ISLAM's LAGGING BEHIND THE WEST AND ITS BACKWARDNESS IS SELF DOING
Submitted by Dr. K Prabhakar Rao on Mon, 07/06/2009 - 05:56
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Only one Muslim country, the Turkish republic has formally separated religion from State as law. It’s founder Mustafa Kamal (Ata Turk) has enacted the removal of Islam from the constitution and abrogation of Shariat, which ceased to be a part of the law of the land. Several Muslim States restricted Shariat to marriage, divorce and inheritance and adopted Western laws in other matters. There has been some move like this in ‘Bath’ party that once ruled Iraq and is in now strong in Syria. However, Saddam Hussein, former President of Iraq has been dethroned after military action by US led coalition forces (1). Pakistan reeled under the dictatorships of army generals and General Parvez Musharraf who was the last British styled aristocrat in Pakistan with some modernity and vision for his country also stepped out. He harbored the hope of being a legendary Mustafa Kamal (Ata Turk) of Turkey for his feud- torn country. But the Military Fundamentalist Junta that engineered the coup for him against former Prime Minister Nawaz Sheriff had engulfed him while in power. He had precarious existence and If he deviated from the anti Indian and fundamentalist path, the Junta was capable of repeating a coup. He was therefore forced to do a great tight rope-balancing act in his country keeping the Junta happy till he was eased out (2).
Islamic demonology in anti secular writings includes names such as former legendary Presidents Colonel Gamal Abdel Nasser and Anwar Saadat of Egypt, Shah Pehalwi of Iran, Afiz Al Assad of Syria, Saddam Hussein of Iraq, Mustafa Kamal of Turkey, King Farukh and Kings of Arabia. All these men who had some modern and forward thinking lumped together as one mass are considered as great betrayers of Islam and as inside enemies who wear Muslim face, bear Muslim name, and is therefore much deadlier than the open enemies from outside (3). Thus for Muslims, Islam is not merely a system of belief and worship, a compartment of life so to speak distinct from other compartments which are the concern of non religious authorities administering non religious laws. It is rather whole of life and its rules include civil, criminal and even what we would call constitutional law (4). Democracy and modernity appear to be at the infinity in Muslim world ( Turkey is an exception) and everything centers around the scripture. Recent chaos in Iran is the glaring example of pseudo democracy in Iran where elections are conducted where results are predetermined.
The center of problem facing Arab Muslims and indeed all Muslims today worldwide is to find a new way of life-Islamic in character, which will be halfway between the West and East that will provide internal stability necessary to enable Muslims to face their problems independently. The Arab world can borrow technology from the west, but it must find the answers to it’s deeper problems within itself. As per Abdullah Ai Al Qasimi in his book “These are the chains”, he stands out with a frank observation that, “ignorance based on religious doctrine has tied our people with knot upon knot”, and proceeds to analyses causes for backwardness among Muslims (5).
The low state of Islam in every field of human endeavor as stated by him compared to west carries over into the depressed situation of the individual Muslims as compared to the individual Christian in whichever country the two groups are living side by side. Al Qasimi admits that Muslim Arab’s Cultural immobility can’t be overcome, except to the extent to which foreign (That is Western, meaning Christian) influence and training are accepted. Arab humanity belongs to “abject frustrated, ignorant, weak” type and not to the other type of humanity, which is progress minded, successful, knowledgeable and strong that is found in West (6). Man has been created for future greatness and East and West have recognized this fact.
East has neglected and gone to slumber while West has realized its material and intellectual possibilities. Hindus claim and beat their chests loudly that all the modern science and inventions were already known to their past spiritual masters and are hidden in Vedas the ancient scriptures. You name any thing they would link it to Vedas. Nuclera weapons are compared to Brahmastra that was wielded by accomplished sages and kings with divine blessings. But who prevented them from exploiting them and Yet, India has remained technologically and scientifically very much backward for centuries. In fact English rule in India was a blessing in disguise. The Indian princes and chieftains whiled away their time mostly in dance, theology, poetry, drama, music, literature, paintings,sculpture except science and technology and remained backward from West. They claim their backwardness to be the result of Islamic occupation and exploitation by the Englishmen in subsequent years. There is no doubt that Western countries gave the breakthrough in the modern science and industrial technology, the benefits of which every one is reaping now. Most of the backward countries want all help from West. But they hate West and attribute all reasons to them for their backwardness. Arabs and Muslims have chosen to be weak in body and mind and lagged far behind the West that galloped towards modernity. By engineering 9/11, 2001 attack on USA by the Islamic terrorists, the Muslim world has finally cut it’s own feet towards prosperity and dug it’s own grave by refusing to modernize and adopt modern governance. For all the ills in Arab and Muslim world West is blamed. The interesting part is that every guy ifrom third world country whether it is Muslim or Non Mulsim country wants to land up in USA or UK.
