Prof. P. A. Wahid vs. Ali Sina Part II

Wahid seems to be a Bihar University Graduate.
He does not understand what it means taking the challenge.
Will speak the same lines over a over like other muslim scholars.
If Wahid has guts he should declare in India that hadiths are not authenticit and that all the muslims who believe in it are kafirs.

Wahid seen what you are creating from your belif in ISALM

List of Islamic Terror Attacks For the Past 2 Months
Countries 16
Cities 123
Killed 1428
Injured 2334

And what scholars of ISLAM do
Taliban torched over 200 schools in Swat in 2 years: Report
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Taliban-torched-over-200-schools-in-S...

Toronto: Neighbor’s “Hello” Enrages Muslim Hubby
http://sheikyermami.com/2009/05/23/toronto-neighbors-hello-enrages-musli...

Well, this is where the professors fails in his argument:

"Will you then explain why all the Muslims were lying about their prophet to make him look like a beast? If you deny the hadiths, it is because you are delusional.
I am not the right person to answer these questions (motivations, reasons, etc.)."

If he can't answer the question, then these hadiths must be considered to be true. Devout muslims have no motivation for portraying their messenger as an evil villain. Therefore, it is unreasonable to assume like the professor that these stories about mohammed were invented by the mohammedans.

The great professor should step down and admit his defeat.

The Professor does not want to reject all the hadiths. He only wants to reject hadiths that have no koranic reference. But dear Professor, one lie, one bad deed is too many from a person of God. There are several of them in the koran itself. Even Professor Walid cannot disregard the hadiths which explain these verses 33:26, 33:27, 8:67, 8:17 of the koran. Are these not enough to show the character of Moham~mad ?.
--
"Allah" really made a mistake to make an illiterate person as his postman, now another postman "Jibreel" was needed to convey his message to the earthly postman.
--
Nobody other than Moham~mad saw Jibreel. If today a "Moham~mad tells us that he saw /heard"Jibreel" giving him messages of "allah", he would probably land up in a mental asylum.
More over these messages were received the most when he was with his child bride Ayesha, and even Ayesha could not see "Jibreel"

Ali Sina says; " Why thousands of Muslims who were ready to kill their own parents and brothers for Muhammad lied to malign him and how could all their lies match?"

No early followers of MoHamMad ever tried to malign their pedo. Prophet as What ever killings, looting and rapping and other atrocities committed were done while following Allah Dalla's direct divine instructions only.

Till today killing , looting, rapping infidels are never considered Crime according to pious devout Muslims.

Wahid says;
" Your argument that Prophet Muhammad was preaching something which he did not practise and he was fooling people will not find any taker in the 21st century. Why don’t you experiment and see for yourself what will be the consequence of such a venture?"

No doubt you will end up in prison as your terrorist brethren are ending up. Or will be bombed back to your Islamic whore house heaven in pieces .

Now after reading this idiot degenerate Wahid's idiotic arguments , I came to the following conclusion ---

MoHamMad after getting sodomized and inseminated by a pack of dirty pigs gave birth to the vilest of all cults called Islam.

I am sure this fact will find many takers even in this 21st century.

This quran only islam seems appearing as a warm breeze to the shame haunted educated muslims. It just offers an alternative platform to stand on for them and provides feelings of becoming free from the collective shame which is in fact another delusion.

Here our delusional professor is so ashamed of his prophet’s ideal character that even he dares to go as far as nearly to deny existence of any historical Muhammed.

“A Muslim does not need any more information about Prophet’s life than what is given in the Quran.”

If so, how can you determine the existence of a historical person named mohemmed who preached islam, brought quran and is the dearest friend of Allah. Nowhere in quran it is mentioned when did this person actually preached islam either in Arabia or anywhere. Well, the quaranic language is Arabic so he might be an Arabian, but what if the entire thing is a hoax and manufactured either in umaids or abbaside lab?

Now consider this :

A. Most probably this hoax was originated by the umaids 1st in order to subdue Arabia politically and ideologically, the oldest extant Islamic building in the world- the dome of the Rock is more like a pilgrimage shrine rather than to be a mosque to offer prayer in it. The 1st qibla was Jerusalem; dome of the rock is in Jerusalem. Damascus was the political base of umaids, so this structure was well within their domain. Also the quranic inscription in it does not include Bismillah or basmallh, which has become almost obligatory later.

B. Later , Abbasids replaced kaba in place of the Dome of the rock for the same purpose and all stories related to the change of kibla have been manufactured in Baghdad the abbasides political base center.

