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crazy canuck
Joined: 20 Mar 2004
Posts: 6391
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 Posted: Sat Dec 13, 2008 8:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Haik Monsieur wrote: |
| Balls-of wrote: |
| Gravity is a fact as it can be observed directly. Not so evolution. |
What is your food habit Balls, your brain seems to be sharper than I thought.., |
Gravity cant be observed directly!!
We observe object falling and we call it gravity.
Electricity is not observed directly. We see lightening falling( before theory came along , it was called missile of Allah  ) or light bulb alight when current passed and we call it Electricity. We know it by its characteristic.
We cant observe magnetism either. We see iron being attracted by a stone and that property is called magnetism..Some one could call it a magic of Allah that attracted piece of iron.
Heat is not observed, When we get burnt by glowing charcoal we announced got burned by heat of charcoal 
By the way all scineces have theories. Theory of magnetism, Electricity, Particle physics and biologcal science has theory of evolution. |
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Funk Soul Bruvha
Joined: 25 Nov 2004
Posts: 3307
Location: Thailand
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 7:42 am Post subject: |
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| Balls_of_Titinium_1 wrote: |
| Gravity is a fact as it can be observed directly. Not so evolution. |
Gravity is a "fact"?
You sure about that?
It is always quite humorous when Muslims attempt to engage in scientific discussion.
According to Einstein, what we perceive and call "gravity" is actually a result of the warping of space/time. AS another poster mentioned, it is a indirect observance; we cannot observe gravity directly.
Think of driving a car on a perfectly banked road. If you come up to a curve and the road is perfectly banked, you will travel through the curve in a straight line (The wheel won't turn) because of the bank on the curve (as with the warpage of space due either mass or theoretical gravitons; science is still uncertain).
Also, light is not 'pulled' by gravity for this exact reason. It continues to move in a straight line over a curved surface.
If light enters a black hole, it cannot escape. This is not because gravity is pulling the light in (Photons have no rest mass) but because the curvature is so great, the light is wrapped back around on itself and is unable to leave.
To borrow a popular analogy, "Gravity is the racetrack, NOT the engine that drives the car." It is the 'fabric' of space-time that is the racetrack is made of.
In particle physics, there is the aforementioned 'graviton' theory, that gravity is caused by particles.
Currently the observed effects fit both quite well, and it's difficult to say exactly what gravity is.
So is gravity really a "fact"?
LOL.
Steven Hawking on gravity:
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Bodies like the earth are not made to move on curved orbits by a force called gravity; instead, they follow the nearest thing to a straight path in curved space, which is called a geodesic. A geodesic is the shortest (or longest) path between two nearby points.
The mass of the sun curves space-time in such a way that although the earth follows a straight path in four-dimensional space-time, it appears to us to move along a circular orbit in three-dimensional space.
Light rays too must follow geodesics in space-time... this means that light from a distant star that happened to pass near the sun would be deflected through a small angel, causing the star to appear in a different position to an observer on the earth. |
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Indoctrination
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Balls_of_Titanium_1
Joined: 09 Dec 2008
Posts: 104
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 10:14 am Post subject: |
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| THHuxley_redux wrote: |
| Balls_of_Titinium_1 wrote: |
| Gravity is a fact as it can be observed directly. Not so evolution. |
What would lead you to believe that evolution cannot be observed directly? |
Show me an ape turning into human. |
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Cassandra
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 4495
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 10:16 am Post subject: |
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| Balls_of_Titinium_1 wrote: |
| THHuxley_redux wrote: |
| Balls_of_Titinium_1 wrote: |
| Gravity is a fact as it can be observed directly. Not so evolution. |
What would lead you to believe that evolution cannot be observed directly? |
Show me an ape turning into human. |
That shows what little you know about the subject of human evolution. I suggest this little primer should help dispel your ignorance. But only if you view it with an open mind. Your quran is totally busted by the existence of hominid fossils.
http://www.becominghuman.org/documentary |
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Balls_of_Titanium_1
Joined: 09 Dec 2008
Posts: 104
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 10:29 am Post subject: |
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| Funk Soul Bruvha wrote: |
| Balls_of_Titinium_1 wrote: |
| Gravity is a fact as it can be observed directly. Not so evolution. |
Gravity is a "fact"?
You sure about that?
It is always quite humorous when Muslims attempt to engage in scientific discussion.
According to Einstein, what we perceive and call "gravity" is actually a result of the warping of space/time. AS another poster mentioned, it is a indirect observance; we cannot observe gravity directly. |
We call gravity the force which makes objects fall on earth. That force, or perceived force, can be an effect of anything. It maybe due to warping of space-time, or exchange of gravitons, but it can be observed directly nonetheless.