In the words of Omar A Farukh in his book “ Arab Genius in Science and Philosophy”, great contributions were made by Muslim scholars in the past in the field of theology, mathematics and natural science, but such scholars ceased to exist after 14 th century. He has attributed Arab and Muslim backwardness to concentration on traditional, linguistic and theological studies in contrast to technological advances of Europe. Arabs by and large failed to make use of the scientific and technological knowledge that the West has gained so that they could compete in the narrow world, both in the material and in spiritual struggle (7). Arab institutions in Arab States kept themselves away from more profitable areas of science and technology and wasted their precious time on fruitless pursuits such as theological works (8). A civilization cannot flourish by glorifying past and thumping chests on past laurels, achievements and greatness. It has to keep abreast with change of time and the requirements of modern age. God only helps those who struggle and work hard and help themselves. It must perform continuously towards growth. Otherwise, others would overtake them. The Muslim world lacked exactly in this aspect and as a consequence badly suffered.
On the other hand, Muslim women remained isolated from modern education and were confined to the houses rearing the children and satisfying their husbands. Their world revolved around household works, pleasing their husbands, religion and other related restrictions. The children in such societies tend to become arrogant and fundamentalist devoid of urge for modern and scientific temperament. Even today numerous honor killings are carried out in Islamic nations and women are suppressed and exploited (9). In cities like Hyderabad in India poor Muslims sell their daughters to the lusty old Arabs ( Of Grand fathers age) from Middle East. The provisions in the scripture are misused by the middle men and mullahs. These young girls once taken out of the country land up in dire straits and god only knows their fate. Women like Irshad Manji (10), Ayaan Hirsi Ali (11) and Taslima Nasreen (12) who raised voice in protest against suppression and asked for reformations in faith have been condemned, persecuted and threatened with death. The Madrasas spend maximum time in grinding the students on scriptures and scientific education is rather absent in these societies. Talibans were direct products of Madrasas in Pakistan who banished all education for women in Afghanistan. Societies in which women are suppressed and exploited would always remain backward. Now Taliban is knocking at the seat of power in Pakistan and they already destroyed girls- schools in the area of their influence. Pakistan although is keeping Taliban at bay by severe fighting its success is doubtful.
Muslims also allege that the West had purposely denied scientific know how to them. In the words of Dr Mohammed Kamal Ayyad, a teacher of philosophy at Higher Teachers College, Damascus and author of several studies on Arab Political and cultural problems, The West was interested in keeping orient and especially Arab and Muslim world in a state of spiritual and outwardly matters so that they had neither energy nor interest left to learn from West. The western nations did not want technology, science, industry and organization to be learnt by Arabs and Muslims nations. It is claimed that West was willing to support only those Muslim Institutions, which studied cultural heritage, mysticism, and rhetoric and grammar etc. They did not help other Muslim and Arab Institutions in acquiring scientific equipments, up- gradation of laboratories, promoting acquisition of technology and establishing chairs for comparative literature (13). What Arabs and Muslims particularly resent is the rich array of external manifestations of Western superiority in all the material, economical, technological and organizational fields. These attainments are constantly exhibited, rather flaunted by West and these endorse superiority of West. Muslims consider Western permissiveness, style of living, freedom to women as debauchery, sinful and immoral. They feel that the Muslim society is being corrupted by the Western influences. They hate west, but at the same time cannot avoid contact with them, they need them, as they are completely dependent on West for technology, modern education, industry and exploration and organization. Muslim students run to West to study at the Universities, employment and are influenced by the freedom in the society. They feel liberated. Back at home, the Mullahs cry hoarse that their culture, youth and way of life is being corrupted by the western civilization and mode of life. Arabs feel Western life to be against the morality of their religion in which they sincerely believe and thus West is seen inferior to Arabs. Arabs and other Muslims thus soon developed cultural inferiority complex (14).
Ottoman Empire that ruled over all Middle East countries collapsed after World War I (1915-1918) and the Middle East Muslim nations were colonized by European nations for a long time. This also has helped in building resentment among them. Although they became independent later, they were completely dependent upon West for all matters. These States soon came under the grip of fundamentalist and medieval Mullahs and blood thirsty dictators. Religion has been used to mesmerize the crowds in the name of scriptures and God.