C. Mohammed was a meccan warlord who tried to introduce a political doctrine blended with monotheistic flavor and pagan rituals.

D. Mohammed has been adopted and used by the both Umaids and Abbasids with necessary adjustments fit to each of their political motivation.

Now, Can you refute this using only quran??

Mr Wahid is studiously avoiding quranic verses Ali sina raise that support hadiths.

Why ?

Verse Quran-33:26 is saying about banu nadir

33:26. And those of the people of the Scripture who backed them (the disbelievers) Allâh brought them down from their forts and cast terror into their hearts, (so that) a group (of them) you killed, and a group (of them) you made captives.

Killed and taken captive.How can u deny this??

Sex with captives is also allowed in quran (23:6)...now, how can u deny hadiths about raping captives?

I urge all those who wish to comment to please maintain the decorum and the respect my opponents deserve. I do not debate with just anyone. People with whom I debate are respectable people and have to be respected in this forum as well even if we may disagree. I do not practice censorship but please observe the decorum,

Dr. Wahid doesn't look a muslim. He is pretending to be a muslim.
He doesn't seem to believe the most beautiful things our belovee prophet asked his followers to practice and he himself practiced:
thighing of pre-pubescent girls
wife beating
clandestine screwing of servant of wife
screwing slave girls (servant girls in the current times)
screwing kaffir women
killing kaffirs and take their women as screwing machines
Dr. Wahid is really confused. Why does he bother about hadiths; Many of these things are recorded in Quran, just practice it!

As so many believers Prof. Wahid does not seem only interested in pursuing the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Instead he has a faith he already had from childhood and loves. In which he and many of his readers have invested a big part of their lives in, through which they are loyal to their family, friends, mosque-community, people. As they are expected, indeed sometimes obliged to be. And while they may be very rational people, they cannot afford to doubt that faith one bit. Naturally they feel hurt when that faith is maligned (real or imagined). Or so it seems to me.

Consider the alternative position. There are also those who do not have some absolute, unmovable faith, only "theories", ideas". They are not hurt when these theories-ideas are maligned, but sometimes able to replace them by better ones. Or change some aspect of them. Their loved ones, friends, communities require not much obligation to believe in theories/ ideas, allow them to develop their thinking much freeer.

Of course people can choose Islam or Christianity or whatever faith, it need not be false a priori. But shouldn't they do so with the intention of choosing and retaining the best, truest, of theories-ideas that are available, in their own view? Instead of their motivation being loyalty to their loved ones, community?

“What makes you think that a hadith selected by you applying your commonsense had originated from Prophet Muhammad and the one rejected by you had not originated from Prophet Muhammad?”
Excellent question sir. I appreciate your point. Even though Muhammad is a mere mortal(as Quran says at many places), you want to be doubly sure that the hadith originated from Prophet Muhammad. Fair enough. Then how much more careful one has to be before attributing the Quran/anything for that matter to Almighty God? The criteria you have to apply or the scrutiny you have to undertake should be much more exacting. You have to apply more stringent scrutiny before you conclude that Quran originated from the Almighty and Muhammad was his Messenger. Is the Quran signed and certified by Allah? Is it signed and certified by Muhammad at least?

I cannot attribute a random printed document that I come across on the road to Mr. P.A. Wahid. Before I attribute some written matter to Mr. Wahid, I should be sure that:
(a)It is signed by him; or
(b)He owns it up saying “Yes, this is what I have written”or
(c)It is from his website, or
(d)I myself heard him saying it.
If this be so, how can I attribute any random writings to Almighty Allah without such evidence as above? I need more exacting evidence in fact.

"only those hadiths which are consistent with the Quran are to be deemed authentic because Prophet lived in accordance with the Quran."
“Abu Hurairah, may Allah be pleased with him, reported:
Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said: Ibrahim, the Prophet (peace be upon him) never told a lie except on three occasions: two times for the sake of Allah (for example, his words): I am sick and his words: Nay, this one, the biggest of them (idols) did it and because of Sarah (his wife)…”
http://hadith.al-islam.com/Bayan/Display.asp?Lang=eng&ID=1361
The above Hadith is consistent with the Quran.-See Quran 37:89, 21:58 and 37:93

So, ACCORDING TO WAHID, THE ABOVE HADTH IS AUTHENTIC AS IT IS CONSISTENT WITH QURAN. SO, PROPHET

So, ACCORDING TO WAHID, THE ABOVE HADTH IS AUTHENTIC AS IT IS CONSISTENT WITH QURAN. SO, IF PROPHET ABRAHAM IS A LIAR, THEN ISLAM IS A FALSE DOCTRINE.

