Suggestion for flyers - getting right to the core of Islam

[enceladus]

Hi all -

I have some suggestions for flyers / posters which can get right to the core of Islam - no mucking around.

A sample.....

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SO YOU BELIEVE THAT THE QU'RAN IS THE WORD OF ALLAH......

If the Qu'ran is the word of Allah, it must be perfect in all details. Allah would not make mistakes.

The Qu'ran mentions that "the sun sets in a muddy spring."

Is this true?

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Other fliers could then use the same theme, bu homing in on (say) mathematical discrepancies and so on.

After the seed of doubt has been planted by the first batch of fliers (as above), the next set of fliers could list the twelve or so characteristics of a cult, and the bits of Islam that match each of those points.

The key is -

* To keep things short and simple.
* To use the kind of language (as seen above) which could even be put in an ad in a subway station, on a train, on a bus, etc.

**** UPDATE..... ****
Humour - a very powerful tool.....

I passed through New Zealand not long ago, and they have a company there which has an advertising campaign that has become legendary - it is part of the culture there now....

It uses the phrase "Yeah, right" to mock things.

On the left of a poster is a phrase (e.g. "Helen Clark (former P.M. of New Zealand, really ugly) - "could be sexy if she tried". On the right, you then have the phrase - "Yeah, right".

So, examples for Islam could be -
"Islam, the religion of peace." "Yeah, right."

"The sun sets in a muddy spring" "Yeah, right"

"Sperm come from between the backbone and the ribs" "Yeah, right."

You get the picture......

The aim is to go on the offensive, bust through the b.s. and deliver a JOLT right to the core.

Even some Muslims must realise that the sun does not set in a muddy spring.....

[Farid]

Salaam,

Enceladus, I will discuss your first flyer, "SO YOU BELIEVE THAT THE QU'RAN IS THE WORD OF ALLAH......

If the Qu'ran is the word of Allah, it must be perfect in all details. Allah would not make mistakes.

The Qu'ran mentions that "the sun sets in a muddy spring."

Is this true?"

Enceladus, I would really appreciate it if you kept this on topic and do not divert. But it seems that you made a claim, and that is when you said, "If the Qu'ran is the word of Allah, it must be perfect in all details. Allah would not make mistakes. " Would you be kind enough to provide some evidence that Allah does not or will not make mistakes?

Please do not go around asking me if Allah exists, this happens often. It is you who has made the claim that is the reason I ask, so please provide evidence.

And lastly, it is commented that the Quran is saying that it appeared to zhul Qurnain that the sun sets in a muddy spring. It seems plausible to think that you have seen such images of the sun setting.

Thank you.

[enceladus]

[Farid]

Salaam,

Dear Enceladus, I asked you for evidence regarding your claim that God does not make any mistakes. In reply to that, you have actually made more claim and have provided no evidence. Below I would like to highlight your claims and will ask for evidence once more.

So, if a god has the knowledge to prevent all mistakes, surely he could not make any.

This is an assumption and you need evidence to back it up.

In answer to your question about Zhul Qurnain, you wrote, Indeed, if the guy knew that the sun "set" in more than one place, why bother making the journey at all? How would the guy know that he had "arrived" at the "setting place"? He could always do another day's journey and find it "setting" elsewhere! Enceladus, the word used in the Quran is maghrib. If you are a Muslim and or know a Muslim, you might know what maghrib means. Actually, Maghrib has different meanings. It can mean the place of sunset maybe in the sense of west, east, etc. Maghrib also can mean time of sunset, so in the context of Zhul Qurnain, this meaning can easily apply, he reached a place when the sun was setting, in other words, at the time of sunset.

Thank you.

[FinallyFree]

Proof that Allah claims he is perfect and infallible?

Quran 10;37

‏10:37 وماكان هذا القران ان يفترى من دون الله ولكن تصديق الذي بين يديه وتفصيل الكتاب لاريب فيه من رب العالمين


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Transliteration: Wama kana hatha alqur-anu an yuftara min dooni Allahi walakin tasdeeqa allathee bayna yadayhi watafseela alkitabi la rayba feehi min rabbi alAAalameena

Literal: And this the Koran was/is not that it be fabricated from (by) other than God, and but confirmation (of) what (is) between his (Prophet Mohammad's) hands, and detailing/explaining The Book , no doubt/suspicion in it, (it is) from the creations all together's/(universes') Lord.

Allah is all knowing....