It seems you need to follow your own advice and stop talking about matters you have little conceptual understanding about. I am an Engineering Major and have a Masters in Physics. These matters are my forte. Be aware.
| Quote: |
| Think of driving a car on a perfectly banked road. If you come up to a curve and the road is perfectly banked, you will travel through the curve in a straight line (The wheel won't turn) because of the bank on the curve (as with the warpage of space due either mass or theoretical gravitons; science is still uncertain). |
We call the effect, observed as force exerted, due to some underlying phenomenon, "gravity."
Thus if you name the force experienced by a car driving through a curve, due to the bank, "X", then "X" is very well a fact and can be observed directly.
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If light enters a black hole, it cannot escape. This is not because gravity is pulling the light in (Photons have no rest mass) but because the curvature is so great, the light is wrapped back around on itself and is unable to leave. |
So what?
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To borrow a popular analogy, "Gravity is the racetrack, NOT the engine that drives the car." It is the 'fabric' of space-time that is the racetrack is made of. |
Gravity is a symptom.
| Quote: |
In particle physics, there is the aforementioned 'graviton' theory, that gravity is caused by particles.
Currently the observed effects fit both quite well, and it's difficult to say exactly what gravity is.
So is gravity really a "fact"?
LOL. |
LOL at you because nothing you have related above which shows that Gravity is not a fact. It IS a fact.
| Quote: |
Steven Hawking on gravity:
| Quote: |
Bodies like the earth are not made to move on curved orbits by a force called gravity; instead, they follow the nearest thing to a straight path in curved space, which is called a geodesic. A geodesic is the shortest (or longest) path between two nearby points.
The mass of the sun curves space-time in such a way that although the earth follows a straight path in four-dimensional space-time, it appears to us to move along a circular orbit in three-dimensional space.
Light rays too must follow geodesics in space-time... this means that light from a distant star that happened to pass near the sun would be deflected through a small angel, causing the star to appear in a different position to an observer on the earth. |
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The effect is still called gravity.
And particle theory contradicts this Einsteinian view of the world and it would probably be proven wrong. soon. |
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Haik Monsieur
Joined: 17 Sep 2006
Posts: 2393
Location: FFI
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 10:56 am Post subject: |
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| Balls_of_Titinium_1 wrote: |
| We call gravity the force which makes objects fall on earth. |
And give us more like this. I will gather all your quotes and finally publish as a separate thread in this forum.
| Balls_of_titinium wrote: |
| That force, or perceived force, can be an effect of anything. It maybe due to warping of space-time, or exchange of gravitons, but it can be observed directly nonetheless. |
Gravitational force is observable. Balls_of_titinium. FFI. 14. December 2008
| Balls_of_titinium wrote: |
| I am an Engineering Major and have a Masters in Physics. These matters are my forte. Be aware. |
Just curious. You got your masters in physics from any Mosque around Pakistan?
| Balls_of_Titinium wrote: |
| We call the effect, observed as force exerted, due to some underlying phenomenon, "gravity." |
Don't change the plate and disappoint me genius. Stick with your statement gravitatinal force is observable. In case you do not know what it means observable, you can check a dictionary. I always advice Muslims to keep a dictionary handy all the time.
| Balls_of_Titinium wrote: |
| Thus if you name the force experienced by a car driving through a curve, due to the bank, "X", then "X" is very well a fact and can be observed directly. |
You are absolutely right Balls of blablablas..; That is why Newton called Apple gravity, because it was apple that hurt his head.
| Balls_of_Titinium wrote: |
| Gravity is a symptom. |
More like this. I am thrilled now.
| Balls_of_titinium wrote: |
| The effect is still called gravity. |
You disappoint me again.
| Balls_of_titinium wrote: |
| And particle theory contradicts this Einsteinian view of the world and it would probably be proven wrong. soon. |
Harrr.. Harrr... Go on genius. I am sure you can prove it wrong. I see you are very much capable of it. Please...
Regards
KhaliL
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Last edited by Haik Monsieur on Mon Dec 15, 2008 5:11 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Rat_bytes
Joined: 22 Apr 2008
Posts: 539
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 11:10 am Post subject: |
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BOT, perhaps you could explain to us how you would convince someone of the truth who had a deep conviction that gravity was actually the result of ghost hands pulling objects towards a central mass? All that stuff about space-time warping is just scientific jargon, I would like you to show me observable evidence that the gravitational effect is not the result of ghost hands pulling things towards earth. You drop something, the ghost hands pull it down. Simple as that.
