1:20 pm Post subject: |
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Well, nearly 15000, people felt no hesitation and signed the petition so quickly that shows the true intentions of many muslims the while they are living in the west.
many nonmuslim people think muslims are peaceful and freedom loving people but this proves otherwise. It seems sept 11 is losing its impact because muslims are not feeling the pressure they suppose to for towing the line. They are going back to their old tricks trying to impose their will on wider commuinity.
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All the best from Mughal at http://www.religionandsecularism.gq.nu/favorite_links.html |
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Richard_The _Lionheart
Joined: 07 Sep 2004
Posts: 6166
Location: England
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| Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 12:46 am Post subject: Re: Muslims demanding that criticism of Muhammad be illegal! |
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They can’t debate with someone online, so why are these guys so desperate to get Mr Winn into a public debate face to face?
Fatwa issued?
Assassination? |
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bushbadee
Joined: 19 Feb 2004
Posts: 2294
Location: Account Retired
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| Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:05 am Post subject: |
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Piggy writes
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Save The Planet- Plant More Trees
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Hey Piggy, how about coming up here and getting some of those trees you like so much out of my driveway.
We had to saw up two of them, oaks , that fell across my drive way today.
Not to mention the huge one I cut up yesterday, next to my house that was going to fall on my neighbors house, 50 feet away from my house.
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This account has been retired out of respect. Rest In Peace, Bushbadee. |
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USApostate
Joined: 14 Mar 2004
Posts: 19
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 10:06 pm Post subject: |
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Hey everyone,
Sorry I've been away for so long. I've been out for a week, and when I got back, my internet has been down... Now that it's back up, I'd like to get right back where I left off.
I created the petition to counter the Muslim one:
http://www.petitiononline.com/islam999/petition.html
PLEASE, everyone sign this! Try to get everyone you can to do the same, because the stupid Muslim petition is currently the most popular petition in all of petitiononline! Ali Sina, if you're reading this, I would REALLY appreciate it if you'd sign this and try to get it out.
Okay everyone, let's get this thing circulated!!!!!!
_________________
Islam's goal:
"Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faith, but to become dominant. The Koran . . . should be the highest authority in America, and Islam the only accepted religion on earth."
--Omar M. Ahmad, Co-founder of CAIR |
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Aisha Yusuf
Joined: 05 Sep 2004
Posts: 126
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| Posted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 11:03 pm Post subject: |
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This is a great idea, and unfortunately very timely. With the recent murder of Theo, it's so important to let people know that there are many in support of freedom of speech.
To publicise it more the thread to this petition should be moved to the title page and the action thread. It's too buried here and won't be found very easily. I will place links in other forums. |
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