010.061
YUSUFALI: In whatever business thou mayest be, and whatever portion thou mayest be reciting from the Qur'an,- [color=red]and whatever deed ye (mankind) may be doing,- We are witnesses thereof when ye are deeply engrossed therein. Nor is hidden from thy Lord (so much as) the weight of an atom on the earth or in heaven. And not the least and not the greatest of these things but are recorded in a clear record.
PICKTHAL: And thou (Muhammad) art not occupied with any business and thou recitest not a Lecture from this (Scripture), and ye (mankind) perform no act, but We are Witness of you when ye are engaged therein. And not an atom's weight in the earth or in the sky escapeth your Lord, nor what is less than that or greater than that, but it is (written) in a clear Book.
SHAKIR: And you are not (engaged) in any affair, nor do you recite concerning it any portion of the Quran, nor do you do any work but We are witnesses over you when you enter into it, and there does not lie concealed from your Lord the weight of an atom in the earth or in the heaven, nor any thing less than that nor greater, but it is in a clear book. [/color]

Allah's ninety nine names, and therefore attributes:

الجبار Al-Jabbār The Powerful, The Irresistible, The Compeller, The Most Lofty, The Restorer/Improver of Affairs (59:23)

العليم Al-ʿAlīm The All Knowing, The Omniscient (2:158, 3:92, 4:35, 24:41, 33:40)

Proof enough?

[yeezevee]

[FinallyFree]

Thanks for reminding me Yeezevee, there is the famous Ayat al Kursi, all about the infalllibility, perfection and omniscience of God, enjoy:

اللّهُ لاَ إِلَـهَ إِلاَّ هُوَ الْحَيُّ الْقَيُّومُ لاَ تَأْخُذُهُ سِنَةٌ وَلاَ نَوْمٌ لَّهُ مَا فِي السَّمَاوَاتِ وَمَا فِي الأَرْضِ مَن ذَا الَّذِي يَشْفَعُ عِنْدَهُ إِلاَّ بِإِذْنِهِ يَعْلَمُ مَا بَيْنَ أَيْدِيهِمْ وَمَا خَلْفَهُمْ وَلاَ يُحِيطُونَ بِشَيْءٍ مِّنْ عِلْمِهِ إِلاَّ بِمَا شَاء وَسِعَ كُرْسِيُّهُ السَّمَاوَاتِ وَالأَرْضَ وَلاَ يَؤُودُهُ حِفْظُهُمَا وَهُوَ الْعَلِيُّ الْعَظِيمُ

"Allah! There is no god but He - the Living, The Self-subsisting, Eternal. No slumber can seize Him Nor Sleep. His are all things In the heavens and on earth. Who is there can intercede In His presence except As he permitteth? He knoweth What (appeareth to His creatures As) Before or After or Behind them. Nor shall they compass Aught of his knowledge Except as He willeth. His throne doth extend Over the heavens And on earth, and He feeleth No fatigue in guarding And preserving them, For He is the Most High, The Supreme (in glory)." [Surah al-Baqarah 2: 255]

The Arabic Phonetics are: Allahu la ilaha illa huwa, Al -Haiyul-Qaiyum La ta'khudhuhu sinatun wa la nawm lahu ma fi as-samawati wa ma fil-'ard Man dhal-ladhi yashfa'u 'indahu illa bi-idhnihi Ya'lamu ma bayna aydihim wa ma khalfahum wa la yuhituna bi shai'in min 'ilmihi illa bima sha'a Wasi'a kursiyuhus-samawati wal ard wa la ya'uduhu hifdhuhuma wa Hu wal 'Aliyul-Adheem


A whole ayah, one of the most important in the Quran, dedicated to showing how perfect Allah is. How can you deny these signs my dear Muslim friend?

PS, sorry to whoever was arguing with this guy, not trying to steal thunder or thrills, just helping in your absense.

[Farid]

Salaam,

Finallyfree, I asked to have proof of the claim made by enceladus, so in response you quoted Quranic verses to show that Allah is perfect. So then do you believe the Quran is from God?

Thank you.

[infidel_01]

[Farid]

Salaam,

Hello infidel_01, you wrote, Don't try to be shifty. See what he wrote and try to find the word GOD in it. And I believe that quran is word of allah and allah is no god. Dear infidel_01, it would be senseless almost to go around saying there are "mistakes" in the Quran because this does not prove that Allah is not God. So then what is the point of even making this flyer? If your point is to show Allah is not God then you will have to show evidence, else if it is to show that there are mistakes in Islam, then that is a different case even though that hardly proves anything. So then please tell me what is the point of this flyer?

Now lets read it a little bit more carefully. According to enceladus, Allah would not make mistakes. How does he know this? Just because it says it in the Quran does not count. If I get a letter that says, "Hi, I am a professor.." Does that mean he/she is really a professor?


Thank you.

[infidel_01]

[Farid]

Salaam,

infidel_01, why do I even need to show where he mentioned God? What difference does it make? Do you want an apology? Then I am truly sorry for making a mistake. You wrote, If you get a book that says, "Hi, I am allah, the creator of universe.., the one and only god etc and this book is from me to mankind" Does that mean he/she is really a creator of the universe, the one and only god etc and the book is from him to mankind? Exactly infidel_01, it seems that my point has been taken. By the way, that is not the reason I believe the Quran is from God.

Thank you.

[infidel_01]

[infidel_01]

[Farid]

Salaam,

infidel_01, I dont feel we should be talking about why I believe. You can start a new thread. I think we should stay on topic so to be more productive. Anyways, you mean to tell me that even though you know that those "errors" dont mean much, you are still trying to tell them so to perhaps "fool" them? Because I do not see what other reason you would post that because you should know that those things do not prove that the Quran is not from God.

Thank you.