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Winston Churhill (& grandson) On Islam

 
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The Cat



Joined: 23 Apr 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 4:03 am    Post subject: Winston Churhill (& grandson) On Islam Reply with quote

Winston Churchill On Islam
The River War, 1st edition, Vol II, pages 248-250 (London, Green &Co, 1899).

"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.

A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement; the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property - either as a child, a wife, or a concubine - must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men.

Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities. Thousands become the brave and loyal soldiers of the Queen: all know how to die. But the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it.

No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytising faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is sheltered in the strong arms of science - the science against which it had vainly struggled - the civilisation of modern Europe might fall, as fell the civilisation of ancient Rome."

--------------
On 14 June 1921, hard on the heels of the Cairo Conference, at which he had presided over the re-shaping of the Middle East, including the creation of modern day Iraq, he warned the House of Commons:

--''A large number of [Saudi Arabia’s King] Bin Saud’s followers belong to the Wahabi sect, a form of Mohammedanism which bears, roughly speaking, the same relationship to orthodox Islam as the most militant form of Calvinism would have borne to Rome in the fiercest times of [Europe’s] religious wars.

The Wahabis profess a life of exceeding austerity, and what they practice themselves they rigorously enforce on others. They hold it as an article of duty, as well as of faith, to kill all who do not share their opinions and to make slaves of their wives and children. Women have been put to death in Wahabi villages for simply appearing in the streets.

It is a penal offence to wear a silk garment. Men have been killed for smoking a cigarette and, as for the crime of alcohol, the most energetic supporter of the temperance cause in this country falls far behind them. Austere, intolerant, well-armed, and blood-thirsty, in their own regions the Wahabis are a distinct factor which must be taken into account, and they have been, and still are, very dangerous to the holy cities of Mecca and Medina…''

-------------------------
For in the end, Churchill saw the Sudan campaign as a conflict between barbarity and civilisation. Of the battle of Omdurman he wrote: “Civilisation — elsewhere sympathetic, merciful, tolerant, ready to discuss or argue, eager to avoid violence, to submit to law, to effect compromise — here advanced with an expression of inexorable sternness.”

From Winston Churchill (1874-1965) also on Islam:
"Islam, which above all others was founded and propagated by the sword - the tenets and principles of which are . . . incentives to slaughter and which in three continents had produced fighting breeds of men - simulates a wild and merciless fanaticism" (quoted by Michael Savage).

Two more related quotes:
--''A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject.''

--''An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.''
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The Cat



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PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 4:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Googling on Churchill and Islam, I came to this conference report made by Winston's grandson, also named Winston Churchill. He gave it in Jackson, Tenn. about a month ago.

Churchill warns of Islamic threat, recounts grandfather’s legacy
http://www.sbcbaptistpress.org/bpnews.asp?ID=24058
By Tim Ellsworth
Baptist Press. Sep 27, 2006.

JACKSON, Tenn. (BP)--Radical Islam poses to Western civilization a threat similar to that of the Nazis and the Soviets, Winston Churchill said Sept. 26 at Union University.

Churchill -– author, journalist, former Member of Parliament and grandson of the former British prime minister -– spoke before about 1,800 people at Union’s 10th annual Scholarship Banquet to raise funds for students scholarships.

“Together we have overcome far more powerful enemies than those that assail us today,” Churchill said. “I have every confidence that, in confronting this new challenge, America and Britain -– together with our allies -– can prevail and shall prevail, just as together we have triumphed in the past.”

Churchill noted his grandfather’s crusade against the Nazis and the Soviets and his efforts to woo the support of Franklin D. Roosevelt in the fight.

“By the power of his oratory, he persuaded his fellow countrymen -– though the situation seemed hopeless -– not to surrender in those crucial weeks of late May/early June 1940, when all effective resistance to the Nazis on the continent of Europe had come to an end and many, including the friends of Britain abroad, thought that we were finished,” Churchill said. “It was this alone that made possible -– once America joined the fray some 18 months later -– the liberation of the nations of occupied Europe and the ultimate defeat of Nazi Germany.”

If it weren’t for his grandfather’s resolute opposition to Germany, Churchill said the Nazi swastika might still be flying over Buckingham Palace, the houses of Parliament and the capitals of Europe.

One of the qualities that made Churchill so successful as a leader was his prescience, the younger Churchill said. His grandfather was one of the first to warn about the dangers that Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union presented.