A typical moslem has one leg ( not literally though I would want it to be) on qrand and one leg on hadiths, Has one sword in hand and the other hand free to molest and steal, sticks diks in all sorts of places and has noi brains what so ever.Let us investigate this baboon from kerala a littel bit more.he will be a closet communistin close touch with jihadis.That completes a typical moslem picture a wife beating, child molesting, infant thighing, mohammad believing monster who is a danger to any society that allows them to come in.

"“only those hadiths which are consistent with the Quran are to be deemed authentic because Prophet lived in accordance with the Quran.”-PA Wahid says this.

pLEASE r efer the Hadith at the following link which says taht Abraham lied twice for the sake of Allah
http://hadith.al-islam.com/Bayan/Display.asp?Lang=eng&ID=1361
The above Hadith is consistent with the Quran.-See Quran 37:89, 21:58 and 37:93

So, if hadith is consistent with Quran, it is authentic. As Prophet Abraham is a liar, Islam is fake. What kind of a religion would advocate "lying for the sake of Allah"?

@Proudkafir
".Let us investigate this baboon from kerala a littel bit more.he will be a closet communistin close touch with jihadis.?
This is in bad taste.

Please be patient. If Ali Sina, MA Khan,Anwar Sheikh, Ibn Warraq, Abul Kasem, Taslima Nasrin, Ehsan Jami,Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Wafa Sultan etc can see the truth about Islam, other muslims also will do so. Pls be patient.

dear friends., let us be civil in responding to dr. Abdul Wahid., he has done such a wonderful work with Q'uran and Science and in basic Soil science itself, he does deserve our respects. We may not agree with his Islam but we should give the credit and respect his work.

Read here

one simple thing that bothers me about dr. Wahid is., he being a scientist himself and publishing 100s papers in peer reviewed journals such as "Nature", I wonder why his findings from Q'uran with reference to Science HAS NOT BEEN PUBLISHED IN A PEER REVIEWED JOURNALS that publish articles on Science Concepts/Methodology and new discoveries..

I am just thinking....... If his followers lied and the hadiths are lies...then allah must have done a lousy job, since the true islam is not yet here and mohammed failed in his job.allah must be very dissapointed in him.....maybe he is burning in hell?

mr. wahid you said

"I am not against hadiths but my point is that only those hadiths which are consistent with the Quran ....Prophet lived in accordance with the Quran"

Quran-33:26- “And He brought those of the People of the Book [Jewish people of Banu Qurayza] who supported them from their fortresses and cast terror into their hearts, some of them you slew (beheaded) and some you took prisoners (captive)”
Quran-33:27- “And He made you heirs of their lands, their houses, and their goods, and of a land which ye had not frequented (before). And Allah has power over all things.” [Merciful Allah asked Prophet Muhammad to confiscate entire properties of surrendered Jews]

above 2 verses clearly show that he murdered and looted, and in line with the hadith, may be its worth to start doubting the quran too sir, unless you belive that your god whos sent down the quran is barbaric and money hungry.

if you can not clear the above verses you must be professor in mind gymnastic field

Ali, you got my vote, i dont think he can come up with any not boring argument.

im looking forward for multi converter challange (hope he'll take up in writting), should be a funny one, and hopefully you can convince him to convert again and woship your god, that is BUGS BUNNY..., Yae What's Up Doc!

that debate really cracking me up, thanks for the pics..:)

#15 Allah is the devil, the greatest deceiver, liar, schemer, planner. Sura 3;54. Can the Dr. Explain thtverse. Why would allah have to lie. Is it because Muhammad is the puppet of Allah/Satan. Who is WE in the Quran. I thought Allah was one with no partners. Islam does believe in hellfire so Prophet Muhammad may be there where he is now with Nabtail, the black DEVIL.

Allah the god with no name.

# 8. Ali Sina Says:
May 24th, 2009 at 8:43 am

I urge all those who wish to comment to please maintain the decorum and the respect my opponents deserve. I do not debate with just anyone. People with whom I debate are respectable people and have to be respected in this forum as well even if we may disagree. I do not practice censorship but please observe the decorum,"

At last Ali Sina has spoken. Yes we need for this forum some "Sharia" kind of law to stop people posting profanity.
Well Sharia may sound Islamic ! How about Ex-Islamic Sharia law?