It is a strange fact that Muslims by and large hate the west. It is also a fact that Ottomans (Turks) dominated Arabs and they cruelly suppressed Arabs. When 9/11 took place some sections in India and Pakistan danced on streets singing that America was doomed. Arabs had to serve in the armies and fight wars for Ottomans and yet hatred towards Turks was not high. One of the reasons was commonality of religion and Turkey enjoyed the position of Caliphate, the religious supreme for Sunni Muslims who represent 90 % of the Muslim population in the world. Japan was occupied by USA for very long time after World War II. More over, Americans dropped Atom Bomb over Japan in 1945 causing large numbers of deaths. Yet, the hatred towards West is not found in Japan. Similarly, Muslims and British occupied India and it suffered greatly under the Muslim invasions and rule. Yet, there is no hatred towards Muslims and the British in India. Hindus have not declared war against the Muslims and the British. Arabs and other Muslims can’t completely detach themselves from traditional culture unlike British educated Indians. Neither can they keep away like Japan’s Zen Roshi. Their marginality causes discomfort leading to hatred. As summarized by scholor J Desparmet in 1932, the ultimate basis of all allegations to the West is the religious fervor or jealousy which fires Muslims and Arabs from which he derives or deduces all kinds of other objections (15). Their backwardness is due to the inability to change with the time and see reason that has conflicting requirements with the religion and hang on to the dogmas and scriptures. Unless the fundamental approach is changed, backwardness in Arab and Muslim States would continue and grow and there is no escape. Where Women are suppressed and not treated equal such societies sooner or later would disintegrate and disappear. Muslim States have to adopt democracy, modernity and scientific temperament keeping religion aside for spiritual pursuits, if they have to compete with West and survive to be precise..
Bibliography
1.Bernard Lewis, Islam and West, Oxford University Press, 200, Madison Avenue, New York, 1993, ISBN 0-19-509061-6, PP 4
2. Robert D Kaplan, Soldiers of God, Vintage Departures, New York, Vintage ISBN 1-4000-3025-0, 2001
3. Bernard Lewis, Islam and West, Oxford University Press, 200. Madison Avenue, 1993, SBN 0-19-509061, PP 185
4. Ibid, PP 4
5. Al Qasimi, Hadhi Hiya. l Aghlal (These are the chains), Cairo 1946, PP 12-70 as summarized by Von Grunnebaum, Islam essays in the nature and Growth of a cultural tradition PP 216-219, as cited in Raphael Patai, The Arab Mind, Hatherleigh Press, 5-22, 46 Avenue, Suite 200, Long Island City, New York, 111101, ISBN 1-57826-117-1, 2002, PP 266,267
6. Ibid, PP 267
7. Ibid, PP 268, 311
8. Ibid, PP 312
9. Souad, Burned Alive (A survivor of an honor killing speaks out), Warner books, 1271, Avenue of Americas, New York, 10020, ISBN 0-446-53346-7. 2003, PP 29
10. Irshad Manji, The Trouble With Islam, St Martins Griffin, New York, 2003, ISBN 0-312-32700-5, PP 136
11.Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Caged Virgin, Free Press, 1230 Avenue, New York, 2004, ISBN 0-743-29501-3,PP 11
12. Tasleema Nasreen, Lajja, LGF, ISBN 2253139246, 1996
13. Raphel Patai, The Arab Mind. Hatherleigh press 5-22, 46 Avenue, Suite 200, Long Island City, New York, 111101 USA, ISBN 1-57826-117-1, 2002, PP 318
14. Bernard Lewis, Middle East, Scribner, 1977, ISBN 0-684-83280-1, PP133-136
15.Wilfred Cantwell Smith, Islam in modern History, Princeton University Press, 1977, ISBN 0-691
Irrelevant post
Irrelevant post
[...] original here: ISLAM's
[...] original here: ISLAM's LAGGING BEHIND THE WEST AND ITS BACKWARDNESS IS SELF DOING … Tags: backward, dethroned-after, hong, science, university [...]
irrelevant comment
irrelevant comment
Irrelevant post Moderator
Irrelevant post
Moderator
Comment irrelevant to
Comment irrelevant to topic
Moderator
Proudkafir, you have been
Proudkafir, you have been warned far too many times not to post comments that are not relevant to the discussion. Your posts shall be deleted without warning henceforth if you continue to post in this manner.
Moderator.
One more point, Even after
One more point,
Even after war in vietnam and Serbia, there is no terrorists from there with purpose to harm US. While a muslim from bangladesh etc who have nothing to do with US will dance at innocent US persons getting killed.