The former prime minister also spoke about the dangers of Islamic fundamentalism 85 years ago, and the younger Churchill said recent events have proven his grandfather to be prophetic. The threat from radical Islam comes in two forms, Churchill said. The first is the global terrorist threat that everyone recognizes. The second is a demographic threat confronting Europe.

For example, Churchill pointed to the population trends in France, where 10 percent of the population is Islamic. But among those 20 years of age and younger, that percentage rises to 30 percent. Given the rates at which Muslims reproduce, that means France will be an Islamic state in only one generation.

“Europe is sleepwalking towards disaster,” Churchill said. “We would sooner commit national suicide than be accused of being politically incorrect.”

Churchill concluded his remarks by examining the essence of leadership, as embodied by his grandfather.

“It comprises many elements: knowledge, wisdom, prescience, honor and courage,” Churchill said. “As Winston Churchill himself declared, ‘Courage is rightly esteemed the first of human qualities, because it is the quality which guarantees all others.’”

Previous keynote speakers for the scholarship banquet include George H.W. Bush, Margaret Thatcher, Mikhail Gorbachev, Rudy Giuliani, Colin Powell and Lou Holtz.
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Lotus Feet



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PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you

Lotus Feet
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pilgrim



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PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

he New York Times and Hitchens, two exemplary specimens of the Western Secular Fundamentalism condemned Pope BXVI for his lecture and his one line quote from the 15th century Byzentine empreror and defended holy prophet Muhammad and Islam as a man and religion of peace, and claimed the Pope is ignorant about Islam.

The West is fighting Islam while guarding its back against stabs by the secular Fundamentalists who have been drilling holes over the last 250 years in the ship of the West to sink it.,

Best regard, Pilgrim
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Karin1



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PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 11:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, The Cat, thank you for that. Published in 1899, nothing has changed, has it? Winston Churchill was a very wise man, and I admire him and his legacy. It's too bad he died in 1965, because we sure could use him now. What vision!
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The Cat



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PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 1:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Karin1 wrote:
Wow, The Cat, thank you for that. Published in 1899, nothing has changed, has it? Winston Churchill was a very wise man, and I admire him and his legacy. It's too bad he died in 1965, because we sure could use him now. What vision!
Hi Karin1...
This edition is now a collector item, worth like $1,000. But I heard it would be reprinted.

Looks like his grandson, another Winston has inherited many of his grandfather's courage.
Quote:
One of the qualities that made Churchill so successful as a leader was his prescience, the younger Churchill said. His grandfather was one of the first to warn about the dangers that Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union presented.

The former prime minister also spoke about the dangers of Islamic fundamentalism 85 years ago, and the younger Churchill said recent events have proven his grandfather to be prophetic. The threat from radical Islam comes in two forms, Churchill said. The first is the global terrorist threat that everyone recognizes. The second is a demographic threat confronting Europe. (...) “Europe is sleepwalking towards disaster,” Churchill said. “We would sooner commit national suicide than be accused of being politically incorrect.”

It's a shame that his address was only published in a small, local, Baptist Press. The usual rampant dhimmitude. But we'll spread the news, won't we? Being on FFI frontpage would help this a lot.
Bye.
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markie



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PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 2:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lotus Feet wrote:
Thank you

Lotus Feet
Here's something about his grandfather you might enjoy. http://www.meforum.org/article/673
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marky



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PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 11:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Winston Churchill was a very wise man, and I admire him and his legacy. It's too bad he died in 1965, because we sure could use him now


Perhaps he has already been reborn and is ready to step into the limelight in order to help us again. It is possible ...
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Lotus Feet



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PostPosted: Thu Oct 26, 2006 1:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

very possible...there are certainly new leaders in integrity coming up the ranks all over the world. It will depend on the people !

Lotus Feet
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jimmytheclaw



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PostPosted: Thu Oct 26, 2006 6:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/4943

free copy of the book at above link. its an interesting book
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The Cat



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PostPosted: Sun Oct 29, 2006 1:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Churchill never wrote ''Islam'' but Mohammedanism and talked about the Mohammedans, except once where he wrote Moslems referring to their individual qualities as opposed to their religion. That is quite intriguing...
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Alla



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PostPosted: Sun Oct 29, 2006 2:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Churchhill was a very intelligent man. I have always enjoyed learning about him and reading/hearing his thoughts. It is good to see his grandson possesses the same intelect, foresight, and articulation.