8. Ali Sina Says:

I urge all those who wish to comment to please maintain the decorum and the respect my opponents deserve. I do not debate with just anyone. People with whom I debate are respectable people and have to be respected in this forum as well even if we may disagree. I do not practice censorship but please observe the decorum,

Dear Ali, I can understand your position on respecting your oponents, but the thing is that people are too angry with Islam and Muslims. This forum is the perhaps the only place where they can vent their anger openly without fear of getting klled. Hence to expect people to maintain decorum would be very difficult.
There might even be some people here who might have suffered direct assaults of Muslims which increases their hatred for Muslims. Its the simple law of physics, every action has an equal and opposite reaction.
Muslims have been terrorising people since the last 1000 years and I feel even the worst abuse heaped on a Muslim, is just not enough of a response in return for the attrocities that Muslims have and still are commiting.

#23 We can all say thanks to Dr. Sina by sending in contributions for providing this means of venting.

Profanity is not needed. Expressions of displeasure is warranted, however, let's try to respect Dr. Sina's appeals to sanity.

# 25. Raisin Head says ;
" Profanity is not needed. Expressions of displeasure is warranted, however, let’s try to respect Dr. Sina’s appeals to sanity."

I don't know , only Ali Sina can confirm if this site needs your kind of " Sanity "??

Surely religion is a complex thing. Here we have our highly esteemed professor but still stuck in a very primitive type of faith trusting in an archaic criminal.

I can easily get along well with muslims ignorant in islam for these have no way of getting the truth due to circumstances, but a Professor? Who has access to the internet 24 hours a day, seven days a week the whole year? Studying an incoherent and book authored by a sick man far less intelligent than he is and trusting it is the word of God? Oh please, I thought we humans are much bigger than that.

People of knowledge in this world should at least stay religionless, if they have yet to find the right religion. I usually debate with my fellow co-religionists about which is a better option, a general belief in God or atheism, if someone has yet to know the truth? My stand or opinion is better someone be an atheist for there are so many cults in this world and they all claim to believe in God and to have truth, islam among them. Of course there is a huge difference between someone being an atheist in a sense of rejecting God altogether and lacking appreciation to the force that created life and the Universe, and being an atheist in the sense that you are just a skeptical and you are still searching the truth. The former is jerky arrogance the latter is cautious study in seeking the right philosophy.

#24 you should be the last person to talk of sanity.

A0000Z
When the heart is full of hatred and pain, its difficult to maintain either sanity or logic or cvility in expression. I have witnessed insanity and barbarity first hard and I know how difficult it is to control your emotions sometimes, though I am not personally in favour of using abusive language to degrade someone.
I feel that someone who is intelligent enough, can degrade his opponent by using very civil words.

well done Mr Ali Sina, a good job of refuting Prof Wahid. kudos to you for advising those people here who cant seem to behave themselves in proper manners. as for Mr Ibrahim, please stop advocating indecencies of some posters here under the pretext of spewing anger and hatred against islam and the respectable professor. islam will be fought by uncovering its despicable teaching one by one, not by expressing unnecessary emotion here. ok my brother in humanity?

actually prof Wahid's thought is in conflict, apparently he cannot determine a direct and clear cut position on the hadith issues here. he attacked the credibility of bukhari while he himself utilize bukhari in his defence of the pillars of islam. a contradictory mind. he knows that deep down inside, he failed to expatiate muhammad from all the allegation against him. all the crimes he was perpetrating justified by the quran. Mr Ali Sina has done a nice psycological evaluation of his opponent beforehand. the logical fallacies are not too uncommon to be applied by muslim as a last bastion of defence. in the end, it shattered to the ground. i am enjoying this debate. hope more coming soon.

Humanity is but one family. :)

# 28. ibrahim;

I think now both of us are talking the same language.
It is easy to hurt some one( who is civil ) with Civil, Logical language yet difficult to hurt an uncouth, uncultured, insensitive dumb fool with all kind of profanity.
Every sensitive intelligent people know: the cultists( Muslims and the Xians) belong to which group.

Has anyone else tried debating Dr. Wahid?

Mr Ali Sina..You are a real idiot..You born in a shia community and you know only the faiths and cultures of Shia..Actualy they are not following prophet Muhammed and his lifestyles in our daily routines..They are giving the majority for Imam Ali or the saints like Ayatholla..Prophet Muhammed is too long distanced from its faiths..