Any society suffers, if a general feeling of superiority develops. Great civilizations like Roman, Eqypt, east byzantium, persian etc are now past or history. Now only 2 greatest civilizations remained one Indian and another chinese. The whole world is a family and exchange of science and technology and trade is necessary.
There was a great renaissance happened when western freethinkers breaked the knots put down by Pope or christian clergy and started moving to different areas. Only after they became free from christian dogma that scientific revolution started. The church want to take the credit, but even a fool know that who are good in science are athiests or freethinkers. Even now church puts presssure on stopping various research. One example like 'stem cell research', this has the potentiality to cure problems like blindness etc.
The colonial powers were more materialistic than religious, infact East India company wanted only gold, spices and other assets. Many missionaries followed them. After 1857, British found that those who converted to christianity doesnt want India to be free and like British rule. In fact the song ' Bande Mataram' was the rallying cry for independence from British rule. Infact India got independence because of sacrifice of Hindus with baggage of Islam and Christians.
Luckily, the British India army was composed of approx 90% hindus and sikhs and the revolt by Subhash Bose and Indian Navy forced British to give up independence.
India was the richest place till 19th century, thats why British etc came. The hindus after british came started studying more about european history and other works. As per a chinese thinker of war Sun Tse, it helped Indians to know more about there colonial enemy.
Infact now a average Indian knows 3 languages and there is a slow but steady progress whereby Indians are getting developed at a very fast pace. Infact India has more engineers than whole of europe combined together. More english speakers than US.
Currently world faces a huge problem in the form of Islam and communism. Infact there is a scenerio that muslims doesnt have the techinical advantage , but they have the will to kill. So communists like China will give them weapons and as muslims have numbers they will fight to kill non-muslims.
proudfakir, "I do not think
proudfakir,
"I do not think the west is christian at all!" exactly, Western nations are generally secular, that is non religious, that is their strength and the source of their long term tecnological sulperiority over other non Western socities. Only the Japanese have been able to challenge the West because they too, do not have dogmatic religious institutions. Moslems and Hindus who see the West as "Christian" don't get the point at all and never will. Moslem and Hindu nations were 500 years behind the West before the first European imperialist arrived,blame yourselves.
a comment,
India invented the zero(so what, so did the Maya about the same time) what did Indian or Moslem scientists do with it,very little, it was the West that produced the Renaissance, the Enlightenment, the Age of Reason and the Industrial revolution. India would not have known any thing about nuclear energy without Western scientists. Hindu claims to great scientific achievements before the West are as ridiculous as Moslem claims.
Dear Rocky If you want a list
Dear Rocky
If you want a list of achievements of India/Hindus, do your research. You will pale in comparison.
You needed Renaissance, enlightenment from what? Christianity of course. We are already enlightened. Come to India learn some Meditation. You will reach the light within you.
Peace.
Irrelevant post
Irrelevant post
a_comment, Please list the
a_comment,
Please list the material and scientific achievements of Hindu civilisation, spirtual "enlightenment" is subjective and not relevant to our discussion. NB I'm not disputing that for much of the Western medieval period India(and China) were in advance of the West, however both societies were conservative and made little material progress while the Europeans were advancing rapidly. Many people who despise the West readily accept its knowledge and technology while not understanding the true basis of its power,its secular and democratic organisation.
Irrelevant post.
Irrelevant post.
Root of terrorism is Islam
Root of terrorism is Islam and root of Islam is monotheism of christianity. Mr Mo saw how bishops were like kings, and everybody respected them, the popes etc acted with impunity. Now also popes and bishops do church or spiritual service less but politics more.
The initial leaders of US know the harmful effects of christianity and similar other dogmas, so they stressed on 'Freedom' and 'Liberty'. They did to christianity in US what Ataturk did to Islam in turkey.
Muslims dont want critical thinking on Islam as they take lot of things as literally, similar christians also want a limited dialogue.
Luckily christianity is not a political force now and a educated man knows that 'dalai lama' will also go to heavan( if there is anything like that) while he doesnt beleive in trinity( or jesus as saviour etc etc).
Islam cant be defeated by christians , but by rationality and 'freethinkers'.
Great article for a change!
Great article for a change!
I was looking for the
I was looking for the explanation for backwardness because I want to put forward that as a reason for curtailing diplomatic/trade relations of my country with Islamic states. My state, Britain, suffers from blackmail, extortion, kidnapping and terrorism for maintaining such relations. But, our rulers and diplomats maintain that oil sheikh's money is too important to ignore.
The article is not good in explaining why Islamic states without oil are poor.