In the same vein, do you understand how asking to directly observe a theory itself is illogical, as in "Show me an ape turning into a human"? Your criteria for proof is unrealistic, unless you were able to extend your lifespan by millions of years there is no way you could observe speciation happening in front of your eyes. There are mountains of supporting evidence that we can study and glean logical conclusions from, but we can never prove that god wasn't the cause of it all and left the evidence there to confuse us, just like we can't prove that gravity isn't really the result of invisible ghost hands.
I realise I'm probably talking to the wall here, but maybe someone else can make the concept even simpler to understand?
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The world holds two classes of men - intelligent men without religion, and religious men without intelligence. - Abu’l‐Ala al Ma’arri |
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Ex-muslimah
Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 909
Location: Scotland somewhere
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 6:15 pm Post subject: |
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What about the magnetic field effect? 
_________________
The Borg is si-fi's Islam. The "Collective" is the Ummah and they assimilate the kaffir.
*http://www.karmanirvana.org.uk/* - For if you are in a forced marriage in the UK |
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crazy canuck
Joined: 20 Mar 2004
Posts: 6391
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 6:58 pm Post subject: |
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What Gravity?
Earth sucks!! You stupid.  |
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crazy canuck
Joined: 20 Mar 2004
Posts: 6391
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 7:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Ex-muslimah wrote: |
| What about the magnetic field effect? |
Like gravitational force Eletro-magnetic field is a force, lot stronger than gravitational force.
Almost all metals have magnetic domain( size greater than size of molecule) within this filed, magnetic force is effective, outside it force decreases. Iron has very strong magnetic domain and hence exert strong magnetic force. Non metals dont have magnetic domain and they repel magnetic force. Ultimately all metals are magnetised by magnetic filed of the earth.Without that field we will have very weak magnetism even in metals. |
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Infidel_tiger
Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Posts: 133
Location: India
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 7:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Why are you guys arguing with Madrassah educated BoT?? He probably thinks 'jinns' are what run cars. There are 'jinn academies' in Pakistan. Maybe he goes to one of them |
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THHuxley_redux
Joined: 15 Jun 2008
Posts: 1248
Location: Denver, CO
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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| Balls_of_Titinium_1 wrote: |
| Show me an ape turning into human. |
Apes are not currently turning into humans, so there is nothing to show along those lines. Just as Napoleon is not currently invading Russia, so I cannot show you that either.
And yet, Napoleon's invasion of Russia actually happened.
Now... back to the question. Since you did not answer it, I will ask it again...
What would lead you to believe that evolution cannot be observed directly?
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Nullius In Verba |
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Ex-muslimah
Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 909
Location: Scotland somewhere
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| Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 1:16 am Post subject: |
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| crazy canuck wrote: |
| Ex-muslimah wrote: |
| What about the magnetic field effect? |
Like gravitational force Eletro-magnetic field is a force, lot stronger than gravitational force.
Almost all metals have magnetic domain( size greater than size of molecule) within this filed, magnetic force is effective, outside it force decreases. Iron has very strong magnetic domain and hence exert strong magnetic force. Non metals dont have magnetic domain and they repel magnetic force. Ultimately all metals are magnetised by magnetic filed of the earth.Without that field we will have very weak magnetism even in metals. |
Cheers but I know about the magnetic field effect, it was for BoT
Smooches CC
_________________
The Borg is si-fi's Islam. The "Collective" is the Ummah and they assimilate the kaffir.
*http://www.karmanirvana.org.uk/* - For if you are in a forced marriage in the UK |
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SkepticOfBible
Joined: 14 Oct 2007
Posts: 140
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| Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 4:46 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| However, my question is - has evolution been established as an undisputed scientific fact? |
In the scientific community, Evolution is the current established fact and theory. This may change once a competiting theory is able to replace the status quo with supporting evidence
Evolution as Fact and Theory by Stephen Jay Gould
Btw, guys if you need more material to debunk the pseudo science of creationism, it can be found here, because BOT is making the same lame arguements as the Christian Creationist and the guys over there have done a pretty good job of handing their ass back to them.
| Quote: |
| Show me an ape turning into human. |
On a similar note
Evidence of evolution at work |
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pr126
Joined: 24 Jan 2005
Posts: 373
Location: Eurabia
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| Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 9:13 am Post subject: |
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This thread is very entertaining.
Especially the guy who says "I am an Engineering Major and have a Masters in Physics."
Calls himself Brains of Titanium. Or something like it.
Balls_of_Titinium_1?
What is Titinium? A new element has been discovered?
Name: Titinium
Symbol :Tit
Number: 2
Atomic Weight: quite a handful
Masters in Physics!  Pull the other one.
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"It has yet to be proven that intelligence has any survival value." - Arthur C. Clarke. |
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