I feels this as per your thought..Muslims are cruels..pedophils,child abuser,terrorists,murderes etc..Because they are following Muhammed ..Why the christians and Jews are not doing this activities...??According your all statements,Christians are saints..Christians are came from heaven and they are living for peace and love..They are not making nuclear weapons for destroying human beings..If any muslim country started to make nuclear weapons sure you will say they are muslim terrors..compare now between each muslim and christian countries..now say which religious country is leading for making the nuclear or any kinds other weapons..?Christians are not adopted in any kinds of child abuse..But it is found now commonly in Christian priests..Because some priests are not allowable to marry a woman as per christianic laws.so they are getting the helps of childs and nuns.It is not forbidden..It is holy that doing sex with nuns..Christians are not pedophils but they can do the external sex relationship with his girlfriends..It is allowable in western society..Christians won't be able do the Terrorism..Because American and some European countries(worlds largest weapon producers and seller also this countries are calling as a christian populated country) will save all christian peoples from its enemies with the power of weapons.. And they all are safe with every needs like land and own countries..So terrorism it is not a possible thing for westerners..You are a real foolish..You trying to hide all facts verry smartly and saying Islam is a religion of cruels..

You producing some false hadith evidents for claiming this is done by Muhammed...Is Arabians are foolish for convert to Islam from christian and Jewish communities..?Arabians and some middle easterners are also witnessed his lifestyles.He also called as Al ameen( the good personality)from his enemies also..So this peoples are ready to become muslim from some pagan religions like christianity,judaism and moon and idol worshippers.Now this 21 st century how much christian and Jewish citizens we can see in this Arab communities..I hope upto 95% of whole Arab peoples converted to Islam from Jewish and Christian religions..They all are prooved Islam is only right religion than other past faiths..

#32 ChristiaNS AND JEWS NEED THE NUCLEAR BOMBS TO KEEP MUSLIM
FROM KILLING US FOR ALLAH! yOU KNOW ALLAH SAID KILL US AND YOU ALL ARE TRYING TO KILL JEWS AND CHRISTIANS RIGHT NOW,. The christians and Jews are leaving the Middle East as soon as they can. tHEN YOU mUSLIMS FOLLOW THEM. Why cant you stay home. Christian are not all good but at least they say so. Christians never said sex with a baby is good. Christians never said killing non-christians is good. The Bible neve said do it for god. Quran said kill and behead all non-Muslims. What if the Bible said kill all Muslims or all Muslims are fools. Is that right?

habib ya habibie says:

“Is Arabians are foolish for convert to Islam from christian and Jewish communities..?Arabians and some middle easterners are also witnessed his lifestyles.He also called as Al ameen( the good personality)from his enemies also…………...Now this 21 st century ......I hope upto 95% of whole Arab peoples converted to Islam from Jewish and Christian religions..They all are prooved Islam is only right religion than other past faiths”

The foolish Arabian are scared of prosecution and paying jizz, you fool…, of course these fool people witness his cruel lifestyle, by facing ka’bah when prayer you are worshiping idol too, why can't your god be everywhere and see what your doing.

Will you guarantee my safety if I pray(other than islam) on Saudi barabaria street, when islam said to be tolerant religion, you nothing but bunch of hypocrite.

I hope they find 95% of alternative energy to replace oil, so the westerner don’t have to be political correct, and proofed islam is right religion for desert lifestyle, not in civilised society

#32
Mr. Habidith,

First of all, I could hardly understand your comment. I am not a native english speaker too, but why don'tyou try to an automic translator in the internet,there are so many!

You said:" Mr Ali Sina......You born in a shia community and you know only the faiths and cultures of Shia..Actualy they are not following prophet Muhammed and his lifestyles in our ( I didn't get it-should it be THEIR ) daily routines...."
I guess you're not a shia MUST-APE, maybe you ape the SINna of the Pervert too.

" I feels this as per your thought..Muslims are cruels..pedophils,child abuser,terrorists,murderes etc..Because they are following Muhammed ..Why the christians and Jews are not doing this activities…??" -Because they don't follow neither the rapist paedophile pervert Profit$$$ nor allah the moon god!
Don't you know the holy Charade? There's noSatan but allah and MonkeyMAD is his Profit$$$$!

"They are not making nuclear weapons for destroying human beings..If any muslim country started to make nuclear weapons sure you will say they are muslim terrors"- Don't Iran and Pigstan ring a bell to you?

".Christians are not pedophils but they can do the external sex relationship with his girlfriends..It is allowable in western society.." - I think you are envious of not being allowed to get laid with your girlfriend.

"You trying to hide all facts verry smartly and saying Islam is a religion of cruels.."- Facts speak for themselves.

"You producing some false hadith evidents for claiming this is done by Muhammed…Is Arabians are foolish for convert to Islam from christian and Jewish communities..?"-Why don'tyou prove your argument of falsehood from hadiths?