1) North Africa, comprising Algeria, Morocco, Tunisia and Libya were bread basket of Roman Empire before Egypt and Turkey were added to the Empire. Why are these areas desert under Muslims?
2) Egypt was an important rich area for Roman Empire. During all pre-Islamic civilizations, Egypt was rich. Why is it poor since Islam arrived in mid seventh century?
3) Turkey was a bread basket of Byzantine Empire. It was an important area, the Byzantines would fight to keep against constant Islamic aggressions over many centuries. Why is that area now poorer than Greek areas, a reversal of their relative positions?
4) Why is Palestinian area poorer than Israel? Palestinians receive enormous aid from oil states. Also, a significant number of Arabs in Gulf oil states are Palestinians.
5) When India was partitioned, the Muslims making up 25% of total population of pre-partition India, received whole of one major river basin, Indus, and a share of the other major river basin, Ganges/Brahmaputra. Muslim Pakistan received more per-capita land area than India. Moreover, Pakistan expelled/killed off non-Muslims who made up 20% of their population. Expelled population ended up in India. The Muslim population remaining in India remained and their proportion increased from around 12% to 15%. The per capita GDP of Pakistan areas was higher than that of India at the time of partition. Why was this reversed and now India has higher per capita GDP? Why does Bangladesh, a former component of Pakistan, suffer more from famine and flooding than India?
6) Why was the cradle of civilization, Iraq, now a basket case in spite of oil?
7) Why Afghanistan, described as a prosperous green area in the pre-Islamic periods, became a poor desert like area with famine since the arrival of Islam as described by Mongol invaders in the middle ages? It has never recovered since, in spite of numerous looting expeditions to prosperous India, conducted between 1000 AD and 1800 AD, with the looted wealth lasting only for a few years after such expeditions.
8) Why Persia in the pre-Islamic period was an innovator of technology and now a backward area trying to steal nuclear/weapons technology from others?
Answers anyone?
The Article starts out well.
The Article starts out well. But to say that only the west had science and progress seems to be ridiculous. What about the numeral system we use? The so-called "Arabic numerals". Didn't they originate in India?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_numerals
Or what about plastic surgery?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_surgery
or India's contribution to mathematics:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_mathematics
I have not even included the contributions of ancient Egypt, China, Persia and other eastern countries to human civilization!
Surely the author of this article seems to have forgotten that without these contributions, there would not have been progress!
Yes, British rule did help in making progress in India, there is no denying that. But the article seems to be one sided by saying that "English rule a blessing in disguise."
The article could have listed the negative aspects of the British rule in India and other countries. However, the author seems to have been carried away by the west and have forgotten totally about the east!
Its clear that every
Its clear that every civilization contributed at one stage or other to science , technology and humanity BUT 'arab' and 'muslim' contributed to killing, concubine culture, women subjugation, suicide attacking and mass scale poverty and loot.
There is no denying that european, roman, ancient egypt, ancient persia, india, china , japan, america, israel have contributed and still contributing for good of society but muslims want to STOP that. They want all men have long beard, women wear hijab, be a sexual tool only. Muslim men want to stone women as its a kind of sport for them. Play 'buzkasi' and sometimes loot others, drink camel urine and curse jews and infidels and live in PEACE.
At one time or the other all
At one time or the other all civilizations have contributed to man's learning. Every piece of the puzzle is important. It is a cumulative process where every little step is important and thanks must be given to each contribution.
However, in the last 500 years the gross majority of new learning has come from the Industrialized West. The list goes on and on, yet it is hard to find similar contributions from the East or for that matter from the Southern hemispheres. Why is that? My view is that it is cultural and governmental.
In the West the shackles of religion were removed and the rest is history. It was the West who discovered and exploited the resources of the world. Navigation was entirely invented by the west; of course navigation is not important is it? Modern medicine was exclusively invented by the West. All modern material science and metallurgy was exclusively invented by the West. Space exploration was the province of the West. Advances in warfare are Western. Electronics were totally invented and perfected by the West. Most philosophy is a Western invention. Modern astronomy and physics has been advanced by the West. The concept of a massive University system is the province of the West. Modern agricultural science is a western concept that we could grow more food with less effort and the Universities were the reason agricultural science made the great advances it has in the last 100 years.
The people of the West have no more mental powers than people from other areas, but our culture and governments have a lot to do with breeding people who ask questions and seek to do things easier. We are quick to seek change and are willing to risk our capital for the purpose of having a better life. That technology is shared with the rest of the world, yet the nonproductive world want to claim invention of some arcane math 1,000 years ago. What I am talking about is the scientific explosion in the last 500 years. It is nearly the exclusive province of the West.
