Did Muhammad covet a child princess still being wet-nursed?

[Righteous]

[Hector]

[sbwus]

It is not about winning or losing, it is rather about truth and honesty. One must first provide the dictionary meaning because almost all people are ignorant of Islaam including many Muslims. Thus, if I tried to educate the birdbrain of FFI about the complex Shariah rules, it would fit in their thick and inpenetratable skull. That is why the dictionary meaning was given. But out of multiple meanings you all like to pick the one that fit your agenda.

Well, in your moronic world it works that way, but among learned and well versed, the truth is not even close to what you all assert. So you can think all you want, but truth of the matter is that I have been teachings you all that no one @ FFI taught you all.

But I can guarantee you all, that you all can’t win (Period) against Islaam and that is the bottom line!
_________________
"An uninformed person cannot conceptualize the essence of knowledge nor its sublimity. One who fails to conceptualize something, its significance will never become rooted in the heart."

[pablo]

Hector,

No Muslim will willingly admit what you have found and mostly know. They hate to admit one of the truths about Muhammad because it is very stark.

You were correct in your second assumption.

according to Ibn Sina of Buckara (AD 980-1037) who was Islams most respected physician who wrote many of the historical texts concerning birth and child development of his time. You can find the translations of his works from Medline in the histoical archives section.


Ibn Sina of Buckara stated that wet nurses were paid staff with the same general position as a subordinate wife. After the child turned two years old the wet nurse was then sent to live with another family member to help facilitate the weening process. The wet nurse generally stayed within family groups unless there was not enough children requiring her status. Then she would find employment in another family.

It is the father's responsibility according to Ibn Sina of Buckara to insure that his children recieved the white blood of human breast milk for two years. If he failed in his duty he is guilty of neglecting his child and if the child should die he would be guilty of murder of his child.

The relationship with the wet nurse was an ecconimic one which lasted two years with much respect and position. The wet nurse would then be sent to another relative who was in need of the nurses' white blood for the health of the child. Ibn Sina of Buckara made it clear that the wet nurse should leave the child's home to insure that the child weened properly. Ibn Sina of Buckara gave examples of children from Persia, India and China where children remained on the breast for many years which he interpreted as being unhealthy and making the child weak.


Therefore according to one of the best examples of Islamic history in medicine, The princess was under two years old or had a child of her own. The fact that the conversation was rather intelligent, I do not think the princess was 2 years old but a mother herself. Since she was not married, she was either a victim of rape, incest, or engaged in ilicit sex or a widow. Take your pick as it is not clear. When the koran and hadiths write of people who dislike the prophet or were not nice they generally leave out the details. They write glowingly of only those who showed favor or kindness to Muhammad. It is an Ego thing to make Muhammad more improtant and try and hide some of the dirty little things even though they must be discussed. A 7th century spin so to speak.

What she had to say should confirm what people of the day thought of Muhammad. They considered him nothing.

As a freed slave who gained his freedom by marrying the daughter of his owner, He was using his new status to try and better his life. Remember that carivan people and slaves could not marry into noble families. Wealthy families could. certain holy men and prophets were granted rights that Muhammad was willing to take with both hands. Since she was a princess, I would say that Muhammad was lusting after her money. Remember Females had doweries. And Princesses had the largest of doweries.

Muhammad was after money with this girl especially since she obviously disliked Muhammad and scorned his attention and did not even like the fact that he wanted to touch her.
Why would a man want to marry a woman who does not like you and could not even stand your presence? Answer: Money! Lots of examples of this through the darkages were men married women only for the money. Many times these women were banished to the third harrem in islamic society where they never were seen again. Sometimes they were killed. It depended on who the relatives were and if those relatives had any real power of retrobution.

Hope that helps,

pablo

[Righteous]

[humandecency]

[rand]

[Hector]

[pablo]

Hector,

I am aware that many muslims and arabs did and still do not always follow their own teachings. Why else do they seek western medicine verses their own today.

However, The koran and hadiths are truly unclear on this topic.

With all that is said and what the princess said was more important than anything else for that matter.

The princess confirmed the status of Muhammad in his day.

He was considered a freeman and nothing else. Not even a prophet for the princess would have called him by that position. If he was from a notable family meaning a wealthy one, she would have called him by another term. Instead she was repulsed by the exslave.

The princess got it right. He was a nobody who should not be allowed to marry a noble. As far as how old she was, I do not know. She could have been older than you position if you apply some western standards to the wet nurse who would become the primary personal maid of the girl in her charge from birth until her death.

So its unclear. I do not know and there is no way to know for sure. But one thing is certain from the passages. Muhammad was not considered a prophet in his days by the noble families nor the main rulers of his time. Only when the almohad clans of North Africa through Ibn haram convertion of the Barabers especially Ben Yusuf who reconquered Arabia and pushed into Spain. It was not until 687CE that mecca was retaken and made permantly Islamic.

Ben Yusuf tried to destroy Christiandom and through his efforts and his son Yu'kub they pushed into parts of Spain and France but were held back by Charlemagne in 778 who drove them to the sea and helped set the course of Spain for the Cid. When the seond reconquest by Yukub's son did the emirs of North Africa take Zaragosa and parts of Aragon and Pamploma. The Cid Conquered Spain and made Spain what it is today and the North Afican Moors (short for almohads pronouced al moorads) could no longer be a threat in Europe.

Like I said before and many times from now. History is very damning to Islam.

pablo

[Hector]

Further evidence that the princess was a child.

http://freespace.virgin.net/ismael.essop/inshiraah.htm

[Al-Akfar]

It would seem highly likely that the child was around ten years of age. It should, however, come as no suprise that Muhammad would covet her, bearing in mind that he married 'Aisha at six and bedded her at nine. Moreover, as a previous post points out, he decided that he would marry a girl when he saw her crawling around as a baby. What surprises me in this instance is that the Muslims on the forum are insisting that she was not a child. Why is it allright in their view for Muhammad to have married 'Aisha at six but not this girl?

[Funk Soul Bruvha]

pedophilia was not an isolated instance with that old Perv, Mohammad.
as Al-Akfar points out, Ol' Mo was even attracted to infants who were still crawling:

[Orenda]

Thankyou Hector, I had read that hadith before and didnt analyze it the way you did. I had always assumed that when she referred to her wet nurse, she meant the slave woman whom she owned that nursed her children...but the hadith did not mention that she was married, and I hardly think Muhammad would want a woman who had children without marriage. Although, I don't think it to be far-fetched for Mumu to propose a married woman, considering his behavior with Zaynab. On the other hand, Aisha was only 6 when married by Muhammad, and only 4 when first coveted by him. The princess may not have been a toddler, but she might have very easily been a young girl, 10 or 11 still watched by her nanny.
Either way, it's all messed up...even if this woman were 30 yrs old - Muhammad's behavior is very arrogant and selfish.

[yeezevee]

[Seif]