"He also called as Al ameen( the good personality)from his enemies also"-Prove your statement, mon habib MUST-APE.

"I hope upto 95% of whole Arab peoples converted to Islam from Jewish and Christian religions."- Instead of 'hope',I guess you meant 'guess', and you can see for yourself,based in history,that these dhimii were hunted down, humiliated (Q-RANDYic prescribtion), and driven to almost extinction.

habib wrote:

I feels this as per your thought..Muslims are cruels..pedophils,child abuser,terrorists,murderes etc..Because they are following Muhammed ..Why the christians and Jews are not doing this activities…??According your all statements,Christians are saints..Christians are came from heaven and they are living for peace and love..They are not making nuclear weapons for destroying human beings..If any muslim country started to make nuclear weapons sure you will say they are muslim terrors..

That's because Muslim countries are runned by dictators who want to destroy the free world. In regards to Western nations creating nuclear weapons, we created these weapons to protect ourselves.

compare now between each muslim and christian countries..now say which religious country is leading for making the nuclear or any kinds other weapons..?Christians are not adopted in any kinds of child abuse..But it is found now commonly in Christian priests..Because some priests are not allowable to marry a woman as per christianic laws.

The correlation between celibacy and child abuse has no logic. When a person is arrested for pedophilia do we try to marry the person off? No we through him/her in jail. Besides the Catholic Church does not represent the entire Christian body as there are many church denominations in the world, nor is pedophilia seen as something good in the Christian world.

so they are getting the helps of childs and nuns.It is not forbidden..It is holy that doing sex with nuns..

According to who? Give us numbers and statistics.

Christians are not pedophils but they can do the external sex relationship with his girlfriends..It is allowable in western society..

How does this make Christians pedophiles? They are having sex with consenting adults.

Mr Habib, you are engaging in what can be intepreted as Tu quoe logical fallacy. just because the christians are doing certain evil things does not exempt islam from its evil doctrine. muhammad allowed his sahaba to engage in unlimited sex with female prisoner of wars. please refer to the hadith about the raid made to Bani Mustaliq where the sahaba resort to his advice on how to have sexual intercourse with the captured female prisoner of wars without impregnating them OUTSIDE THE FOLD OF MARRIAGE. please Mr Habib, this is substantiated by the Suraah Al Mu'minuun: "allazinahum alafurujihim hafizun illa a'laa azwaajihim AW MAA MALAKAT AYMAANUHUM fainnahum ghairu maluumin. ". can Mr Habib with all due respect translate the verse in capital letter and share to the whole world its 'holy' meaning? did the great ancient Persian civilization attacked the muslims or vice versa? the muslims sent threatening letters to all the sovereign of surrounding areas and if they refused, they combat them. how much life were lost in the battle of Qadisiyya and the subsequent battle in the Sindh province in Hindustan? Mr Habib, as an ex muslim, i know the inside out of your mentality. i used to possessed this biased approach pal.

it is true that the western nations were the one who discovered atomic and nuclear energy, but you forgot to mention the benefit of the energy in medical field and generating electricity. you merely care to manipulate the disadvantages part and conveniently skip the advantages aspects. do you mean that all nations should stop invest in military strength for the sake of peace of the world? what a twist of logic. tell this to saddam hussein who eliminate the kurdish resistance through bombing of innocent civilians. if that bigot had a nuclear weapon, he is sure to pull the trigger. so, stop pointing finger to this or that persons to save your own collapsing faith.

Humanity is but one family. :)

habib said #32

"According your all statements,Christians are saints..Christians are came from heaven and they are living for peace and love.."

habib ya habibie, ask ibrahim and proudkafir what christian like, may be you like this site, this site talking bad about cristian too.
And hopefully you stay long enough here, and see it from different angle, that is freedom and rational, logic angle that your allah is crazy and not worth worshiping

How can Christians come from heaven when they are converts. Most black converts come from jail. The lastest four or five caught in NYC trying to start a race war by blowing up synagoues. Jews didnt try to blow up a mosque but Muslims tried to kill Jews. The race war has begun as planned by Islam. Maybe the elite will become more sensical and take their heads out of the sand. Islam is pure evil and has never had peace. NEVER! Americans are buying gun enmass because of the coming war with Islam. They attacked us and then pretend we caused it. That is old. The Quran says in plain sight, allah is the devil sura 3:54. He deceived EVE and is called the deceiver in the Bible written over 2000 yrs before mo was born.