I welcome a comparative list of basic science from the industrial West and the rest of humanity combined. Let us look at Japan: since World War II: Japan has been an economical miracle, but what new sciences have they contributed? They are great at applied science but what new breakthroughs have they created? They did not invent the TV, automobile, computer, space flight, material science or anything else. They are good at applying science but bereft of coming up with new science.
The Arabs invented steel; however, it took an Englishman to make steel in mass amounts because he studied the structure of iron versus steel and found a way to make large amounts. Let us talk about chemistry and there is not one Eastern or Southern name attached to any new chemistry.
So in reality the West leads the world in learning and it is my fervent belief that it comes from the culture and government that tend to produce thinkers and doers.
4. a_comment Says: Comment
4. a_comment Says:
Comment irrelevant to topic
Moderator
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Dear Sir/Madam
What I commented was based upon the article, and not in reply to someone, if its irrelevant then the quotes should have not been in the article in the first place.
I am not a great believer in conspiracy theories, but this time would make an exception.
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"Japan was occupied by USA
"Japan was occupied by USA for very long time after World War II. More over, Americans dropped Atom Bomb over Japan in 1945 causing large numbers of deaths. Yet, the hatred towards West is not found in Japan."
You forgot to mention the USA has good relations with Japan.
German who was defeated and occupied by the USA harbors no hatred for us neither.
Also Israel who has been fighting with the Palestinians for years does allow them to become citizens, join their army, give them medical treatment and exc.
To Humanist #, There is a
To Humanist #,
There is a phenomenon called 'brain drain', if you see any Phd programs in US 80 % are having origin from southern hemisphere (including japanese, chinese).
Also around 99 % non-muslims are doing Phd in US.
"In fact English rule in
"In fact English rule in India was a blessing in disguise."
I know where this statement comes from. Babus in India who still work mostly with colonial laws written during British rule. When British took over, Islamic rule in India was already on decline due to Sikh and Maratha resistance. British built few roads and rail roads for their own benefit and not for the benefits of people of India. London archives will tell you how much profit British govt made from India each year. No welfare govt works for profit. When British left India in 1947, more than 80% of population was living under poverty line. The condition was even worse than Islamic rule.
Yes, British gave us a language called English. But India had achieved the status of a great civilization and a powerful economy through out history till the middle ages without English or British Technology or Laws.
Lot of things in India today do not change for the better because the Babus like Dr Rao, who think that British and their laws are the best. On the contrary, the old British system for the most part have become obsolete and irrelevant to India and its people. The sooner everybody realizes this it's better for future on India.
My few thoughts on this
My few thoughts on this topic:
1. Muslims never invented anything. We need to peruse their scriptures to understand the intellectual capability of their Prophet and his pet God (is it Dog?).
2. The invading Arabs claimed the already existing things from the kaffir land. All doctors, scientists, sculptures, and poets were kaffirs at one stage who were converted at the point of sword or they were born into Islam, although they had nothing to do with it. We could see this from the satires of many Iranian Muslims or Indian-born Muslims such as Kabir.
3. If technological developments in the west were a direct result of Christianity (as some people claim), then their scriptures should have supported such thoughts. OTOH, Europe lived in dark ages from 4th century till the time of scientific and industrial revolution. Free thinkers were fed up with religion and they didn't want Church to interfere in the affairs of the state. All greats like Einstein, Openheimer, Edison, and Newton didn't believe in any monotheistic God. Therefore, if a religion tries to gulp the fruits of their works, then they must be kidding.
4. Now to a very IMPORTANT topic. Are all the inventions in the west beneficial to mankind AS WELL AS to nature? Oil industry is one of the primary causes of global warming, even though automobile industry has helped us in locomotion. Alternative eco-friendly resources will not be able to meet the growing demands. Next thing is refrigeration. The amount of CFCs emitted is polluting the atmosphere to an alarming degree. The current level of CO2 in the atmosphere now is 370 ppm. The critical level at which many of the species will become extinct and humanity will be at the brink of extinction is 540 ppm. Isn't attending this problem as urgent as addressing the dangers posed by Islam?
5. UN report 2006 states that slaughterhouses are the second highest sounce of global warming. They emit nitrous oxide and methane-- which are the poisonous gases detrimental to ecological balance. I thank Ali Sena for promoting vegetarianism/veganism on his website. The question is, how many in the west, even after knowing the horrible effects of meat industry on ecology, are ready to quit meat? It is hardly about 5%. Now, shouldn't west reform itself on these fronts and request others to do the same? [The other day I saw the Head of a western country giving a speech in the parliament on how to reduce global warming; right after the speech, they showed all MPs including the PM attending a BBQ]. Good joke, hey?