Thanks for this Cat!
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The Cat



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PostPosted: Sun Oct 29, 2006 3:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jimmytheclaw wrote:
http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/4943

free copy of the book at above link. its an interesting book
It is indeed, yet this is the 1902 edition which was shortened into one book. See:

http://www.staugustine.net/theriverwar.html
---''Originally published in two volumes in 1899, The River War has been out of print in its original, unabridged version since it was shortened to one volume in 1902. Only 3,000 copies were printed, and the first edition costs thousands of dollars today. The original version abounded in colorful stories about Churchill, controversial judgments on his contemporaries (especially his commanding officer, Lord Kitchener), and thoughts on Islamic fundamentalism and British imperialism. Because they were left out of every subsequent edition, they are all but unknown today, even to scholars. The 1899 edition was illustrated with drawings, photogravures, and colored maps that disappeared with the 1902 abridgment.

The new St. Augustine’s Press edition includes the entire text of the original edition, returned to print for the first time since the book was abridged. It also includes all material added or altered in later editions of the book. New appendices add a definitive new edition of Churchill’s newspaper dispatches from the Sudan, based for the first time on his original manuscripts, as well as Churchill’s other writings on the Sudan from 1898 to 1958.''
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The Cat



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PostPosted: Sun Oct 29, 2006 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alla wrote:
Churchhill was a very intelligent man. I have always enjoyed learning about him and reading/hearing his thoughts. It is good to see his grandson possesses the same intelect, foresight, and articulation.

Thanks for this Cat!
My pleasure and duty, Alla! Winston S. Churchill III also spoke at
the John Locke's Foundation's 16th anniversary hold Feb.10, 2006.

Some excerpts from it:
Quote:
But today a new challenge — another ism — confronts us, and that is the challenge of Islamic fundamentalism. Extremist Islam has declared war on the rest of the world, as evidenced by their ruthless attacks across the globe — overwhelmingly targeted at innocent civilians. Beside the outrage of 9/11, the bombings in Madrid, in Bali, in London and, most recently, in Jordan come to mind.

Those who have declared jihad against the West, and Western values, such as freedom of speech, are doing all in their power to mobilize against us the large Muslim communities living in our midst. In North America, there are an estimated six million Muslims in the USA, plus a further three-quarter million in Canada; while in the European Union, they number an estimated 20 million, including nearly 2 million in Britain. Unlike most other categories of migrant, the Muslims are reluctant to assimilate and, all too often, wish to pursue their own agenda. (...)

Churchill is, of course, well-known for his gift of prescience and, specifically, for being the first to warn of the menace of Hitler and Nazism as early as 1932, and of the Soviet threat in his famous Iron Curtain speech in 1946 in Fulton, Mo. But how many know that he also warned the world of the dangers of Islamic fundamentalism? I certainly did not!(...)

Such is the anger of the Moslem world against the West, inflamed by extremist clerics and fanned by the Al-Jazeera and Al-Arabia television networks, that truly democratic and free elections would result in the election of fundamentalist governments throughout the Muslim world. It is a frightening fact, that in 50 Muslim countries countless millions of Muslims tell pollsters that they regard Osama Bin Laden and Ayman al-Zawahiri as more trustworthy than President Bush.

The third and by far the most serious development, is the decision of the Iranian government of President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad to remove the U.N. seals from its nuclear research facilities. He it is who not only denies the Holocaust ever happened, but who declares that Israel is a “tumor” that should be “wiped off the map”! Some Western analysts state that the Iranian president doesn’t really mean what he says. There were, of course, many who said just that of Hitler’s Mein Kampf, and we saw the result. (...)

In conclusion, I would remind you — and especially the legislators on Capitol Hill — of Winston Churchill’s words to the House of Commons on becoming prime minister in May 1940, which applies every bit as much to the situation that confronts us today.

----‘’You ask: What is our aim? I can answer in one word. It is victory. Victory at all costs, victory in spite of all terror. However long or hard the road may be; for without victory there is no survival.’’

Note: Obviously, his grandson still ignores the quote taken out of the ''River War'', 1st edition, that so many blogs now dispel all over the net. As my previous post pointed out, the 1902's subsequent edition was shortened into one book and many of his controversial statements were left out, so much that even scholars aren't aware of them.
It's about time to spread it...
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