Ali Sina,

Your patience is amazing, all Prof Wahid presents are either circular arguments or he "begs the question," in the formal sense of the term, of course believers have no other methods avaliable to them. The Quran is nothing more than the collected,self-serving fantasies of primitive tribesmen.

Fadal habibie.
Looks like you just started taking your baby momeen steps on this site. Dont worry.Keep coming back even if it's to curse Ali Sina.The more you curse him the better, as It gives us all kafirs an insight in to the mentally deranged activities of a momeen.Sooner or later you will be stuck to this site.It will open your eyes about all the evil mohammed did and the followers of mohamma d are doing.A soon as you recognise that you will be an apostate.At that time we shall welcome you to humanity.Right now be a momeen and start the Alisina show and we shall enjoy your rantings. remember this site is one way street.You can not go revert back to being a pious and good evil moslem!

I don't know if this Wahid guy can be called a Professor as he claims-- as he is cherry picking verses from Qu'rand and Hadith just for the argument sake. To impress gullible Muslim readers ( if at all they are there to read) same as Jerk off Zakir Naik does.

We don't know the authenticity of this debate ; where Ali Sina is debating with a Muslim scholar . No real scholar can be called a Muslim or a Xian: is a fact , as they are believers of some myth only. Not knowledgeable intelligent human beings.

I have my own doubts about Ali Sina, who sounds more like a cheap logician talking about religion or should I say against religion ( without any real experience of spirituality, just as any cheap politician)same as the people he is debating with. Talking about Narcissistic personality ? I think Ali Sina is suffering from " Narcissistic personality disorder " same as MoHamMad or Obama ( according to Ali Sina and I agree with him on that).

# 8. Ali Sina Says:

""--. I do not debate with just anyone. People with whom I debate are respectable people and have to be respected in this forum--""

Proves my statement that Ali Sina also is suffering from " ” Narcissistic personality disorder ”

Hi Ali Sina ; you may ban me from this site if you like to.

1. Raja Says:

May 24th, 2009 at 6:56 am
Wahid seems to be a Bihar University Graduate.
Mr.Raja,
what do u mena by saying it?
i am a BIHARI and i challange u for a debate if u think BIHARIS r lack in intelligence.
further i wuld like to inform Mr.sina that plz take care of such persons who r trying to give this FORUM, this PLATEFORM a different colour.

Thanks for all comments about my topics..
So your peoples can make Nuclear bombs..for energy or weapon it is not matter..Just see they are not using this for human destroying..Am I right..So why not for Muslim peoples..???
Bible saying Jesus will come back and kill anti-Christ...How he going to kill himm...???Is with kisses or hugs..???If he killed anti christ,so why he not a terrorist or atleast a killer as per your peoples mentioned about muhammed... Then your peoples will say he will kill him for peace and judjement..See the Hindu scriptures,god Ram is a well trained shooter.He killed Ravan and his peoples for escaping his wife from his custody.After this war he doubted against her virginity.See the god Krishna.He killed his own uncle and his soldiers.He also married thousands of wives.According your christian faith,Is these peoples are terrors or war lovers..???
As per Biblical evidents Mosess and god Yehwa throwed all non believers sucha as Pharoa Ramsess and his soldiers into Sea and Killed..Mosess also participant for this cruelty..Thousands of peoples killed.,So why not called Mosess or Yehwa is a terror...???Why god is not a Terrorist according Biblical peace and love evidences..??? Why your peoples not calling Jesus,Mosess,Ram and Krishna are not killers…?Why not your peoples saying that the
book of these gods or prophets not promoting the killing of humans.As per your language they all are saints.Because they are not representing Muhammed or Islam…We muslims not the enemy of christians.Why they became enemy.Because christians are the only one supporter of Jew and its zionist terrorism.Christians are trying to destroy all muslims from the world with the help of Zionists..It is not started today or yesterday…We can see this works of Christian terrorist allies in the beginning of Islam..They are tried well much to kill Muhammed and his followers..But god escaped him from this terrorist allies verry carefully like how mosses escaped from Pharoa…