6. The Muslim world will never progress with age for they want to remain in the 7th century Arab time zone.
7. Prosperity lies not in unrelented scientific and technological expansion or development. We need to love and nurture Mother Nature for sustainability. There has to be a balance between everything-- which I don't see at present in the world.
Are we better off compared to our ancestors? I leave it for other to decide.
Until the Muslim world
Until the Muslim world realizes the Satanic origins of thier cult of Muhammad, with allah Satan as their supreme being Sura 3:54, they will never rise without murder Jihads.
Allah is a word from the Dhamtic religions
Ramadan is also
Hajj
The treatment of women
clothes
killings
Lack of education
Everything
Nothing is authentic from Islam
If the succeed conquering the West:
Einstein will be a converted Jew
Wright brothers who made the airplanes
Bill Gates
all famous whites but ther bad guys will be all Christians and Jews, apes and pigs
Blacks will still be cursed and stupid. as the hadiths say and the Quran.
#24 Are you calling Arabs
#24 Are you calling Arabs stupid? You mean you had no killer before Roman Xtians or Arabic Islam. loooool wow Christian convert poor fools only. Bill Gates , the internet man a poor fool! Wright brothers fools! Many you got to be more careful. Why use the fool's internet? That makes you a bigger fool or a user.
Dear moderator How is # 25
Dear moderator
How is # 25 message relevant to te article? Am I missing some thing here?
#28 I answered the response
#28 I answered the response in #24 or can you read. Islam is irrelevant to life.
Egypt is known for great
Egypt is known for great pyramids. See this shocking video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxGPaEZPY9o) of Talibanization of Egypt. Women are asked to wear burqa in public places. Rameses will be crying foul from his grave!
THIS IS THE REAL BACKWARDNESS OF ISLAM
10. Rocky Says: spirtual
10. Rocky Says:
spirtual “enlightenment” is subjective and not relevant to our discussion
Whosoever said that spiritual enlightenment is subjective is a fraud. Whosoever promises heaven/hell afterlife is a fraud.
You can measure spiritual enlightenment, by the rule of thumb, if you feel calm after meditation, you are progressing well.
You can also measure spiritual enlightenment by modern machines, bring all your brain mapping, MRIs and place that on a yogi or put him/her under it. The brain waves generated by a yogi should resemble those of sleep state or if the yogi is a master, deep sleep. (while he is awake meditating)
I could go on an on... but its irrelevant to you and your western civilization.
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26. proudkafir Says:
Dear moderator
How is # 25 message relevant to te article? Am I missing some thing here?
Dear PK don't fool yourself any further this site has been taken over by Xians and Zionists. The pseudo secular authors here can bash Hinduism criticize islam for which they claim the site has been made and praise Xianity and Judaism (see the other article praising them "If islam is so peaceful..... )
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This is my last post here.
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May God Bless you all. Peace.
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Comment removed for making personal attacks
#26 Liar. I am not a
#26 Liar. I am not a Christian nor a Zionist but human. I appreciate all truth. If the shoe fits wear it. Because I support Jesus and some Jews means I see that it is truth that I respect. If Muslims did good I would say so. If you did good I would say so. But you are unable to respect anyone. FFI is good. You said Raisin shaped Head is this or that which shows you have a problem with. May I ask why. I am an American and as such free to speak. This proves you are not and as such dont understand freedom. Under the circumstances, please refine your thinking and respond accordingly.
not big fans of cencorship,
not big fans of cencorship, sure we grown up can take peoples comment wisely, sometimes we get carried away may be then you can warn us, the ranting ones rather funny, but copy/paste article ones pain, but you can scroll it down
***God only helps those who struggle and work hard and help themselve***
'insyalla' the word says it all, everything about allah, how can you be an inventor if you have to pray 5x a day, every times you feel some idea, time for pray. If its not west they still praying to satan (insyallah) untill now, to give them something to carry them around, fast, and off the ground.
***You can measure spiritual enlightenment, by the rule of thumb, if you feel calm after meditation, you are progressing well***
i wonder what yogi do when the train that takes them to festival turn up, will he get in the line, and form qeu or run straight to the window
And i wondered whos inventing que in the line, chewing with mouth close and so on, standard civilized people
a_comment, may be you arrogant and will not comeback, but think about it, be honest, its more xian bashing from hindu than the other way around, if its so bad why it happend only in south east asia, not globally, may be its more to the character of its own local than the belief, we gonna miss you funny commet to muslim, hope you stick around, and we give islam a good bash
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Comment removed for making personal attacks
Personal attacks are not
Personal attacks are not alllowed
Abusive post, ad homenium
Abusive post, ad homenium attacks individual/s
Adios to all
Adios to all
abusive post
abusive post
#34 I prefer ebonics. It
#34 I prefer ebonics. It taste better. Speaking the king's english is not my way. Islam is not my way either so why give Islam the best. I will save the best for lassssssssst.
#38 A0000Z What should a
#38 A0000Z
What should a person do to take birth in a hindu family and how to select the cast in which he wants to born or who makes the decission that this person should born in this cast and this person should born in this cast HEEE HEEEEEE HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Hi Raisin Head If u want to
Hi Raisin Head
If u want to know violence against dalits i request u to visit this site.
.http://www.ambedkar.org/crime.htm
39. DREAMLAND; If u want to
39. DREAMLAND;
If u want to know violence against dalits & Christians and the Muslims i request u to visit this site.
http://www.faithfreedom.org/2009/07/06/islams-lagging-behind-the-west-an...
LOL
37. DREAMLAND Says: "Can any
37. DREAMLAND Says:
"Can any hindu over here tell me, if any one converts to hinduism in which caste r u going to fit him as u have caste system."
You don't have to convert to become a hindu. You can practice hinduism whatever you are now - a human. Caste system in India was a social problem like racism in west. For most part, caste system has melted away thanks to self critical Hindus.
#41 Humanity In which world
#41 Humanity
In which world r u living ( caste system has melted away thanks to self critical Hindus )
why dont u look at site which i have mentioned above # 39
At last FFI is showing it's
At last FFI is showing it's real face, It has nothing to do with any kind of FREEDOM it is all about FAITH only that too blind faiths like Vile Islam Or Vile Christianity.
Am I correct dear so-called Ex- Muslim Moderators of FFI??
I doubt if they will answer. Ha Ha Ha Ha FAITH with some FREEDOM that too from Ex-Muslims?????. LOL
# 43 A0000Z This site to
# 43 A0000Z
This site to discuss about ISLAM and u people ( hindus ) divert the topic each and every time and now accusing the moderator.
Hi dear FFI + How about going
Hi dear FFI + How about going in to the business of censorship like any other Anti-Islamic Pro-Christian sites??Why talk big about freedom. You people may have left Islam , but Islam has not left you is a fact . You may take my words to the nearest bank. Ha Ha Ha Ha
42. DREAMLAND Asked: In
42. DREAMLAND Asked:
In which world r u living ( caste system has melted away thanks to self critical Hindus )?
In India nobody will ask your caste if you go to a grocery store or a restaurant. But there are two places where the caste system is still prevalent - when it comes to traditional marriages and politics. We are working on it like the west is working on racism. Every educated Hindu understands that discriminating people by virtue of their birth is wrong. My forefathers were from low caste. I never found any discrimination whatsoever and I am very successful in whatever I am doing today.
Now a question for you. How many non white Pope you have had in 2000 years? None. So I can very well say that Christianity is racist when it comes to power and position.
46 Humanity what at the time
46 Humanity
what at the time of taking admission in a school or college , for getting a job be it private or govt companys, I can mention more just keeping it short.
talking about pope he is a xxxx for me to know more about him just take a look at this.
http://www.elijah144.com/thewhoreofbabylon.htm
I thank god for not having a
I thank god for not having a non white pope
.http://www.reformation.org/vatican-and-islam.html
47. DREAMLAND Asked: "what
47. DREAMLAND Asked:
"what at the time of taking admission in a school or college , for getting a job be it private or govt companys, I can mention more just keeping it short."
At the time of taking admission in a govt school or college, it's a blessing if somebody's forefather's were from low caste. The education is free for them and the students get money from govt for other expenses such as food and lodging. In govt jobs too, there are reservations for people from erstwhile low caste. When I told you that we are working to fix social issues, I meant this. Having said all this, there is no denying to that fact that there is still much remains to be done to completely eradicate caste system from Hindu society.
Private school, colleges and companies do not come under reservation law. But some private school and colleges which are run by Christian missionaries won't give admissions to non Christians.
P.S.
I am not answering questions to DREAMLAND but to the people who are in this forum seeking truth. I do understand that mind of a bigot is like pupil of an eye. The more light you shed into, the narrower it gets. I am not trying to get him/her out of ignorance. He/She has to grow out of it.