This all statements prooving verry clearly that god likes the destroy of non believers..
Wheather you read the Quraan,,,???Never..You know only some false hadiths which is created by Ali sina nd some Idiot scolars...We never believing hadith is not a source from holy..it is not holy and it is not the words of god. It is just like a bible..Because bible had no father.Bible It is born by several fathers...Hadith is also like this..But holy Quraan had only a father..That is allmighty Allah..So we calling it is a holy book..But Bible..???It is performed as a holy themself by 12 apostles..Whether Jesus read this bible..??never,,Is Jesus well knowledged about its contents..??never.. Is Jesus asked to his friends for write a holy book...???never..Sure In the day of judgement Jesus will ask the Questions to every christian brothers and sisters about the ingredients of Bible and he will study from these peoples just like a LKG student.Because he don't know nothing about Bible..Thats all.... As per all available evidents,Jesus never said to Israelites I am going to die by Jewish kingdom and After my death my 12 apostles will save each peoples.After my death I will resurrect to heaven then these apostles will be wrote a book named Bible..So peoples must belive this book is from god.Peoples must believe my blood will be remove all human sins..
Challenge is to everyone:
In Quraan where Allah asking for Killing non muslims ..??But Allah asking for invite all nonbelievers to Islam..
In Quraan where Allah promoting terrorism ?But Allah asking to love all peoples like your brothers and sisters..
In Quraan where Allah asking to believers for child abuse and pedophilism..?But Allah asking to prevent the prostitution and external sex relation ship..

About pedophilism..Read this articles carefully

"Pedophile: also spelled PAEDOPHILIA, psychosexual disorder in which an adult's arousal and sexual gratification occur primarily through sexual contact with prepubescent children. The typical paedophile is unable to find satisfaction in an adult sexual relationship and may have low self-esteem, seeing sexual activity with a child as less threatening than that with an adult." Encyclopaedia Britannica, 1998.

"pe.do.phil.ia n [NL] (1906): sexual perversion in which children are the preferred sexual object -- pe.do.phil.i.ac or pe.do.phil.ic adj." Merriam Webster's Collegiate Dictionary.

The diagnostic criteria for paedophilia according to American Psychiatric Association:

Over a period of at least 6 months, recurrent intense sexual urges and sexual arousing fantasies involving sexual activity with a prepubescent child or children.
The person has acted on these urges, or is markedly distressed by them.
The person is at least 16 years old and at least 5 years older than the child or children in

Is Muhammed and his believers adopted with this activities….???

Yes you saying christian and jewish countries making the nuclear weapons for the self defence from the attack of muslim terrors.So Musims how can defend with its enemies..Jews
can kill palestinians.US and UK can kill Iraqi,Afghani muslims..So how muslims defend themselves..Jews are trying to destroy whole muslims from the middle east with the help of US and UK allies.So some muslim counries deciding to start the nuclear plants for its self defence.
Iran also took the same decision.Otherwise they will wipe all muslims from the world..It is a advanced decision by Nejad..So the christians are now started to say that
Iran is the muslim terrorist country..See how cruel christianic monopoly….So why not this lol peoples saying US and Israel are the terrorist countries.In search of every country
we can see this Christian monopoly in each sector...Only Muslims are not allowed to do this all activities.And dont say whole hadiths are wrote only by muslims…It is right some authors of hadiths had the name of muslims.With his muslim name they not became a real muslim.Some enemies of muhammed also wrote some history about him.How we can say it is from the source of true or false..??Hadith is not holy.Hadith and bible are same as per its structures.Somebody wrote something about somebody.That is bible and hadith. how it became holy.How we can say both books are holy or its ingredients are right.But see the holy Quran.Quran had only one father.That is Allah the allmighty..So why we believing this fatherless Bible...Why Jesus not waited for the completion of his book.Why he carry his death himself before completing his own duty.See the history of past prophets.All are successfully completed the duty from god.They all prophets are witnessed for his own books and its creation..Only Jesus not waited for the completion of his own book..These all prophets took the victory against the enemies of god verry successfully.Only the Jesus failed to complete the duty from god.

I didn’t understand why this Christians are co working with this enemies of Jesus Christ…
Bible saying Jesus died by Jewish kingdom..Jews are still believing they killed him for discredts his prophecy..At his prophecy periods Jews called that he is a bastard and Mary is a bitch.Did your peoples agree with this faiths of Jews...??They always saying he is not a son of god or atleast a prophet..They are claimed that he is a false prophet from his sad death…So why this peoples still respecting this Zionist terrors…???Yes they need to kill the whole Muslims by the name of Jews..Otherwise the land of Jesus will be call as a muslim country in future..But it is early...Palestine state is under progress..The capital will be the Jerusalem old city...wait may be for maximum 10 years...

See bothers and sisters,no one born as a terror…Your peoples like Christians and Jews giving the birth of each terrors through this ugly websites or monopoly kingdoms…Now only Jesus can make this
world with peace and love from this monopoly kingdoms…we waiting for his second coming…

Only crying children will get the milk…Otherwise we will die with hunger…